As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
Two 8th place finishes and this year a top half finish might be a hurdle to high for Arteta. Ive said it before. He isnt a Pep disciple or a graduate of Spain's pass master school. He never played for Spain and was miles away from Fabregas let alone Xavi or Iniesta. He isnt part of that club, he is just an imitator.
Antonio Conte is available right now. And what the club & squad needs is a disciplinarian and tactician, not a false disciple of La Masia trying to play 'beautiful football'.
I also think the players have no faith and respect for Arteta. Conte could do a better job with this group. I dont know why we drag it out and give Arteta more time when he has had two seasons and this previous pre season to prepare. We are worse now than when he took over. We arent moving toward anything, we are going backwards and clubs like West Ham and Everton and joining Leicester City in stamping their authority over us. Its not like they have any right too, we after all have bigger transfer budgets than all three.
We dont owe Arteta sh.. and why anyone who says Arteta 'deserves more time' should be considered an Arsenal saboteur.
At a normal “big” club of course he would be sacked.
However at a normal “big” club he would not have been appointed in the first place.
That is why I am hesitating - I really don’t see things getting much better if and when Arteta gets sacked.
As a club there appears to be no one capable of making any decent footballing decisions. Until the Kroenke’s go there is very little hope.
A club can run independent of an aloof and distant owner. The Glaziers have been at United since 2003 but Ferguson along with David Gill ran the ship. Im no Kroenke fan but a change of owner will do little. Perhaps you could blame them for putting up with Edu and Arteta and appointing them in the first place. But rest assured the team, player recruitment ect is all being run by Arteta and Edu. They have spent 132m this year and have been entrusted with serious money. In addition to the 132m spent this year, we also have some expensive signings still within the squad. Lacazette, PEA, Pepe, Xhaka, Partey all cost the club serious money (250m). Saliba and Torriera cost the club 50m and will do consecutive seasons out on loan.
I dont think the Liverpool owners are that great, But Klopp is in complete control and this doesn't expose them. If we had a high class manager who had a much higher hit rate in the transfer market, we would be in a better position that we would be with the Spotify guy and Arteta as manager.
We just need a good manager. Wenger final years were shit. Emery has proven to be decent given what Arteta has done to us, but even Emery was suspect, with Arteta himself being utterly useless. The last time we had a great manager, was Wenger in the late 2000's. 07-08 we had a great team and were playing good football and challenged for the title against a great Chelsea and United team. But Wenger performance post that season were horrible. He was in denial regarding our decline and entrusted some absolute lemons.
We haven't had a world class manager in the dugout in 13 years. All we need to do, is appoint one.
Conte would get us in the top 6 if appointed tomorrow
Great post mate. When people say "changing the manager won't change much" you almost wonder why bother having a manager at all
You've highlighted the fact that our squad is more expensive than all bar a handful of PL clubs
Conte, Simeone, Benitez could all do infinity better with it
Howe and Dyche could do better with it
The Kroenkes lack of investment for the past decade has been shocking
However this prize cock has been given far more cash than Wenger or Emery ever did in a single window and he has royally spunked it
90 games in charge and he doesn't have a clue what his starting line up is. He's playing Kolasinac and loaned out Saliba
Thats how much of an utterly incompetent c.unt he is
Imagine this scenario with any other club:
You have two shit players in Xhaka and Kolasinac that your trying to offload but no one is dumb enough to take them, then you give one of them a new contract and start both of them against the champions. Arteta is obviously a clueless *word censored* but the levels of incompetence behind the scenes are off the scales. These same twats will now give Arteta more money to waste in the next few days when everyone knows he needs to be sacked.
We have spent 130m this window the squad has gone backwards under Arteta, pre season looked a disaster and the season could not have started any worse.
Who has improved under him as a player? Struggling to name one. Simply no one has.
Martinelli has regressed used sparingly and Emery for all his faults brang the likes of him Saka in and developed them.
If Mari is a better CB than Saliba then he must be beyond awful?
If we are investing in young players and he isn't better than Mari let alone Chambers, Holding or Kolasinac I have to ask 27m on a guy who has not been given a chance?
None of it makes any sense and keeping a manager who out of his depth and he's not going to turn it around is cowardly from the board.
Re. impact of Kroenke vs Manager
The way I see it, I think two different threads of the debate are getting mixed up.
It was about five years ago that people were claiming, correctly, that we could never hope to compete for trophies on any regular basis with Man City, Chelsea, and to a lesser extent Man Utd, under the club model of stingy/disinterested Owner + "happy to be financially handicapped" manager (Wenger). That still is largely correct and still holds true today.
However, for many of our younger fans, the thought of competing for the PL and CL trophies exist only in some fantastical mythical past - such has been the decline and mismanagement the past 15 years. Now it really is now the 4th Place Trophy.
And in the battle for that 4th place trophy, yes, a half decent manger would make one hell of a difference in competing with Liverpool, Tottenham, Leicester and Everton for that one remaining precious CL spot.
Of course winning the league some time in the next 20 seasons is theoretically possible with Kroenke still at the helm, but pretty unlikely, even if we get someone as tactically sound and inspiring as Klopp. Liverpool could well have to wait another 5-10 years for a second title with City being what they are, and thats if they can maintain their level for that long - highly unlikely.
You could envision Kroenke not selling even if actually got relegated - so really the priority for the club/fans right now must be appointing a competent manager and trying to get back into Europe.
Two 8th place finishes and this year a top half finish might be a hurdle to high for Arteta. Ive said it before. He isnt a Pep disciple or a graduate of Spain's pass master school. He never played for Spain and was miles away from Fabregas let alone Xavi or Iniesta. He isnt part of that club, he is just an imitator.
Antonio Conte is available right now. And what the club & squad needs is a disciplinarian and tactician, not a false disciple of La Masia trying to play 'beautiful football'.
I also think the players have no faith and respect for Arteta. Conte could do a better job with this group. I dont know why we drag it out and give Arteta more time when he has had two seasons and this previous pre season to prepare. We are worse now than when he took over. We arent moving toward anything, we are going backwards and clubs like West Ham and Everton and joining Leicester City in stamping their authority over us. Its not like they have any right too, we after all have bigger transfer budgets than all three.
We dont owe Arteta sh.. and why anyone who says Arteta 'deserves more time' should be considered an Arsenal saboteur.
At a normal “big” club of course he would be sacked.
However at a normal “big” club he would not have been appointed in the first place.
That is why I am hesitating - I really don’t see things getting much better if and when Arteta gets sacked.
As a club there appears to be no one capable of making any decent footballing decisions. Until the Kroenke’s go there is very little hope.
A club can run independent of an aloof and distant owner. The Glaziers have been at United since 2003 but Ferguson along with David Gill ran the ship. Im no Kroenke fan but a change of owner will do little. Perhaps you could blame them for putting up with Edu and Arteta and appointing them in the first place. But rest assured the team, player recruitment ect is all being run by Arteta and Edu. They have spent 132m this year and have been entrusted with serious money. In addition to the 132m spent this year, we also have some expensive signings still within the squad. Lacazette, PEA, Pepe, Xhaka, Partey all cost the club serious money (250m). Saliba and Torriera cost the club 50m and will do consecutive seasons out on loan.
I dont think the Liverpool owners are that great, But Klopp is in complete control and this doesn't expose them. If we had a high class manager who had a much higher hit rate in the transfer market, we would be in a better position that we would be with the Spotify guy and Arteta as manager.
We just need a good manager. Wenger final years were shit. Emery has proven to be decent given what Arteta has done to us, but even Emery was suspect, with Arteta himself being utterly useless. The last time we had a great manager, was Wenger in the late 2000's. 07-08 we had a great team and were playing good football and challenged for the title against a great Chelsea and United team. But Wenger performance post that season were horrible. He was in denial regarding our decline and entrusted some absolute lemons.
We haven't had a world class manager in the dugout in 13 years. All we need to do, is appoint one.
Conte would get us in the top 6 if appointed tomorrow
Fair enough.
I suppose I just no longer have any belief that the club can make a top managerial appointment anymore.
We could have had Knopp years ago, Tuchel was also available I seem to remember.
Maybe Kroenke just doesn’t want a top class manager though?
They might ask for more investment than he is prepared to give them. Arteta is the perfect yes man who won’t rock the boat.
I think there has been a slight sense of panic though in how totally incompetent he is, and are trying to let him buy his way out of the mess he is creating - which is of course just making things worse.
Two 8th place finishes and this year a top half finish might be a hurdle to high for Arteta. Ive said it before. He isnt a Pep disciple or a graduate of Spain's pass master school. He never played for Spain and was miles away from Fabregas let alone Xavi or Iniesta. He isnt part of that club, he is just an imitator.
Antonio Conte is available right now. And what the club & squad needs is a disciplinarian and tactician, not a false disciple of La Masia trying to play 'beautiful football'.
I also think the players have no faith and respect for Arteta. Conte could do a better job with this group. I dont know why we drag it out and give Arteta more time when he has had two seasons and this previous pre season to prepare. We are worse now than when he took over. We arent moving toward anything, we are going backwards and clubs like West Ham and Everton and joining Leicester City in stamping their authority over us. Its not like they have any right too, we after all have bigger transfer budgets than all three.
We dont owe Arteta sh.. and why anyone who says Arteta 'deserves more time' should be considered an Arsenal saboteur.
At a normal “big” club of course he would be sacked.
However at a normal “big” club he would not have been appointed in the first place.
That is why I am hesitating - I really don’t see things getting much better if and when Arteta gets sacked.
As a club there appears to be no one capable of making any decent footballing decisions. Until the Kroenke’s go there is very little hope.
A club can run independent of an aloof and distant owner. The Glaziers have been at United since 2003 but Ferguson along with David Gill ran the ship. Im no Kroenke fan but a change of owner will do little. Perhaps you could blame them for putting up with Edu and Arteta and appointing them in the first place. But rest assured the team, player recruitment ect is all being run by Arteta and Edu. They have spent 132m this year and have been entrusted with serious money. In addition to the 132m spent this year, we also have some expensive signings still within the squad. Lacazette, PEA, Pepe, Xhaka, Partey all cost the club serious money (250m). Saliba and Torriera cost the club 50m and will do consecutive seasons out on loan.
I dont think the Liverpool owners are that great, But Klopp is in complete control and this doesn't expose them. If we had a high class manager who had a much higher hit rate in the transfer market, we would be in a better position that we would be with the Spotify guy and Arteta as manager.
We just need a good manager. Wenger final years were shit. Emery has proven to be decent given what Arteta has done to us, but even Emery was suspect, with Arteta himself being utterly useless. The last time we had a great manager, was Wenger in the late 2000's. 07-08 we had a great team and were playing good football and challenged for the title against a great Chelsea and United team. But Wenger performance post that season were horrible. He was in denial regarding our decline and entrusted some absolute lemons.
We haven't had a world class manager in the dugout in 13 years. All we need to do, is appoint one.
Conte would get us in the top 6 if appointed tomorrow
Fair enough.
I suppose I just no longer have any belief that the club can make a top managerial appointment anymore.
We could have had Knopp years ago, Tuchel was also available I seem to remember.
Maybe Kroenke just doesn’t want a top class manager though?
They might ask for more investment than he is prepared to give them. Arteta is the perfect yes man who won’t rock the boat.
I think there has been a slight sense of panic though in how totally incompetent he is, and are trying to let him buy his way out of the mess he is creating - which is of course just making things worse.
I think our days of attracting Simeone, Conte or Tuchel have long since gone. The Kroenkes had the chance to do the right thing in 2014 and twice thereafter and decided to keep on the manager who started the decline. Now those big name managers wouldn't touch us with a barge pole.
What I don't understand however, is why they went for Arteta - a man whose coaching experience was limited to the biggest spenders in the land. If they wanted a manager who was content to work within a budget then they could have gone for Howe, Dyche, Farke and a whole host of others too.
We’re apparently one of the biggest teams in the world. One of the best run clubs in the world. We have an incredible young manager. We have an amazing young squad with fantastic spirit. We’re just a couple of missing pieces away from competing with the cream of Europe which is why we moved to the Emirates. Forget that we haven’t made the Champions League for five seasons now and get outplayed by Brentford etc
Perhaps if we’re bottom three with ten games to go we might panic. Until then, everything is awesome!
To excuse the owners in this debacle shows a real lack of understanding. The owners job is to get the best man for the job. These owners persisted with Wenger for YEARS after he should have been sacked. These owners appointed a novice to run a huge club - and we have people saying the owners are not the main problem???!!
Good owners would never have appointed Martinez-Lite. Good owners would never have let that mistake go this far and would have sacked him.
A poor manager is only ever a symptom of a wider disease in a club. The owners set the tone. The owners lead. Fucks sake.
To excuse the owners in this debacle shows a real lack of understanding. The owners job is to get the best man for the job. These owners persisted with Wenger for YEARS after he should have been sacked. These owners appointed a novice to run a huge club - and we have people saying the owners are not the main problem???!!
Good owners would never have appointed Martinez-Lite. Good owners would never have let that mistake go this far and would have sacked him.
A poor manager is only ever a symptom of a wider disease in a club. The owners set the tone. The owners lead. Fucks sake.
Great post and completely agree. The things that grates is that Sanlehi appointed him and he was supposedly a football man, but I think that the worm has turned my opinion on that. Fancy a good tequilla now
The only thing that will get rid of Kronker is a silly money offer from some other bored billionaire. That could happen next year or in fifty years. I wouldn’t bet on him selling even if we were relegated. He’d have left already if he were looking for an easy out. So at this stage who’s to blame is a moot point in a way. Arteta is a problem the club (and even the fans) have some semblance of control over. Kroenke is untouchable unfortunately.
Comments after marseille's win yesterday over st etienne
"Guendouzi's 23rd minute strike was his first of the season while Saliba's stats vs St Etienne were phenomenal.
The 20-year-old recorded 96 per cent pass accuracy, six successful dribbles from six attempted, one tackle, one interception, five clearances and eight out of 10 duels won.
After the game, Jacek Kulig tweeted: "What a player he (saliba) is. Enormous talent and a pure joy to watch."
Comments after marseille's win yesterday over st etienne
"Guendouzi's 23rd minute strike was his first of the season while Saliba's stats vs St Etienne were phenomenal.
The 20-year-old recorded 96 per cent pass accuracy, six successful dribbles from six attempted, one tackle, one interception, five clearances and eight out of 10 duels won.
After the game, Jacek Kulig tweeted: "What a player he (saliba) is. Enormous talent and a pure joy to watch."
#artetaknows
I'll concede on Saliba, but Guendopey is a prick and will fall out with everyone by october.
Comments after marseille's win yesterday over st etienne
"Guendouzi's 23rd minute strike was his first of the season while Saliba's stats vs St Etienne were phenomenal.
The 20-year-old recorded 96 per cent pass accuracy, six successful dribbles from six attempted, one tackle, one interception, five clearances and eight out of 10 duels won.
After the game, Jacek Kulig tweeted: "What a player he (saliba) is. Enormous talent and a pure joy to watch."
#artetaknows
I'll concede on Saliba, but Guendopey is a prick and will fall out with everyone by october.
Tbh it was Saliba that I was referring to anyway - guendouzi is gone with an obligation to buy so cant come back anyway. Saliba and torreira can still come back and be successful if this dopey c.unt gets fcuked out soon
Comments after marseille's win yesterday over st etienne
"Guendouzi's 23rd minute strike was his first of the season while Saliba's stats vs St Etienne were phenomenal.
The 20-year-old recorded 96 per cent pass accuracy, six successful dribbles from six attempted, one tackle, one interception, five clearances and eight out of 10 duels won.
After the game, Jacek Kulig tweeted: "What a player he (saliba) is. Enormous talent and a pure joy to watch."
#artetaknows
I watched that. Saliba wasn't exactly outstanding but had a decent game so that's a bit OTT with the gushing praise.
