CoronaVirus Latest

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goonersid
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by goonersid »

augie wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 3:53 pm
goonersid wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 1:50 pm
A11M11 wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 12:09 pm
Paying for any obesity related hospital treatment would be a better option.

But who would collect the money and what if the patient could'nt pay ?
Already we know that the NHS loses a fortune on not claiming money back from foreign patients because they claim that it's not financially viable to chase people that have left the country. We also know that insurance details are never questioned at the point of treatment and also obesity itself is not always due to a diet of crisps , chocolate and beer , as nice as that sounds , Some people are genetically designed to be bigger than others .
What measure is to be used to detect obesity as the BMI invented many years ago is no longer reliable .
That’s not true mate, there are only a few cases where obesity has been attributed to genes.
It’s environmental, if your parents are obese then there’s a good chance you’ll be obese, simply due to poor diet.
Any programme I’ve ever watched on obesity, usually has an obese person blaming everything, but their diet.
On hospital treatment, simply refuse it if they don’t show true intent to lose weight.



An obese man who lives a few miles away from me has suffered with mobility in recent years and uses a motorised scooter/wheelchair type of thing to get around - a few days ago the man fell out of his bed and the fire brigade had to be called and it took EIGHT of them to lift him back onto his bead :lol: :lol: :lol:
Sweet Jesus! That must be one hell of a “scooter” :lol:

A11M11
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by A11M11 »

5 foot 9 , 14 stone 8 , 73 years old.apparently obese.
Played Football and squash Until I was 50 then hip replacement went wrong and the weight piled on .
It’s too black and white to say it’s a life style choice.

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SteveO 35
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by SteveO 35 »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54498191

How easy must it be to make a recommendation purely on the basis of the science, without needing to balance it up with the impact on the economy. At peak there were allegedly 9m people on furlough receiving 80% pay and supposedly the scheme cost the UK Govt £40bn - shall we just do that again indefinitely and let our kids work till they're 80? Or shall we just let those jobs go to waste and create mass social unrest, poverty and mental health issues rise on a scale like never before.

National lockdown number 2 - utter lunacy

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

SteveO 35 wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:44 am
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54498191

How easy must it be to make a recommendation purely on the basis of the science, without needing to balance it up with the impact on the economy. At peak there were allegedly 9m people on furlough receiving 80% pay and supposedly the scheme cost the UK Govt £40bn - shall we just do that again indefinitely and let our kids work till they're 80? Or shall we just let those jobs go to waste and create mass social unrest, poverty and mental health issues rise on a scale like never before.

National lockdown number 2 - utter lunacy
The lunacy is the behaviour of the people in the video. Its not a team effort is it. Young people don’t give a shit.

It’s a reflection of our society and how the spoon fed I want it now generation can’t see the bigger picture.

Liverpool is touted for the harshest restrictions, we’ve known for decades how entitled they are up there. I honestly feel the govt don't have much choice.

When our economy is reliant on pubs and hospitality overall something isn't right. The Americans are similar but they also have a huge technology sector which has thrived this year. Perhaps we should focus more on manufacturing chips rather than frying them

50 odd deaths today, what death toll is acceptable when things get really grim.

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the playing mantis
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by the playing mantis »

nut flush gooner wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 9:20 pm
SteveO 35 wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:44 am
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54498191

How easy must it be to make a recommendation purely on the basis of the science, without needing to balance it up with the impact on the economy. At peak there were allegedly 9m people on furlough receiving 80% pay and supposedly the scheme cost the UK Govt £40bn - shall we just do that again indefinitely and let our kids work till they're 80? Or shall we just let those jobs go to waste and create mass social unrest, poverty and mental health issues rise on a scale like never before.

National lockdown number 2 - utter lunacy
The lunacy is the behaviour of the people in the video. Its not a team effort is it. Young people don’t give a shit.

It’s a reflection of our society and how the spoon fed I want it now generation can’t see the bigger picture.

Liverpool is touted for the harshest restrictions, we’ve known for decades how entitled they are up there. I honestly feel the govt don't have much choice.

When our economy is reliant on pubs and hospitality overall something isn't right. The Americans are similar but they also have a huge technology sector which has thrived this year. Perhaps we should focus more on manufacturing chips rather than frying them

50 odd deaths today, what death toll is acceptable when things get really grim.
and whats with all these northern mayors, saying there not going to accept harsher measures in the north and negotiations are still ongoing...wtf do they mean negotiations?

if the gov tell them to do it fucking do it. is andy burnham and his ilk refusing to lockdown if the government doesn't pay all these *word censored* to sit on their arses again for 6 months (most of them do that anyway). i simply don't understand their angle. id suggest the government seal the *word censored* in and let them get on with it, letting it be a test bed for herd immunity if they want to carry on refusing to measures or being somehow special. they have the most rampant spread of the virus, so why should they not suffer harsher measures where its low like east anglia for example?

Gunner Rob
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by Gunner Rob »

The problem is the UK is very small and crowded.
The virus as Prof Van Tam has said this morning is now spreading nationwide.
The whole country should be put on level 3 lockdown from tonight.

If that doesn’t happpen and it won’t then all we are doing is the same as March which is reacting to a problem rather than being proactive. This is why we have the highest death toll in Europe.

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augie
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by augie »

Gunner Rob wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:13 pm
The problem is the UK is very small and crowded.
The virus as Prof Van Tam has said this morning is now spreading nationwide.
The whole country should be put on level 3 lockdown from tonight.

If that doesn’t happen and it won’t then all we are doing is the same as March which is reacting to a problem rather than being proactive. This is why we have the highest death toll in Europe.



A lot of the problem in the uk is that in a lot of the cities there is overcrowding in houses and that will ensure a greater spread of the virus when these people go out to work, school etc

The weakness in your argument is that putting a country into a level 3 lockdown certainly wont stop the spread and will only pause the spread of the virus - as soon as the country opens up again the virus will spread at the same rate regardless, but at least people can pretend that they have it under control again for a few weeks I suppose :roll:

Gunner Rob
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by Gunner Rob »

That’s the point though - we need to stop the spread until a vaccine is found, otherwise the hospitals will be overrun.

Of course we could afford to lock down less if we had an effective track, test and trace system.
However we don’t. For that blame the government.

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augie
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by augie »

Gunner Rob wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 1:37 pm
That’s the point though - we need to stop the spread until a vaccine is found, otherwise the hospitals will be overrun.

Of course we could afford to lock down less if we had an effective track, test and trace system.
However we don’t. For that blame the government.



I'm not gonna get into a debate about uk politics cos we seen how those debates have run this year :lol: :lol: :lol:

How about we focus on the point I highlighted - how long would you realistically expect that to take, and how long do you think a lockdown is sustainable for ?

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

augie wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 1:34 pm
Gunner Rob wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:13 pm
The problem is the UK is very small and crowded.
The virus as Prof Van Tam has said this morning is now spreading nationwide.
The whole country should be put on level 3 lockdown from tonight.

If that doesn’t happen and it won’t then all we are doing is the same as March which is reacting to a problem rather than being proactive. This is why we have the highest death toll in Europe.



A lot of the problem in the uk is that in a lot of the cities there is overcrowding in houses and that will ensure a greater spread of the virus when these people go out to work, school etc

The weakness in your argument is that putting a country into a level 3 lockdown certainly wont stop the spread and will only pause the spread of the virus - as soon as the country opens up again the virus will spread at the same rate regardless, but at least people can pretend that they have it under control again for a few weeks I suppose :roll:
Now thats where I disagree about the spread of the virus. There are so many variables that mean at different times of year the disease spreads at a different rate with a different level of severity and fatal outcomes.

If we paused all activity in the UK that involved household mixing, pubs/bars and restaurants closing down until next April the virus would be all but eliminated. Any reopening wouldn’t see the same exponential spread as in Winter. We know that peoples immunity is stronger in summer with higher vitamin D levels and COVID gets killed in minutes by UV rays.

But that strategy would crash the economy and cause the whole nation to go into mental breakdown no doubt causing a lot of non Covid deaths.

There needs to be a happy medium and local measures is just about the only way to do it. If an area is in the highest tier of measures, its for a reason. The people need to stop crying about it, and collectively do something about reducing infection spread.

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augie
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by augie »

nut flush gooner wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:25 pm
augie wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 1:34 pm
Gunner Rob wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:13 pm
The problem is the UK is very small and crowded.
The virus as Prof Van Tam has said this morning is now spreading nationwide.
The whole country should be put on level 3 lockdown from tonight.

If that doesn’t happen and it won’t then all we are doing is the same as March which is reacting to a problem rather than being proactive. This is why we have the highest death toll in Europe.



A lot of the problem in the uk is that in a lot of the cities there is overcrowding in houses and that will ensure a greater spread of the virus when these people go out to work, school etc

The weakness in your argument is that putting a country into a level 3 lockdown certainly wont stop the spread and will only pause the spread of the virus - as soon as the country opens up again the virus will spread at the same rate regardless, but at least people can pretend that they have it under control again for a few weeks I suppose :roll:
Now thats where I disagree about the spread of the virus. There are so many variables that mean at different times of year the disease spreads at a different rate with a different level of severity and fatal outcomes.

If we paused all activity in the UK that involved household mixing, pubs/bars and restaurants closing down until next April the virus would be all but eliminated. Any reopening wouldn’t see the same exponential spread as in Winter. We know that peoples immunity is stronger in summer with higher vitamin D levels and COVID gets killed in minutes by UV rays.

But that strategy would crash the economy and cause the whole nation to go into mental breakdown no doubt causing a lot of non Covid deaths.

There needs to be a happy medium and local measures is just about the only way to do it. If an area is in the highest tier of measures, its for a reason. The people need to stop crying about it, and collectively do something about reducing infection spread.



We brought in a system of localised lockdowns - the system seemed acceptable until suddenly dublin had to be locked down, and then within a week we reverted to the system of locking down the whole country again :roll:

I'm sure it was just a coincidence though and that it wasnt that we couldnt be seen to be treating the poor old dubs harsher than anyone else :wink: :wink:

A11M11
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by A11M11 »

One thing that has been largely ignored by the so called experts is that when you look at Van Tam's graphs this morning you see a fairly flat line throughout until the schools and universties went back . Not so much at primary age but anyone with life experience knows how hard it is to get one kid to act responsibly but when you stick them together with their peers you are asking for trouble.

It's a kind of itch , scratch , itch scenario . They want kids at school so that their parents can go back to work but then they try not to admit that schools are spreading the virus to the wider community. At least in the university it can be contained in campus but it will spread to 2nd and third year students that live in the many bedsits around their areas .

It's no coincidence that in sleepy old Norfolk until a few weeks ago the only real outbreaks happened in processing plants where migrant workers spread it to holiday towns like Great Yarmouth where the now council paid for bed and breakfasts are, but once the UEA took in it's students Norwich has become Norfolk's hot spot .

We are now facing half term and I anticipate that any lock down will incorporate that period because the powers that be are well aware of the spread in schools and in that period the holiday makers will be back to low risk coastal areas from areas in lockdown and just like the summer holidays will not wear masks , will not distance and then they will go away and the rates will go down again until Christmas

I await comments regarding the loss of school time harming peoples life chances but frankly that is bollocks . My son was off school for medical reasons for 8 months at age 12 but managed a degree in a science based subject. I guess it all depends on the individual and their willingness to apply themselves to their situation.

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

A11M11 wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:45 pm
One thing that has been largely ignored by the so called experts is that when you look at Van Tam's graphs this morning you see a fairly flat line throughout until the schools and universties went back . Not so much at primary age but anyone with life experience knows how hard it is to get one kid to act responsibly but when you stick them together with their peers you are asking for trouble.

It's a kind of itch , scratch , itch scenario . They want kids at school so that their parents can go back to work but then they try not to admit that schools are spreading the virus to the wider community. At least in the university it can be contained in campus but it will spread to 2nd and third year students that live in the many bedsits around their areas .

It's no coincidence that in sleepy old Norfolk until a few weeks ago the only real outbreaks happened in processing plants where migrant workers spread it to holiday towns like Great Yarmouth where the now council paid for bed and breakfasts are, but once the UEA took in it's students Norwich has become Norfolk's hot spot .

We are now facing half term and I anticipate that any lock down will incorporate that period because the powers that be are well aware of the spread in schools and in that period the holiday makers will be back to low risk coastal areas from areas in lockdown and just like the summer holidays will not wear masks , will not distance and then they will go away and the rates will go down again until Christmas

I await comments regarding the loss of school time harming peoples life chances but frankly that is bollocks . My son was off school for medical reasons for 8 months at age 12 but managed a degree in a science based subject. I guess it all depends on the individual and their willingness to apply themselves to their situation.
It wasn’t the schools really was it more like millions of uni students that had freedom for the first time in their lives that decided we are going to get shitfaced, ignore social distancing and party like its 1999.

With regards to education, its a combination of the individual and their parents support that leads to positive outcomes. People don't have to go to uni at 18 if they get behind, a lot of first year students take a year or two out before commencing their studies. Its usually because of working or travelling, catching up with studies will be common over the next five years I suspect,

But can we do one thing in this country, stop being so reliant on pubs especially as a driver for economic growth and create some proper jobs in proper industries. The shift to renewable energy and electric batteries for example is an area that would create thousands of jobs with the right investment.

A11M11
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by A11M11 »

You know my views on the economy and the need for growth in British industry and support for our for British companies , farmers , Fishermen and the number of small independents from my comments on another thread.
There is an opportunity to get the country working again and it ishould not be a pre-requisit that a unlversity degree is required to get an interview. We have relied on service industries for too long , the country needs it's own industrial base working for the good of all.

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

A11M11 wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 3:10 pm
You know my views on the economy and the need for growth in British industry and support for our for British companies , farmers , Fishermen and the number of small independents from my comments on another thread.
There is an opportunity to get the country working again and it ishould not be a pre-requisit that a unlversity degree is required to get an interview. We have relied on service industries for too long , the country needs it's own industrial base working for the good of all.
We will never build a successful economy on Farming/Fishing. It has to be Technology which is the only area that has grown since March globally. Companies like Amazon are thriving, we need a British version of Amazon or an industry that we lead the world in that creates well-paid jobs and brings in a lot of tax to cover all the money we are spunking on furlough etc.

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