Jack Wilshere

[1989]

If Wilshere was playing under Mourinho, Fergie, Guardiola or Klopp can you seem him being anything other than world class?

[Yankee_Gooner_Dandee]

no, joe hart is the most over rated. jack is a good player and hes got the drive and passion.

[goonersid]

Understand and to an extent agree with the general theme (just about every Sky pundit listed him as their 'one to watch' from all clubs this season and I've seen some describe him as world class) but plain average is well wide of the mark imo.

The likes of Lampard and Gerrard were hardly world class players at 21 - and Wilshere missed a whole season through injury. Hopefully he'll have a breakthrough season with goalscoring like Fabregas did in 2007/08 but it's not unreasonable to expect considerable improvements in the next few years.

Also without wishing to turn this into an anti-Wenger thread (yet ) we're not going to see the best of him whilst he's constantly plugging away in congested midfields with no movement in front of him. In my view his real asset is his ability to skip past players and create holes/space and if he was to play in a 4-4-2 with two strikers who could exploit that and give him an option to slip them in he'd be far better for it. As it is Wenger doesn't know how to get the best out of him and his tactical role is just to be lively and energetic so although he's a good player he doesn't really deliver that much attacking or defensively.

Who said anything about Gerrard or Lampard being world class, nut they were both better players at 21 than Willshire, and I'm sick of hearing excuses about him missing a whole season, the fact is he was shite all last season and I saw nothing yesterday to suggest he won't be shite again this season.

[SCREAM AIM FIRE]

Anyone would think over rating english players was a new thing? they're all built up to be these amazing footballers when in reality they're just average...

[afcforever]

Is this an Irish wind the English up thread?

[goonersid]

Jack is different class, cant believe anyone could say different.

Explain and give examples where he showed "class"

He shows class every time hes on the pitch
Never had. a great game yesterday, but wasn't poor.
England will build the team around him.

Fair enough I bow to your clever arguement

[QuartzGooner]

There is no scientific definition of "world class", but I would put Lampard in that category.
A consistent hard working player who gets the goals from midfield and keeps a cool head on the pitch, yes he is now in the final part of his career, but I think that any team in the world would have wanted him had he been up for sale 2009 - 2011.

Wilshere has what it takes to get to that level, if he can fully recover from injury and keep a lid on his temper.

[SteveO 35]

Nonsense. How about Rooney? Last time he delivered anything decent in an England shirt was at Euro 2004. No doubt (if we make it) he'll be built up to be our "world class player" and "matchwinner" for next year's World Cup and go on to deliver the same impact he's had at every international tournament since 2004 i.e. absolutely fucking none

I couldn't give a fuck about what either of them do for England, I take it you are gloating about his performance in a friendly against Brazil.
He was shite yesterday just as he was all last season, Rooney came on as sub for utd and set up 2 goals, to compare the 2 in the same breath is nonsense, but coming from someone who thinks Diaby is a good player I rest my case

I couldn't give a flying either and I didn't even watch the Brazil friendly......but your thread is entitled the most over rated player in English football......and they become over rated when they have 1 decent match for Ing-er-lund. Since 2004 the whole English media has licked Rooney's ass. He's a good player....perhaps very good and certainly 1000x better than anything we've got resembling a striker.......but at every Euros and World Cup he gets listed alongside all the world's top players and at the very top table he hasn't delivered

And I'd rather have Abou any day

[officepest]

He is a very tallented young player who has had ridiculous injury problems and is clearly nowhere near fully recovered.

I do agree he isn't the second coming of Gascoigne but he is playing in a shit team and has been elevated to key player status by virtue of our club selling off the crown jewels at every opportunity.

He has been run into the ground by Wenger and tries to do far too much, plus his temprement is increasingly suspect. If we had a manager with half a brain we would see more end product, of this I'm sure.

[Ed Hunter The Gooner]

I think that this is about his POTENTIAL and not so much how good he is right now. I mean, he was away for a long time because of injury too. He has huge potential to be a world class midfielder if coached carefully right way and playing him at roles that suits him the best.

Now the problem is that there is way too much expectations on him. People expect way too much from him. You know all the stories from last season how he's the leader of our group, how he's certainly a future leader of Team England and how good and superb he is. I think he is way too young to carry all this by himself. I think he has too much mental weight on him, especially now when the whole club is in middle of the crisis. And it was basically the same last season. It's easy to see from his play as he tries to win games sometimes alone by running the ball into the net from the midfield.

Wilshere should be maturing in some team alongside somebody who is absolutely world class or experienced enough. This is absolutely wrong that our team put him into this situation.

[Henry Norris 1913]

I think this is a terrible kneejerk thread

[SteveO 35]

I think this is a terrible kneejerk thread

Yep, lets attack our best player when everything else is ten times worse

[officepest]

I think this is a terrible kneejerk thread

Yep, lets attack our best player when everything else is ten times worse

To be honest I can't see the point in lambasting any of them anymore. They were all brought in by one man and if they're not good enough (you all know who they are) then the blame lies at the feet of one man.

[northbank123]

Understand and to an extent agree with the general theme (just about every Sky pundit listed him as their 'one to watch' from all clubs this season and I've seen some describe him as world class) but plain average is well wide of the mark imo.

The likes of Lampard and Gerrard were hardly world class players at 21 - and Wilshere missed a whole season through injury. Hopefully he'll have a breakthrough season with goalscoring like Fabregas did in 2007/08 but it's not unreasonable to expect considerable improvements in the next few years.

Also without wishing to turn this into an anti-Wenger thread (yet ) we're not going to see the best of him whilst he's constantly plugging away in congested midfields with no movement in front of him. In my view his real asset is his ability to skip past players and create holes/space and if he was to play in a 4-4-2 with two strikers who could exploit that and give him an option to slip them in he'd be far better for it. As it is Wenger doesn't know how to get the best out of him and his tactical role is just to be lively and energetic so although he's a good player he doesn't really deliver that much attacking or defensively.

He skips past the first two but then wants to take on 3,4 and 5.

Being able to easily skip past two players in the middle of the park is a phenomenal asset. There are aspects of his game that he needs to improve but we need to do more to get the best out of him. Define his role properly and give him a quality striker to play with so that when he does skip past two players he has options - instead of looking up to see if he can slip anybody in and seeing Giroud standing around.

Sid - The "world class" bit wasn't important and I don't want to get bogged down in that debate. You've complained that he doesn't turn games etc and compared him unfavourably to Gerrard and Lampard but it's not like they were bossing games every week at 21 either.

[Jonny_Gooner]

As has already been pointed out the lad is only 21 and only recently came back from serious injury troubles. No one with any common sense would say that he is 'world class' at this time, but he certainly has the potential to become a top class player, with the correct coaching.

Currently he is one of the few positives amongst almost constant negativity. At the very least he shows fantastic spirit and a true love of the Arsenal, and isn't that something we all ask for from this squad??

The same people saying that he isn't very good now would probably be the same people that would complain if we sold him to a rival, with a decent manager, and then have to watch as he is developed into an actual world class midfielder!