Mikel Arteta, success or failure? - Merged thread.

[SteveO 35]

I feel encouraged by some of the things he says in today's press.

"I was here with City and felt down after the game when I saw what was going on."
It wasn't only the performance, it was the atmosphere and energy that I perceived. That worried me a little bit.
I understand that the fans are used to success and fighting for things and at the moment it's difficult for them to swallow the situation. So let me help,"

And while offering no guarantees that his team's football would ever match the unique artistry of Guardiola's, he did at least vow to imitate some of his mentor's more rudimentary requirements.

"If players like Bernardo Silva, David Silva or Kun Aguero don't get bullied, it's because they defend their position like animals and they don't allow the opposition to do that to them."
That sentence was delivered with a slap of fist into palm, but the emphasis was not really required. Arteta spoke for about 45 minutes at the Emirates as darkness fell on Friday night and his message was clear from the off.

Asked if the Arsenal he knew had lost its way, the Spaniard said: "That's what I sense from the outside. I have to understand why that is. That's the challenge and we don't have much time."

"Everybody has to feel privileged to be here and the players will have to accept a different way of things. We have to build a culture. I don't want people hiding. I want people who will deliver passion and energy."

"This is how we are going to live. The players are not performing and I need to know how they are feeling and what they are lacking."



Here's hoping that he can be a success in the long run. For the immediate future though, I hope he kicks some ass and crunches some balls and gets this squad focused on how bloody lucky they are to be at our once great club.

But that's just the problem Mikel. The Arsenal you knew is the one you joined after we'd had our arses handed to us 8-2, which had come on the back of 5 years of constant decline. The Arsenal we knew is the one before you joined. Then....after you joined our fucktard owner and board allowed the cock at the helm to pursue his pathetic project for a further 7 years - we were in decline when you joined, and then just went further backwards

Oh the irony - he can search for Arsenal losing its identity till the cows come home if in the same breath he's indebted to Arsene Wenger, which he has admitted. The bloke who was responsible for us losing our identity brought you to the club sunshine. Perhaps if you look at the other signings like Santos and Park in the same window that you joined you might start to see the answer. Then when you're still searching for the answer as to where the identity went, ask which manager then went on to sign Mustafi, Xhaka, Perez, Debuchy, Chambers, Cech, Elneny and Ozil. Poor Arsene with no money - yep he spent around £175m on that useless bunch of *word censored*, swapped Alexis for Mhkitaryan and allowed anyone half decent to fuck off for nothing

Identity lost in 2008/09 when he started to allow the next potentially great team to drift apart. Then Kroenke joined and sped up the process

So, we've spent more than a decade accepting mediocrity - a manager who favoured 'rotational leadership' because captaincy is 'overplayed', admitted that 4th is a trophy, spent fifteen years whinging about financial fair play. Meanwhile the ambitious clubs moved on - appointed visionaries, chucked out shit owners and didn't accept settling for 4th

That's where our identity went sunshine - out the fucking window when Lord Wenger carried on a decade too long

[Blim]

I feel encouraged by some of the things he says in today's press.

"I was here with City and felt down after the game when I saw what was going on."
It wasn't only the performance, it was the atmosphere and energy that I perceived. That worried me a little bit.
I understand that the fans are used to success and fighting for things and at the moment it's difficult for them to swallow the situation. So let me help,"

And while offering no guarantees that his team's football would ever match the unique artistry of Guardiola's, he did at least vow to imitate some of his mentor's more rudimentary requirements.

"If players like Bernardo Silva, David Silva or Kun Aguero don't get bullied, it's because they defend their position like animals and they don't allow the opposition to do that to them."
That sentence was delivered with a slap of fist into palm, but the emphasis was not really required. Arteta spoke for about 45 minutes at the Emirates as darkness fell on Friday night and his message was clear from the off.

Asked if the Arsenal he knew had lost its way, the Spaniard said: "That's what I sense from the outside. I have to understand why that is. That's the challenge and we don't have much time."

"Everybody has to feel privileged to be here and the players will have to accept a different way of things. We have to build a culture. I don't want people hiding. I want people who will deliver passion and energy."

"This is how we are going to live. The players are not performing and I need to know how they are feeling and what they are lacking."



Here's hoping that he can be a success in the long run. For the immediate future though, I hope he kicks some ass and crunches some balls and gets this squad focused on how bloody lucky they are to be at our once great club.

But that's just the problem Mikel. The Arsenal you knew is the one you joined after we'd had our arses handed to us 8-2, which had come on the back of 5 years of constant decline. The Arsenal we knew is the one before you joined. Then....after you joined our fucktard owner and board allowed the cock at the helm to pursue his pathetic project for a further 7 years - we were in decline when you joined, and then just went further backwards

Oh the irony - he can search for Arsenal losing its identity till the cows come home if in the same breath he's indebted to Arsene Wenger, which he has admitted. The bloke who was responsible for us losing our identity brought you to the club sunshine. Perhaps if you look at the other signings like Santos and Park in the same window that you joined you might start to see the answer. Then when you're still searching for the answer as to where the identity went, ask which manager then went on to sign Mustafi, Xhaka, Perez, Debuchy, Chambers, Cech, Elneny and Ozil. Poor Arsene with no money - yep he spent around £175m on that useless bunch of *word censored*, swapped Alexis for Mhkitaryan and allowed anyone half decent to fuck off for nothing

Identity lost in 2008/09 when he started to allow the next potentially great team to drift apart. Then Kroenke joined and sped up the process

So, we've spent more than a decade accepting mediocrity - a manager who favoured 'rotational leadership' because captaincy is 'overplayed', admitted that 4th is a trophy, spent fifteen years whinging about financial fair play. Meanwhile the ambitious clubs moved on - appointed visionaries, chucked out shit owners and didn't accept settling for 4th

That's where our identity went sunshine - out the fucking window when Lord Wenger carried on a decade too long

Sums it up nicely well done.

[augie]

Give him a chance, whether it is the correct appointment time will tell but things are so bad he has a very low starting point.
I'm sure he understands the job he has to do and I get it that people are underwhelmed by his appointment. But as in attracting top players maybe we are no longer in the market for the Allegris etc.
People that know hom recognise his tactical know how but how he gets that across to overindulged ego inflated remains to be seen.I think his best bet is clear the decks of the overpaid underperforming players and instill within the younger players what this club means..Easier said than done.

Speaking from my own point of view (and I think others feel the same), it is the concern over how much control he will have over these senior players that concerns/underwhelms me. I know where our standing in the game is now, and I am well aware how little financial backing our managers are gonna get in the transfer market, so I don't have dreams or expectations that top managers and players are lining up to work for us.

Going back to last season I advocated an almost total reset cos that was the only way I can sure us becoming a force again, but fans didn't want that cos it didn't promise immediate returns. I said that we should have sold auba last summer and use the good transfer fee (valued around £80m at the time), and invested it in 2 good young players (dembele at lyon as the striker, and 1 defender), but for too many that mindset was defeatist as we were selling our best player Now fast forward 5 months and all of a sudden fans are beginning to support the idea of moving on these experienced "star players" ( ), but are they willing to take the short-term hit that will come with it ? Building a new young team doesnt happen overnight so I wont expect immediate success - if arteta shows that he has the balls and presence to deal with these arrogant cocks, and if he shows some awareness and ability to adjust his tactical thinking to cover for that lack of defensive quality, then I am willing to support him. If however, he allows overpaid and underperforming cocks (yes you xhaka and ozil), andlazy selffish arrogant w.ankers (yes you auba and laca), to strut around doing sweet fcuk all ever game, then he has lost my support immediately

[Redarmy]

I feel encouraged by some of the things he says in today's press.

"I was here with City and felt down after the game when I saw what was going on."
It wasn't only the performance, it was the atmosphere and energy that I perceived. That worried me a little bit.
I understand that the fans are used to success and fighting for things and at the moment it's difficult for them to swallow the situation. So let me help,"

And while offering no guarantees that his team's football would ever match the unique artistry of Guardiola's, he did at least vow to imitate some of his mentor's more rudimentary requirements.

"If players like Bernardo Silva, David Silva or Kun Aguero don't get bullied, it's because they defend their position like animals and they don't allow the opposition to do that to them."
That sentence was delivered with a slap of fist into palm, but the emphasis was not really required. Arteta spoke for about 45 minutes at the Emirates as darkness fell on Friday night and his message was clear from the off.

Asked if the Arsenal he knew had lost its way, the Spaniard said: "That's what I sense from the outside. I have to understand why that is. That's the challenge and we don't have much time."

"Everybody has to feel privileged to be here and the players will have to accept a different way of things. We have to build a culture. I don't want people hiding. I want people who will deliver passion and energy."

"This is how we are going to live. The players are not performing and I need to know how they are feeling and what they are lacking."



Here's hoping that he can be a success in the long run. For the immediate future though, I hope he kicks some ass and crunches some balls and gets this squad focused on how bloody lucky they are to be at our once great club.

But that's just the problem Mikel. The Arsenal you knew is the one you joined after we'd had our arses handed to us 8-2, which had come on the back of 5 years of constant decline. The Arsenal we knew is the one before you joined. Then....after you joined our fucktard owner and board allowed the cock at the helm to pursue his pathetic project for a further 7 years - we were in decline when you joined, and then just went further backwards

Oh the irony - he can search for Arsenal losing its identity till the cows come home if in the same breath he's indebted to Arsene Wenger, which he has admitted. The bloke who was responsible for us losing our identity brought you to the club sunshine. Perhaps if you look at the other signings like Santos and Park in the same window that you joined you might start to see the answer. Then when you're still searching for the answer as to where the identity went, ask which manager then went on to sign Mustafi, Xhaka, Perez, Debuchy, Chambers, Cech, Elneny and Ozil. Poor Arsene with no money - yep he spent around £175m on that useless bunch of *word censored*, swapped Alexis for Mhkitaryan and allowed anyone half decent to fuck off for nothing

Identity lost in 2008/09 when he started to allow the next potentially great team to drift apart. Then Kroenke joined and sped up the process

So, we've spent more than a decade accepting mediocrity - a manager who favoured 'rotational leadership' because captaincy is 'overplayed', admitted that 4th is a trophy, spent fifteen years whinging about financial fair play. Meanwhile the ambitious clubs moved on - appointed visionaries, chucked out shit owners and didn't accept settling for 4th

That's where our identity went sunshine - out the fucking window when Lord Wenger carried on a decade too long

Summed that one up well SteveO.....sad to see it all detailed like that....truth hurts sometimes

[nut flush gooner]

I'm afraid I can't see anything other than abject failure.......but boy do I hope to be proven wrong and have this post dragged up 3 years later when he's won the title

Only six younger PL managers in history - all of them sacked within 2 years

The only PL club without a single penny of owner investment, few saleable assets to generate cash and a defence that a manager like Arteta would need to spend 200m on playing the style of football he wants to play where the defence almost doesn't matter. Someone like Wilder, Dyche or Potter would build a defence for less than 10m, and i'm afraid that's the league we're playing in these days.

Man City's backline against us on Sunday - Ederson £35m, Kyle Walker £50m, Otamendi (reserve) £28m, Mendy £52m. That's without the likes of Stones for £50m+. Man City's defence was dog shit before they spent that sort of cash, and there wasn't an ounce of improvement in the first season under Guardiola until he spent that sort of cash. That is where Arteta has come from.

At Arsenal, playing the brand of football he wants to play......he has absolutely zero chance of success and won't be our manager this time next year

The club wants an Invincibles manager operating on a shoestring. The sooner we accept our mid table position and appoint a manager capable of working to a new style in this league with no more than £20m to spend, we might as well forget who the manager is

That's exactly how I feel, but you know we aren't in a position to be picky these days about our manager. If he can get us into the top 4 again that's good enough for me. Regardless of what people think about this, as I said gotta get behind the manager. He deserves goodwill for the next season and a half IMO. Then reassess.

[SteveO 35]

I'm afraid I can't see anything other than abject failure.......but boy do I hope to be proven wrong and have this post dragged up 3 years later when he's won the title

Only six younger PL managers in history - all of them sacked within 2 years

The only PL club without a single penny of owner investment, few saleable assets to generate cash and a defence that a manager like Arteta would need to spend 200m on playing the style of football he wants to play where the defence almost doesn't matter. Someone like Wilder, Dyche or Potter would build a defence for less than 10m, and i'm afraid that's the league we're playing in these days.

Man City's backline against us on Sunday - Ederson £35m, Kyle Walker £50m, Otamendi (reserve) £28m, Mendy £52m. That's without the likes of Stones for £50m+. Man City's defence was dog shit before they spent that sort of cash, and there wasn't an ounce of improvement in the first season under Guardiola until he spent that sort of cash. That is where Arteta has come from.

At Arsenal, playing the brand of football he wants to play......he has absolutely zero chance of success and won't be our manager this time next year

The club wants an Invincibles manager operating on a shoestring. The sooner we accept our mid table position and appoint a manager capable of working to a new style in this league with no more than £20m to spend, we might as well forget who the manager is

That's exactly how I feel, but you know we aren't in a position to be picky these days about our manager. If he can get us into the top 4 again that's good enough for me. Regardless of what people think about this, as I said gotta get behind the manager. He deserves goodwill for the next season and a half IMO. Then reassess.

Agreed - he's our manager and I will back him from the start......just honestly can't see it working out. I liked him a lot as a player and wanted us to sign him a few years before we eventually did, so i have no personal axe to grind with the guy whatsoever. I just think that we need a GG type before we get a Pep type. Before Wenger disappeared up his own arse years later, he was gracious enough to admit he inherited the finest defence in the land which gave him the platform to go forward and build the rest of the team. The next guy needs to start with the backline, take a hatchet to it and completely rebuild it. I hope Arteta sees that as the priority rather than simply trying to sign the likes of Sane, as its known he wants wingers. That's fine, but if he fails to see that having Maitland Niles and Kolasinac behind them is a problem, then we won't be advancing up the table from where we are

[Jock Gooner]

Give him a chance, whether it is the correct appointment time will tell but things are so bad he has a very low starting point.
I'm sure he understands the job he has to do and I get it that people are underwhelmed by his appointment. But as in attracting top players maybe we are no longer in the market for the Allegris etc.
People that know hom recognise his tactical know how but how he gets that across to overindulged ego inflated remains to be seen.I think his best bet is clear the decks of the overpaid underperforming players and instill within the younger players what this club means..Easier said than done.

Speaking from my own point of view (and I think others feel the same), it is the concern over how much control he will have over these senior players that concerns/underwhelms me. I know where our standing in the game is now, and I am well aware how little financial backing our managers are gonna get in the transfer market, so I don't have dreams or expectations that top managers and players are lining up to work for us.

Going back to last season I advocated an almost total reset cos that was the only way I can sure us becoming a force again, but fans didn't want that cos it didn't promise immediate returns. I said that we should have sold auba last summer and use the good transfer fee (valued around £80m at the time), and invested it in 2 good young players (dembele at lyon as the striker, and 1 defender), but for too many that mindset was defeatist as we were selling our best player Now fast forward 5 months and all of a sudden fans are beginning to support the idea of moving on these experienced "star players" ( ), but are they willing to take the short-term hit that will come with it ? Building a new young team doesnt happen overnight so I wont expect immediate success - if arteta shows that he has the balls and presence to deal with these arrogant cocks, and if he shows some awareness and ability to adjust his tactical thinking to cover for that lack of defensive quality, then I am willing to support him. If however, he allows overpaid and underperforming cocks (yes you xhaka and ozil), andlazy selffish arrogant w.ankers (yes you auba and laca), to strut around doing sweet fcuk all ever game, then he has lost my support immediately

No argument from me on the sale of players to fund a rebuild as I would have sold Laca and bellend quite happily to raise some serious cash to spend in the right areas. Likewise I am prepared to give a manager the time to put a new younger side together but I fear that is far from what people are prepared to put up with. Let's take Willock for example, although there are others.....a young kid foisted in and out of a shite team by a failing manager with nobody to guide him along and help him settle in so he struggles to fit in and show what potentially he can do. How long was he given on here before he was declared to be shit by some....it wasn't very long Anyone remember watching TA as a youngster breaking into the side, or Quinny or Mickey T....they all took time to find their feet and perhaps we need to be a bit more patient with our current youngsters some of whom might just need a bit more time themselves.

[GoonerMuzz]

I'm still of the opinion that Arteta is the wrong appointment at the wrong time but unfortunately it is what it is. Maybe we are part of the problem, the fans, we have got ourselves into a rut, the latter Wenger years and the UEs lack of improvement overall has got us acting like whipped dogs. Other fans look forward to improvement under a new manager we look for where things are going to go wrong.

If Arteta can instill some identity in the team it will be an improvement on twhat we have seen for at least 10 years but we're all so jaded none of us can see it happening, maybe we need to change our attitude as much as the team and club.

We all say we will get behind the new manager but do we really mean it, I said I dont expect anything for at least 8 games and I genuinely mean that we are currently playing at a level far below what we have come to expect and it will take a lot more than any of us understand to begin to turn that round.

Personally I'm going to try to look less for the multitude of mistakes and try to see the small improvements wherever I can find them because I'm sick of the negative attitude I find myself with when watching the team.

[Jock Gooner]

I'm still of the opinion that Arteta is the wrong appointment at the wrong time but unfortunately it is what it is. Maybe we are part of the problem, the fans, we have got ourselves into a rut, the latter Wenger years and the UEs lack of improvement overall has got us acting like whipped dogs. Other fans look forward to improvement under a new manager we look for where things are going to go wrong.

If Arteta can instill some identity in the team it will be an improvement on twhat we have seen for at least 10 years but we're all so jaded none of us can see it happening, maybe we need to change our attitude as much as the team and club.

We all say we will get behind the new manager but do we really mean it, I said I dont expect anything for at least 8 games and I genuinely mean that we are currently playing at a level far below what we have come to expect and it will take a lot more than any of us understand to begin to turn that round.

Personally I'm going to try to look less for the multitude of mistakes and try to see the small improvements wherever I can find them because I'm sick of the negative attitude I find myself with when watching the team.

From a realist to a fantasist

While I genuinely admire your sentiment, isn't it just a case of we've watched it for so long that we can't help but call it for what it is. Given the lack of direction and commitment by so many connected to the club over the past decade are we capable of any more.

Can you honestly say that the first stupid nowhere ball that Xhaka plays across the middle of our defence or midfield is going to slip you by Oh well done Granit you almost found a team mate that time...better luck with your next aimless throw of the dice I give you 10 minutes before you're calling him a useless cu.nt again

[marka123]

To the tune of Rosetta by Georgie Fame and Alan Price

Oh Arteta, hope you do better, hope you do well well well.

Probably doesn't scan and probably too gay.

Only my second post, better get my coat.

BTW f**k off Kroenke!

[mcdowell42]

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... 21138321?1

[falkirk goon]

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... 21138321?1

He's a cock but can't argue with him.Ancelotti should have 100 % been given the gig.

[clockender1]

Arteta told the players face to face -before kick off , in the dressing room. i will be watching you from the stands, your touches, your attitude, your body language. What you do when we lose the ball, and whar you do when we have it.

Id be interested to see if he sais anything publicly after the game about the performances.

[Jock Gooner]

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... 21138321?1

He's a cock but can't argue with him.Ancelotti should have 100 % been given the gig.

I concur that he is a complete and utter cock.

The board no doubt believe they can exercise a fair degree of control over Arteta whereas somebody with Ancelotti's experience and CV might just be a bit tricky.

[augie]

Arteta told the players face to face -before kick off , in the dressing room. i will be watching you from the stands, your touches, your attitude, your body language. What you do when we lose the ball, and whar you do when we have it.

Id be interested to see if he sais anything publicly after the game about the performances.

If he was watching aubamayueng, yesterday, then that should be his last game to play for The Arsenal - his work-rate and attitude was a fcuking disgrace, and if I was in charge then I would be circulating his name around Europe over the next few days.
Laca's work-rate yesterday (albeit only for 15 minutes) was what you would expect from a professional player, so I would give him the start the next day - if he continues to show the same attitude he showed when brought on yesterday then I would keep him, but if he went back to sulking I would be making him available too