Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
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GoonerMuzz
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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby GoonerMuzz » Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:43 am

0-0 away at Goodison even against a poor Everton is not to be sniffed at with our current form and players, some fans need to get down off their high horses and smell the roses, we have been dire for 3 months and this was exactly the result we needed here, not perfect but better than other away performances recently. Bare in mind a lot of people were predicting a good kicking up there, yes Everton were off the pace but we were also better.

I've said it before and i'll say it again i have no problem going back to dire old 1-0 to the Arsenal if it means a steadier ship and a chance to begin to rebuild. We do not have a late GG era or early AW team, we dont even have a 2008 Wenger team, we have an awful team right now and they need to rebuild confidence and teamwork above all else, if it takes baby steps so be it.

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Ray C
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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby Ray C » Sun Dec 22, 2019 6:35 am

One more point towards safety !!. We will miss Chambers away at Yawnnmouth. :barscarf: :barscarf:

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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby BFG4 » Sun Dec 22, 2019 9:52 am

Much better performance defensively yesterday. I thought Chambers in particular was excellent and threw himself at everything. One player that really pissed me off was Aubameyang, he is a great goalscorer but has fuck all work rate and outside of his goals, adds fuck all else to the team. Overall though much better performance and nice to see the majority of the team put in a shift for once.
On a side-note, the AFTV protest was embarrassing. You don't have to like the channel by any means but imagine during the time when the club is at it's lowest ebb, you think a fan channel is the problem. These same people don't organise protests against Stan, the board, criminally high ticket prices - no it's Ty, Claude and DT that are the problem :roll:

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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby Clash » Sun Dec 22, 2019 11:48 am

Much better performance defensively yesterday. I thought Chambers in particular was excellent and threw himself at everything. One player that really pissed me off was Aubameyang, he is a great goalscorer but has fuck all work rate and outside of his goals, adds fuck all else to the team. Overall though much better performance and nice to see the majority of the team put in a shift for once.
On a side-note, the AFTV protest was embarrassing. You don't have to like the channel by any means but imagine during the time when the club is at it's lowest ebb, you think a fan channel is the problem. These same people don't organise protests against Stan, the board, criminally high ticket prices - no it's Ty, Claude and DT that are the problem :roll:
I don’t know the full story but I’m told Robbie Lyle went on TalkSport recently and put that prick Simon Jordan firmly in his place after Jordan was saying fan channels should be banned. Not sure why he wants them shut down but maybe because he thinks that it’s his job to and TalkShite’s job to create controversy and be toxic. And that only they’re allowed to hear the voice of real fans :roll:

So maybe there is something more sinister behind this? Do scabby mainstream stations like TalkSport feel threatened by the growing popularity of fan channels? AFTV being the biggest one I believe.

A classic way of dealing with opposition is first you belittle them, then you demonise them, then you threaten them or infiltrate them. Arsenal fans suddenly starting up anti-AFTV sings just 2-3 weeks after Robbie was on TS (when they could have done it ages ago) seems very suspicious to me. And surely too much of a coincidence? It just doesn’t seem natural to have a go at something that is relatively harmless when there’s so many other more damaging people to target right now.

I’m not a big fan of AFTV myself so I don’t watch it ... but I accept that in many ways it is just a modern equivalent of the fanzine movement, where fans started writing for other fans instead of being spoon fed by clubs and TV. We’re all sick of punditry and smug journalists telling us what’s what like they’re the authority. An alternative was inevitable so to some extent there is a place for fan channels and I do like Robbie Lyle. Good luck to him if he makes money, none of the pundits work for free do they? And when I’ve seen him speak to ex-players he is pretty good at it.

Have to say I’m not keen on some of the others though and think the mistake AFTV has made IMO is creating mini-celebrities who have become parodies of themselves. That’s the embarrassing part. Troopz FFS :roll: But they do go to every game and I respect that even though I’d rather see different fans speak instead of the same ones all the time.
Last edited by Clash on Sun Dec 22, 2019 11:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby Jock Gooner » Sun Dec 22, 2019 11:48 am

I think the travelling fans were well within their rights to give AFTV a hard time, it's happened at home a couple of times too. Whether you agree with what they say or not is irrelevant as they are a fu.cking embarrassment to other supporters and the club. We have enough shit to deal with at the moment and their little sideshow distraction serves no positive purpose. Half the problem is that they are doing interviews immediately after a match when fans can't control their anger with what they've just witnessed.....or can't believe the bollox that Ty is coming away with. That gets posted on youtube for the world to see and you wonder how we've managed to attain a reputation of toxic self entitled cu.nts :rubchin: :roll:

I've just read your post Clash - the thing with the Gooner and One Nil when they started is they were written and therefore a degree of thought and reflection featured whereas the reaction after a match can be far from that when you are livid with the likes of Xhaka or Ozil.

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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby Redarmy » Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:13 pm

Much better performance defensively yesterday. I thought Chambers in particular was excellent and threw himself at everything. One player that really pissed me off was Aubameyang, he is a great goalscorer but has fuck all work rate and outside of his goals, adds fuck all else to the team. Overall though much better performance and nice to see the majority of the team put in a shift for once.
On a side-note, the AFTV protest was embarrassing. You don't have to like the channel by any means but imagine during the time when the club is at it's lowest ebb, you think a fan channel is the problem. These same people don't organise protests against Stan, the board, criminally high ticket prices - no it's Ty, Claude and DT that are the problem :roll:
I don’t know the full story but I’m told Robbie Lyle went on TalkSport recently and put that prick Simon Jordan firmly in his place after Jordan was saying fan channels should be banned. Not sure why he wants them shut down but maybe because he thinks that it’s his job to and TalkShite’s job to create controversy and be toxic. And that only they’re allowed to hear the voice of real fans :roll:

So maybe there is something more sinister behind this? Do scabby mainstream stations like TalkSport feel threatened by the growing popularity of fan channels? AFTV being the biggest one I believe.

A classic way of dealing with opposition is first you belittle them, then you demonise them, then you threaten them or infiltrate them. Arsenal fans suddenly starting up anti-AFTV sings just 2-3 weeks after Robbie was on TS (when they could have done it ages ago) seems very suspicious to me. And surely too much of a coincidence? It just doesn’t seem natural to have a go at something that is relatively harmless when there’s so many other more damaging people to target right now.

I’m not a big fan of AFTV myself so I don’t watch it ... but I accept that in many ways it is just a modern equivalent of the fanzine movement, where fans started writing for other fans instead of being spoon fed by clubs and TV. We’re all sick of punditry and smug journalists telling us what’s what like they’re the authority. An alternative was inevitable so to some extent there is a place for fan channels and I do like Robbie Lyle. Good luck to him if he makes money, none of the pundits work for free do they? And when I’ve seen him speak to ex-players he is pretty good at it.

Have to say I’m not keen on some of the others though and think the mistake AFTV has made IMO is creating mini-celebrities who have become parodies of themselves. That’s the embarrassing part. Troopz FFS :roll: But they do go to every game and I respect that even though I’d rather see different fans speak instead of the same ones all the time.
Last edited by Redarmy on Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby Redarmy » Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:16 pm

Much better performance defensively yesterday. I thought Chambers in particular was excellent and threw himself at everything. One player that really pissed me off was Aubameyang, he is a great goalscorer but has fuck all work rate and outside of his goals, adds fuck all else to the team. Overall though much better performance and nice to see the majority of the team put in a shift for once.
On a side-note, the AFTV protest was embarrassing. You don't have to like the channel by any means but imagine during the time when the club is at it's lowest ebb, you think a fan channel is the problem. These same people don't organise protests against Stan, the board, criminally high ticket prices - no it's Ty, Claude and DT that are the problem :roll:
I don’t know the full story but I’m told Robbie Lyle went on TalkSport recently and put that prick Simon Jordan firmly in his place after Jordan was saying fan channels should be banned. Not sure why he wants them shut down but maybe because he thinks that it’s his job to and TalkShite’s job to create controversy and be toxic. And that only they’re allowed to hear the voice of real fans :roll:

So maybe there is something more sinister behind this? Do scabby mainstream stations like TalkSport feel threatened by the growing popularity of fan channels? AFTV being the biggest one I believe.

A classic way of dealing with opposition is first you belittle them, then you demonise them, then you threaten them or infiltrate them. Arsenal fans suddenly starting up anti-AFTV sings just 2-3 weeks after Robbie was on TS (when they could have done it ages ago) seems very suspicious to me. And surely too much of a coincidence? It just doesn’t seem natural to have a go at something that is relatively harmless when there’s so many other more damaging people to target right now.

I’m not a big fan of AFTV myself so I don’t watch it ... but I accept that in many ways it is just a modern equivalent of the fanzine movement, where fans started writing for other fans instead of being spoon fed by clubs and TV. We’re all sick of punditry and smug journalists telling us what’s what like they’re the authority. An alternative was inevitable so to some extent there is a place for fan channels and I do like Robbie Lyle. Good luck to him if he makes money, none of the pundits work for free do they? And when I’ve seen him speak to ex-players he is pretty good at it.

Have to say I’m not keen on some of the others though and think the mistake AFTV has made IMO is creating mini-celebrities who have become parodies of themselves. That’s the embarrassing part. Troopz FFS :roll: But they do go to every game and I respect that even though I’d rather see different fans speak instead of the same ones all the time.
Agreed, can give a distorted view of our fan base as seems same characters appear evey week, some are almost being exploited to provide entertainment which can leave us as fans open to rididicule and spread negative feelins, that said think there is a place for fan channels.

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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby Clash » Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:18 pm

I think the travelling fans were well within their rights to give AFTV a hard time, it's happened at home a couple of times too. Whether you agree with what they say or not is irrelevant as they are a fu.cking embarrassment to other supporters and the club. We have enough shit to deal with at the moment and their little sideshow distraction serves no positive purpose. Half the problem is that they are doing interviews immediately after a match when fans can't control their anger with what they've just witnessed.....or can't believe the bollox that Ty is coming away with. That gets posted on youtube for the world to see and you wonder how we've managed to attain a reputation of toxic self entitled cu.nts :rubchin: :roll:

I've just read your post Clash - the thing with the Gooner and One Nil when they started is they were written and therefore a degree of thought and reflection featured whereas the reaction after a match can be far from that when you are livid with the likes of Xhaka or Ozil.
Yes that’s a very good point Jock. We’ve all say things during or just after a match that we wouldn’t say when we’ve had time to calm down and putting that on show for everyone around the world to see isn’t good. I know we do the same here to some extent but it’s different appearing on camera outside the ground.

Most people I know that watch AFTV are not Arsenal fans so there is an element of freak show about it all and that’s where the accusations of them needing us to lose to make money starts from. But talk of banning it is especially hypocritical when it comes from people (i.e. TalkSport) who do something very similar and who have a vested interest in seeing it banned.

Personally I choose not to listen to TalkSport or watch AFTV but if (and I’m only speculating) what happened yesterday was somehow orchestrated or encouraged by mainstream outlets of some kind, then it sets a dangerous precedent. If on the other hand it was genuine pissed off Arsenal fans then fair enough. But as others have said, I’d question why AFTV has got to them when other more serious stuff has not.

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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby OneBardGooner » Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:46 pm

Much better performance defensively yesterday. I thought Chambers in particular was excellent and threw himself at everything. One player that really pissed me off was Aubameyang, he is a great goalscorer but has fuck all work rate and outside of his goals, adds fuck all else to the team. Overall though much better performance and nice to see the majority of the team put in a shift for once.
On a side-note, the AFTV protest was embarrassing. You don't have to like the channel by any means but imagine during the time when the club is at it's lowest ebb, you think a fan channel is the problem. These same people don't organise protests against Stan, the board, criminally high ticket prices - no it's Ty, Claude and DT that are the problem :roll:
I don’t know the full story but I’m told Robbie Lyle went on TalkSport recently and put that prick Simon Jordan firmly in his place after Jordan was saying fan channels should be banned. Not sure why he wants them shut down but maybe because he thinks that it’s his job to and TalkShite’s job to create controversy and be toxic. And that only they’re allowed to hear the voice of real fans :roll:

So maybe there is something more sinister behind this? Do scabby mainstream stations like TalkSport feel threatened by the growing popularity of fan channels? AFTV being the biggest one I believe.

A classic way of dealing with opposition is first you belittle them, then you demonise them, then you threaten them or infiltrate them. Arsenal fans suddenly starting up anti-AFTV sings just 2-3 weeks after Robbie was on TS (when they could have done it ages ago) seems very suspicious to me. And surely too much of a coincidence? It just doesn’t seem natural to have a go at something that is relatively harmless when there’s so many other more damaging people to target right now.

I’m not a big fan of AFTV myself so I don’t watch it ... but I accept that in many ways it is just a modern equivalent of the fanzine movement, where fans started writing for other fans instead of being spoon fed by clubs and TV. We’re all sick of punditry and smug journalists telling us what’s what like they’re the authority. An alternative was inevitable so to some extent there is a place for fan channels and I do like Robbie Lyle. Good luck to him if he makes money, none of the pundits work for free do they? And when I’ve seen him speak to ex-players he is pretty good at it.

Have to say I’m not keen on some of the others though and think the mistake AFTV has made IMO is creating mini-celebrities who have become parodies of themselves. That’s the embarrassing part. Troopz FFS :roll: But they do go to every game and I respect that even though I’d rather see different fans speak instead of the same ones all the time.
That's True and not just Simon (batty boy) Jordan, but he also did the same with the fat drunk brazil and jim (It's all about me) white.... Ray Parlour who was guesting on the show embarrassed himself by trying to say that AFTV was only popular because it offered Negative views of Arsenal, which is not true. The Romford Pele is an Arsenal Legand (Player) But isn't the brightest bulb on the xmas tree.

Regardless of what some might think of AFTV, I met Robbie Lyle some years ago before he started the AFTV thing and he is a genuine Gooner, he cares as much as any of us, and he's a nice bloke as well.

What happened yesterday was that about 20 arsenal fans tried to gang up on him and the camera / sound guy when they were outside the Everton ground and tried to stop interviews ...they acted in a totally cowardly fashion (mob rules mentality) and were backed down by some Gooners also some Toffee fans who saw what was going on.

Had they not there is every chance it could / would have escalated into violence and Robbie and the cameraman could have been beaten up and that is wrong..

I sometimes watch AFTV, though most times not.... But when all is said and done they have done a lot to promote Fan Tv / Media - and are far more honest than talkshyte and all the other media whores.

Talkshyte and sly & co are always slagging off the Fan TV stations/Forums (Not just AFTV) But are only too quick to seek their opinions and comments via interviews & telephone calls when or if big news breaks - Like when Unai Emery was sacked.

And as you rightly say Clash they go to all the home and away games just as many of the fans they interview do, we may not agree with what they say, but they spend their time & money regardless of the results and they could do with interviewing a lot more than just the 'regulars', some of whom seem to think they have celebrity status, but ore often than not look like dickheads.

Bottom line for me is that Fans are entitled to express their views and AFTV is one way for that to happen, the media stations Never do that, they invite fans to phone their shows, but it is not unusual for the fan to be 'cut off' and then ridiculed after the call.

Football is a sport but now as we all know it has become BIG business and so the giant media organisations do not like it when the fan channels are competing with them, and why are they able to compete? Because they offer fans a chance to have their say, especially thee week in week out fans, sometimes they get it wrong, but at least they are offering the fans a platform to make their voices heard (Just like on here!) without those opinions being sanitised by Sly/Talkshyte etc

There are some videos on YouTube showing those (so called) Arsenal fans threatening the AFTV crew yesterday and it doesn't look good, also there are some faces I recognised who were trying to do the same to those of us who attended the Wenger Out protests.

Bottom Line: We all should be entitled to Free Speech and to see what happened yesterday reminded me of 2 seasons ago when FrankSav got roughed up and thrown out of the ground in Manchester because he was Protesting / Voicing His Opinion.

:?

Jock Gooner
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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby Jock Gooner » Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:53 pm

I think the travelling fans were well within their rights to give AFTV a hard time, it's happened at home a couple of times too. Whether you agree with what they say or not is irrelevant as they are a fu.cking embarrassment to other supporters and the club. We have enough shit to deal with at the moment and their little sideshow distraction serves no positive purpose. Half the problem is that they are doing interviews immediately after a match when fans can't control their anger with what they've just witnessed.....or can't believe the bollox that Ty is coming away with. That gets posted on youtube for the world to see and you wonder how we've managed to attain a reputation of toxic self entitled cu.nts :rubchin: :roll:

I've just read your post Clash - the thing with the Gooner and One Nil when they started is they were written and therefore a degree of thought and reflection featured whereas the reaction after a match can be far from that when you are livid with the likes of Xhaka or Ozil.
Yes that’s a very good point Jock. We’ve all say things during or just after a match that we wouldn’t say when we’ve had time to calm down and putting that on show for everyone around the world to see isn’t good. I know we do the same here to some extent but it’s different appearing on camera outside the ground.

Most people I know that watch AFTV are not Arsenal fans so there is an element of freak show about it all and that’s where the accusations of them needing us to lose to make money starts from. But talk of banning it is especially hypocritical when it comes from people (i.e. TalkSport) who do something very similar and who have a vested interest in seeing it banned.

Personally I choose not to listen to TalkSport or watch AFTV but if (and I’m only speculating) what happened yesterday was somehow orchestrated or encouraged by mainstream outlets of some kind, then it sets a dangerous precedent. If on the other hand it was genuine pissed off Arsenal fans then fair enough. But as others have said, I’d question why AFTV has got to them when other more serious stuff has not.

I think it's pissed off Arsenal fans but I guess you also have to question their motive. If they are anti AFTV for the good of the club then I'm in but if they are just jealous numpties who crave the attention or money involved for themselves then they are no better than those they target. If someone stuck a mic in my face after most of the matches I've watched over the past few seasons then I fear that I could end up sounding a bit like Claude too :oops: but how on earth he has stopped himself from strangling Ty over the seasons is truly something to admire.

I don't watch AFTV but I do listen to TalkSport although not that absolute ginormous bellend Durham and his little sidekick Gough who between them display outrageous talent as a wum and an ex cricketer who should stick solely to that sport. I quite like most of what Simon Jordan says as he brings a large dollop of commonsense to the table but for whatever reason he had decided that Robbie was a target and went for him. I may be wrong but I don't think that the media outlets are anti AFTV rather they see them as easy pickings to use as and when they want. As you say their is the freak show element about them so you can pretty much guarantee that one of them will say or do something daft to latch on to.

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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby herbert » Sun Dec 22, 2019 2:52 pm

A lot of our away support for whatever reason dont like AFTV and yesterday voiced there opinion just like the regulars on AFTV do every week

They dont help themselves either with their responce, Robbies was a horrow show and smells of someone who knows nothing about our terrace culture and a classic example from yesterday is that most of the abuse from the terrace was aimed at one character who then thought it was a good idea to go on twitter later in the ebening to critisize our away support for singing FEED THE SCOUSERS when his timeline on social media is full of abuse including telling scousers to get of his mentions because is it not giro day? :lol:

how thick can a persons skn be :shock: maybe a long hard think or some help from a person with a brain would be a good idea before you post :lol:

I like Robbie as a person but I dont like his show and I am not keen on a couple of his highest earners so that is why I stay away from it and voice my opinion from the terraces and on here :lol:
Last edited by herbert on Sun Dec 22, 2019 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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GoonerMuzz
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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby GoonerMuzz » Sun Dec 22, 2019 2:57 pm

Sometimes it refreshing to get an instant view from other fans, where AFTV goes wrong is there lack of diverse viewpoints, speaking to the same people week in week out can generate a negative view of the fan base but let's be honest some of the stuff we post on here during games and in other threads could be considered embarrassing by some sections of the fans.

Mainstream media is taking a hit across the board these days and it is opening up opportunities for various other smaller more bespoke media outlets but where money is involved they will fight tooth and nail to protect their revenue and they are not averse to dirty tactics to keep that revenue

I have no real issue with AFTV, but I can easily see where some do but the question should always be asked why do some people feel so entitled to shut down other people's viewpoint just because they disagree with it. It is a really nasty downside of the growth of social media and society in general this new 'I'm more right than you' attitude. It reminds me of some of the more unsavoury periods in recent history :rubchin:

A11M11
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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby A11M11 » Sun Dec 22, 2019 4:18 pm

To parody Hamlet :- Methinks they protest too much . Nothing like a bit of push and shove to up their profile.

robbo10
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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby robbo10 » Sun Dec 22, 2019 4:19 pm



Aren’t you a bit old for that?
:lol: :lol:

I’m a bit old for everything
:shock: :shock: :shock:

What? Even this?


Image


:wink: :D
That has a cock
:shock: :shock: :shock:


Mind you it wouldn't surprise me...So I'm guessing you know from 'personal' experience then!? :D
don't knock it til you've tried it mate! :lol: :lol: :oops:

Oxfordroad80s
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Re: Everton (A) PL 12:30 on 21/12

Postby Oxfordroad80s » Sun Dec 22, 2019 10:40 pm

Send in the rats :cussing:


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