Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

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g88ner
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by g88ner »

SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
I've lost count of how many times I've talked about Emery having his faults and far from being his number one fan, I have admitted where he went wrong.
I honestly hadn’t noticed mate :lol: so my mistake (I miss a lot of posts).I thought you were ultra pro-Emery based on what I’ve read.
SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
What I'm not having is this massive improvement bullshit.
No massive improvement! I doubt anyone on here thinks that to be fair.

SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
If an English manager had overseen a performance like that last night we would be hearing about football from the dark ages and such phrases as "tactically naive". Because its baby Pep, supposedly we are "more organised" and "showing improvement".
Not sure about that. Lampard seems to be a media darling too so it’s not anti-english surely? Potter too. The reality is the media and fans have always preferred what they perceive as progressive young managers and instinctively shunned the big Sam/Sean dyche type.

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SteveO 35
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by SteveO 35 »

g88ner wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 1:11 pm
SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
I've lost count of how many times I've talked about Emery having his faults and far from being his number one fan, I have admitted where he went wrong.
I honestly hadn’t noticed mate :lol: so my mistake (I miss a lot of posts).I thought you were ultra pro-Emery based on what I’ve read.
SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
What I'm not having is this massive improvement bullshit.
No massive improvement! I doubt anyone on here thinks that to be fair.

SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
If an English manager had overseen a performance like that last night we would be hearing about football from the dark ages and such phrases as "tactically naive". Because its baby Pep, supposedly we are "more organised" and "showing improvement".
Not sure about that. Lampard seems to be a media darling too so it’s not anti-english surely? Potter too. The reality is the media and fans have always preferred what they perceive as progressive young managers and instinctively shunned the big Sam/Sean dyche type.
No worries mate - to be honest Emery was in the second tier of choices after the likes of Allegri or Simeone and I'm sure either of those would have improved us a lot more even with the restrictions that were in place over budgets. I think Lampard benefits from being a PL "legend" as a player and is probably afforded a lot more time and respect because of that compared to the names you've mentioned. Someone like Rooney would probably get the same "love in" if he became a manager

You're right about the snobbery towards other British managers though. Hassenhutl vs Dyche would be a a classic example - one supposedly a genius who got trumped 9-0 this year, the other a long ball merchant. Also loving the Barcodes weighing up how nobody could ever beat Benitez's amazing achievements when Steve Bruce somehow managed to do exactly that!

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g88ner
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by g88ner »

SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 12:42 pm
COVID-19 - the gift wrapped excuse for Arteta

Because of course before COVID-19 teams were literally on the phone to Emery every day with offers for Mustafi, Xhaka and Ozil

Fuck me we've still got Elneny and Mkhitaryan- the latter on 180k per week

COVID-19 - hilarious!
All I’m saying is our overpaid shit which have been impossible to shift for years are now likely to be even harder to shift. I want them gone but who would spend money on a Mustafi? a kolasinac? or an Ozil? The list goes on :(

Loan deals only I reckon as their salaries are prohibitively expensive for most clubs.

That’s anything but hilarious :( :lol:

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DB10GOONER
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by DB10GOONER »

g88ner wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 12:13 pm
Ernie71 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:58 am
Not defending Emery but it was Wenger who paid £70m for the Chuckle brothers Mustafi and Xhaka.And he was left with a lazy fucker on £350k a week by Wenger who once he was given that contract retired from football. One thing Emery did was drop Ozil Mustafi Xhaka and Lacazette. Emery was beginning to clearout the dross.As soon as Arteta took over he reinstated all of them.
Agree with most of that mate but Emery didn’t drop xakha, did he?

Also, Lacazette played loads under Emery. Arteta has surely benched him more often? (Just a guess).

Anyway, from what I remember, Emery made xakha captain and, after telling the fans to fuck off, it was xakha who sulked and refused to play. I don’t think Emery disciplined him; instead he seemed to offer him space and support to get his head right.
Yep and apparently that's him "getting rid of Xhakatard". Probably explains why he didn't manage to actually get rid of even one of those players he's been hailed for nearly getting rid of..... :wink:

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DB10GOONER
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by DB10GOONER »

SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 1:18 pm
g88ner wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 1:11 pm
SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
I've lost count of how many times I've talked about Emery having his faults and far from being his number one fan, I have admitted where he went wrong.
I honestly hadn’t noticed mate :lol: so my mistake (I miss a lot of posts).I thought you were ultra pro-Emery based on what I’ve read.
SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
What I'm not having is this massive improvement bullshit.
No massive improvement! I doubt anyone on here thinks that to be fair.

SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:28 am
If an English manager had overseen a performance like that last night we would be hearing about football from the dark ages and such phrases as "tactically naive". Because its baby Pep, supposedly we are "more organised" and "showing improvement".
Not sure about that. Lampard seems to be a media darling too so it’s not anti-english surely? Potter too. The reality is the media and fans have always preferred what they perceive as progressive young managers and instinctively shunned the big Sam/Sean dyche type.
No worries mate - to be honest Emery was in the second tier of choices after the likes of Allegri or Simeone and I'm sure either of those would have improved us a lot more even with the restrictions that were in place over budgets. I think Lampard benefits from being a PL "legend" as a player and is probably afforded a lot more time and respect because of that compared to the names you've mentioned. Someone like Rooney would probably get the same "love in" if he became a manager

You're right about the snobbery towards other British managers though. Hassenhutl vs Dyche would be a a classic example - one supposedly a genius who got trumped 9-0 this year, the other a long ball merchant. Also loving the Barcodes weighing up how nobody could ever beat Benitez's amazing achievements when Steve Bruce somehow managed to do exactly that!
I dunno Steve I think you might need to unwrap the old union jack blindfold there mate. :wink:

It's not about nationality. It's about how shit they are! Hassenhutl, Dyche, Benitez, Bruce are all equally shit. 8)

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SteveO 35
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by SteveO 35 »

g88ner wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 1:19 pm
SteveO 35 wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 12:42 pm
COVID-19 - the gift wrapped excuse for Arteta

Because of course before COVID-19 teams were literally on the phone to Emery every day with offers for Mustafi, Xhaka and Ozil

Fuck me we've still got Elneny and Mkhitaryan- the latter on 180k per week

COVID-19 - hilarious!
All I’m saying is our overpaid shit which have been impossible to shift for years are now likely to be even harder to shift. I want them gone but who would spend money on a Mustafi? a kolasinac? or an Ozil? The list goes on :(

Loan deals only I reckon as their salaries are prohibitively expensive for most clubs.

That’s anything but hilarious :( :lol:
Mate, I think if we paid the transfer fee ourselves to get rid of them there would still be no takers !

Poor old Arsene - the man with no money ever and scraping around for bargains wasted 77m on two of those c.unts !

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Herd
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by Herd »

Why are we banging on about yesterday ,it's gone ,we need to think about tomorrow.
We are were we deserve to be right now for a multitude of reasons and none of them are cheerful .
Its's where we go from here that's more important and whilst I have zero faith in the senior management ,our only hope right now is Arteta and a youth progression, forget huge wads and a top of the range manager it isn't coming .
We might all baulk at that but in my lifetime I've seen us rise Phoenix like twice over and without massive input of funds just people with a plan and a burning desire to win. Remember Martin{Zico} Hayes ,Perry Groves have a championship medal !
George Graham was lucky in that he had talented youngsters who had come though the system which a large part of was due to Mr Don Howe but he drilled them into winners . We scoff at the league cup now as spoiled bitches but the 3 semi finals against them were classic for our dogged resilience, beating Liverpool in the final (after rush scored first ) laid a foundation.
Similarly the arrival of Wenger had its luck in that the back 5 were the best unit going ,but bringing in Petite and Viera at what was considered cheap money at the time sent us on our way and gave DB10 some decent playmates . Things aint what they used to be but why can't it happen again without a billionaire pumping huge dosh in ?
I've followed this club since I was little ,they have surprised me and lifted me up so often that the bad times make the good times so much better .
I'm drunk but I mean this !

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Bradywasking
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by Bradywasking »

Herd wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:10 am
Why are we banging on about yesterday ,it's gone ,we need to think about tomorrow.
We are were we deserve to be right now for a multitude of reasons and none of them are cheerful .
Its's where we go from here that's more important and whilst I have zero faith in the senior management ,our only hope right now is Arteta and a youth progression, forget huge wads and a top of the range manager it isn't coming .
We might all baulk at that but in my lifetime I've seen us rise Phoenix like twice over and without massive input of funds just people with a plan and a burning desire to win. Remember Martin{Zico} Hayes ,Perry Groves have a championship medal !
George Graham was lucky in that he had talented youngsters who had come though the system which a large part of was due to Mr Don Howe but he drilled them into winners . We scoff at the league cup now as spoiled bitches but the 3 semi finals against them were classic for our dogged resilience, beating Liverpool in the final (after rush scored first ) laid a foundation.
Similarly the arrival of Wenger had its luck in that the back 5 were the best unit going ,but bringing in Petite and Viera at what was considered cheap money at the time sent us on our way and gave DB10 some decent playmates . Things aint what they used to be but why can't it happen again without a billionaire pumping huge dosh in ?
I've followed this club since I was little ,they have surprised me and lifted me up so often that the bad times make the good times so much better .
I'm drunk but I mean this !
Delighted to read that Herd..I'm also old enough to remember the mid 70s relegation fights, the uninspiring early 80s after Brady and Stapleton left. The horrible season of 94/94 when George's world fell apart about us. Yet we prevailed and came back.
This time it won't be easy because of the Kronkes. But it's a week to an FA Cup Final that I would give Arsenal a huge chance of winning. I know we are nowhere near challenging for the title. I feel down about the future some days and then days like City in the semi final I think (hope) I may have glimpsed it.

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augie
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by augie »

Herd wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:10 am
Why are we banging on about yesterday ,it's gone ,we need to think about tomorrow.
We are were we deserve to be right now for a multitude of reasons and none of them are cheerful .
Its's where we go from here that's more important and whilst I have zero faith in the senior management ,our only hope right now is Arteta and a youth progression, forget huge wads and a top of the range manager it isn't coming .
We might all baulk at that but in my lifetime I've seen us rise Phoenix like twice over and without massive input of funds just people with a plan and a burning desire to win. Remember Martin{Zico} Hayes ,Perry Groves have a championship medal !
George Graham was lucky in that he had talented youngsters who had come though the system which a large part of was due to Mr Don Howe but he drilled them into winners . We scoff at the league cup now as spoiled bitches but the 3 semi finals against them were classic for our dogged resilience, beating Liverpool in the final (after rush scored first ) laid a foundation.
Similarly the arrival of Wenger had its luck in that the back 5 were the best unit going ,but bringing in Petite and Viera at what was considered cheap money at the time sent us on our way and gave DB10 some decent playmates . Things aint what they used to be but why can't it happen again without a billionaire pumping huge dosh in ?
I've followed this club since I was little ,they have surprised me and lifted me up so often that the bad times make the good times so much better .
I'm drunk but I mean this !



I too lived those good times and those bad times so I understand where you are coming from, but there are a few KEY differences between then and now.

1. Back in both of those era's there was no billionaire owners pumping cash into any club, so it was much easier to reach the pinnacle. These days there are at least 5 (with newcastle possibly joining them) clubs willing to pump in obscene money into their clubs in order to make them successful, and it needs huge dosh just to keep up with them much less overtake them.

2. We had a far better core of players in those squads, and we had a leadership structure in place that absolutely helped us succeed - GG has a resilience and a drive to win that he was able to instill in a young group of players, whilst wenger had the greatest defence ever seen in english football to build a team around. Arteta doesnt strike me as the type of coach willing to sacrifice style to be successful and he appears principled that way like wenger was (and we seen how that worked out :roll: ).

3. This is a biggie for me ......... arteta doesnt seem to want a youth progression - with the exception of the ozil situation (which has only happened post covid btw), everything arteta is doing is driving towards building a team around older players. This morning's papers are putting out the belief that the club are confident that willian will be signing for us at the transfer window (this has long been rumoured) - IF TRUE it would again go against any notion that we are going to build around young players, especially when you factor that we have a lot of young players that play in his position. For me willian is a player that on occasions can be unstoppable but has more average days than good days, and I would be absolutely against signing another old player and committing a big wedge to his back account.

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the playing mantis
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by the playing mantis »

2. Not defending him after the villa game debacle but the city game suggests arteta will be pragmatic in playing style wher applicable...or it could have been a freak.

3. i havnt seen this in times or telegraph? which papers?

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SteveO 35
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by SteveO 35 »

Herd wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:10 am
Why are we banging on about yesterday ,it's gone ,we need to think about tomorrow.
We are were we deserve to be right now for a multitude of reasons and none of them are cheerful .
Its's where we go from here that's more important and whilst I have zero faith in the senior management ,our only hope right now is Arteta and a youth progression, forget huge wads and a top of the range manager it isn't coming .
We might all baulk at that but in my lifetime I've seen us rise Phoenix like twice over and without massive input of funds just people with a plan and a burning desire to win. Remember Martin{Zico} Hayes ,Perry Groves have a championship medal !
George Graham was lucky in that he had talented youngsters who had come though the system which a large part of was due to Mr Don Howe but he drilled them into winners . We scoff at the league cup now as spoiled bitches but the 3 semi finals against them were classic for our dogged resilience, beating Liverpool in the final (after rush scored first ) laid a foundation.
Similarly the arrival of Wenger had its luck in that the back 5 were the best unit going ,but bringing in Petite and Viera at what was considered cheap money at the time sent us on our way and gave DB10 some decent playmates . Things aint what they used to be but why can't it happen again without a billionaire pumping huge dosh in ?
I've followed this club since I was little ,they have surprised me and lifted me up so often that the bad times make the good times so much better .
I'm drunk but I mean this !
Don't disagree with any of that except for the fact that our modern day superfan snobs and uninformed board would never take a chance on a British manager from a lower division - we'll always chase some overseas option as they must by definition all be amazing managers.

We also had Arsenal people on the board and owning the shares - now we have faceless marketeer c.unts !

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g88ner
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by g88ner »

augie wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:10 am

3. This is a biggie for me ......... arteta doesnt seem to want a youth progression - with the exception of the ozil situation (which has only happened post covid btw), everything arteta is doing is driving towards building a team around older players. This morning's papers are putting out the belief that the club are confident that willian will be signing for us at the transfer window (this has long been rumoured) - IF TRUE it would again go against any notion that we are going to build around young players, especially when you factor that we have a lot of young players that play in his position. For me willian is a player that on occasions can be unstoppable but has more average days than good days, and I would be absolutely against signing another old player and committing a big wedge to his back account.
Your third point is an interesting one. I think Martenelli was criminally underused (but I also read he might have been carrying a Knock after lockdown) but I don’t think you can accuse Arteta of being against youth progression.

Nketiah has played a lot of games (too many!) ahead of Lacazette.

Saka has played loads under Arteta at left midfield, right midfield and even centrally.

Ceballos is now a regular at centre midfield.

Tierney has played a lot at left back and centre back!

Willock must be the most used substitute under Arteta too.

I suppose maintland-Niles doesn’t play much but many on here wanted him out of the team under Emery so it’s not like he’s pulling up trees.

Then there’s Guendouzi who has been frozen out for non-Football reasons along with Ozil. It’s shit but I doubt it’s all Arteta’s fault?

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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by augie »

g88ner wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:56 pm
augie wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:10 am

3. This is a biggie for me ......... arteta doesnt seem to want a youth progression - with the exception of the ozil situation (which has only happened post covid btw), everything arteta is doing is driving towards building a team around older players. This morning's papers are putting out the belief that the club are confident that willian will be signing for us at the transfer window (this has long been rumoured) - IF TRUE it would again go against any notion that we are going to build around young players, especially when you factor that we have a lot of young players that play in his position. For me willian is a player that on occasions can be unstoppable but has more average days than good days, and I would be absolutely against signing another old player and committing a big wedge to his back account.
Your third point is an interesting one. I think Martenelli was criminally underused (but I also read he might have been carrying a Knock after lockdown) but I don’t think you can accuse Arteta of being against youth progression.

Nketiah has played a lot of games (too many!) ahead of Lacazette.

Saka has played loads under Arteta at left midfield, right midfield and even centrally.

Ceballos is now a regular at centre midfield.

Tierney has played a lot at left back and centre back!

Willock must be the most used substitute under Arteta too.

I suppose maintland-Niles doesn’t play much but many on here wanted him out of the team under Emery so it’s not like he’s pulling up trees.

Then there’s Guendouzi who has been frozen out for non-Football reasons along with Ozil. It’s shit but I doubt it’s all Arteta’s fault?



Everything is about perception I know that, but I have a slightly different view -

1. Mustafi and kolasniac ahead of holding and sokratis makes zero sense to me - people can point to holding's performance v villa as a justification for it, but the reality is that players rarely come into a team seamlessly if they hadnt been playing for a while, and holding has been out of the time for a while. I will also add that, if we are to judge a player based on only 1 or 2 games, then neither mustafi nor kolasniac would ever be seen again.

2. xhaka ahead of torreira and guendouzi is another shocker for me. Again people can point to guendouzi's off pitch issues as a reason to freeze him out, but prior to the covid lockdown guendouzi had started in only 2 of the 11 league games played under arteta, so he already knew that arteta didnt rate him. Torreira was injured for a while I know, but there is no way in the world any right minded person would start a fit xhaka ahead of a fit torreira, and yet that is what we are seeing all the time :roll:

3. I am a fan of sokratis but there can be no defense of starting him right back ahead of maitland niles, and yet it happened on a few occasions. It is only recently that amn has got back into the thoughts of the manager and that never pleased me. I know a lof of Gooners dont rate/like AMN (I am not one of them) but playing sokratis at right back ahead of him is taking the absolute piss

4. I am one of those that believe martinelli's subsequent injury has been a convenient deflection/excuse for why arteta didnt use him against brighton or citeeh - IF he was carrying a knock then why put him on the bench ? If you say that you need him there to risk him if we desperately need a goal, then I will say to you that we desperately needed a goal against brighton and he didnt use him :roll: His non use of martinelli in those games (especially against brighton) was disgraceful imo

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Herd
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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by Herd »

As usual when drunk you often forget what you were going to post . Which was who flew the plane over the Villa???? For once I have no clue !

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Re: Villa vulvas A Tue 21st KO 815pm

Post by DB10GOONER »

Herd wrote:
Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:53 am
As usual when drunk you often forget what you were going to post . Which was who flew the plane over the Villa???? For once I have no clue !
:lol:

What I like most was you started with the line "Why are we banging on about yesterday ,it's gone ,we need to think about tomorrow" and then proceeded to literally bang on about the past yourself for the rest of the post! :lol:

I like drunk Herd. :wink:

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