Wenger doesn't know (and never did)

digger · Post by **digger** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:10 am

It's a good post, but you fail to mention a few things:

The back four were destined for the scrap heap when Wenger took over. They were all the wrong side of 30, out of shape and nowhere near as solid as they had been 2/3 years previously. Wenger revitalised their training plans, tweaked their positioning etc, and they were all able to extend their careers by a good 3/4 years..

Anelka - you say he was sold before he developed? I'd disagree; I'd say his form in 1997-99 for Arsenal was the best he has ever consistently managed, until signing for Chelsea. The player wanted to leave, the fans wanted him to leave, and we got an obscene amount of money for him. Good business.

Percy Dalton · Post by **Percy Dalton** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:28 am

I agree with some of the original points but I also disagree with a lot.

Wenger is held up as some sort of footballing god and rightly so in the past as he triumphs far outweighed his mistakes. However, that is no longer the case and there are no gleaming pots to hide behind.

All the time we was winning trophies we forgave him for the occasional appearance by players such as Caballero, transfers such as Jeffers and under use of gifted players such as Edu.

Then we was playing footbal admired around the world which was not only pretty but succesful. Now, we play a frustrating brand of football reliant on Plan A, there is no B, which while still admired for its technical craft has proved fruitless and flawed.

Wenger has laid himself open to criticism and I fully believe he deserves the stick he is taking from certain elements of the support. His team selections are at times mind boggling, his activity in the transfer market embarrasing and his rants and raves become more and more ludicrous!

Latest example being bemaoning the 25 man squad rule brought in to promote youth and home grown players. Erm Arsene..........what have you been championing since your arrival in England?

I won't slate Wenger and demonise him but I do think that he is a shadow of the man we saw five years ago and his aura and reputation are shot.

Post by **SPUDMASHER** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:33 am

I'd go along with that exept the bit about his reputation being shot. Certainly it has diminished somewhat recently but it isn't quite that bad yet. Give him a couple more years and then it will be!

marcengels · Post by **marcengels** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:40 am

Percy Dalton wrote:...Latest example being bemaoning the 25 man squad rule brought in to promote youth and home grown players. Erm Arsene..........what have you been championing since your arrival in England?...

He hasn't been championing the arbitrary nature of having to have a set number of "home-grown" players. He has been championing better standards of coaching.

Hence Eboue

Post by **DB10GOONER** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:53 am

marcengels wrote:
Percy Dalton wrote:...Latest example being bemaoning the 25 man squad rule brought in to promote youth and home grown players. Erm Arsene..........what have you been championing since your arrival in England?...
He hasn't been championing the arbitrary nature of having to have a set number of "home-grown" players. He has been championing better standards of coaching.

Hence Eboue

Is "Hence" Latin for "Fuck off"?

Post by **I Hate Hleb** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:07 am

merson_is_god wrote:Quality post, you make a good point and I'd agree with you on most of it. Good to see there are intelligent posters on here

But what do you think of frankbutcher?

Galasso · Post by **Galasso** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:09 am

I Hate Hleb wrote:
merson_is_god wrote:Quality post, you make a good point and I'd agree with you on most of it. Good to see there are intelligent posters on here
But what do you think of frankbutcher?

the more things change, the more they stay the same, eh IHH?

Post by **I Hate Hleb** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:12 am

Galasso · Post by **Galasso** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:17 am

I mean, the quality of your posts are always high

Post by **I Hate Hleb** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:20 am

cusamano · Post by **cusamano** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:05 am

marcengels wrote:
Bring Back Pires wrote:Between 2002-2005, we were the best team in the world. No doubts about it. .
Bollocks. Our pathetic attempts at the European Cup would beg to differ.

Me too.
Good team, but by far not the best in the world.

goonersid · Post by **goonersid** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:39 am

QuartzGooner wrote:The famous back six I suppose you can call "luck".
Parlour, Wright and Bergkamp too.

But Wenger had the judgement to keep these players when others considered them past their sell by date, and to actually sell them at the right time.

But he has made some good purchases and shrewd sales too, that indicate he has a lot more than luck.

A lot of the "failures" you list were amongst many squad players whom any top modern club would buy and sell in large numbers.

I think the decreased budget caused by the new stadium, increased resources of main competitors, and general "Wear and Tear" (such as the premature falling aprt of the 2007 - 2008 Mark Three Wenger Team), have taken the edge of Wenger.
I also think we have an injury problem at the club that needs in depth investigation, which the club are now doing.

These are the success stories, and there are a lot of them:

Vieira
Petit
Anelka (large profit)
Overmars
Kanu
Henry
Edu
Grimandi
Gilberto
Lauren
Sol Campbell
Ljungberg
Pires
Toure
Fabregas
Vermaelen
Flamini
Sagna
Clichy
Lehman
Eduardo (pre-injury, outside of Wenger's control)

Rosetinted glasses on with some of those Quartz, some decent players there fair enough, but that hardly makes them a success story.

Bendtners Drinking Buddy · Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:41 am

A load of old tosh - such a subjective post and only your over-negative peers would agree that Wenger had never done anything for this club - id go as far to say its the single worst post ive read on here.

"Graveyard for English talent" - all English players that were good enough for Arsenal were given a chance - look up how many english players came through our academy and had a football career for other sides - good players, but were just not good enough for Arsenal.

Wenger is, and always will be a legend at this club for what he has done and only an idiot would say he has "never known". He has faults now, the team has faults now - and while i dont agree that he should go by any stretch i respect some people's view they want him to go. Its the blatant lack of respect by some people that is frustrating.

hows the green and gold...sorry, black scarf movement going?

Post by **I Hate Hleb** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:53 am

Bendtners Drinking Buddy wrote:A load of old tosh - such a subjective post and only your over-negative peers would agree that Wenger had never done anything for this club - id go as far to say its the single worst post ive read on here...

Steady on there BDB. It's got plenty of competition!!

AA23Northbank · Post by **AA23Northbank** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:53 am

Bendtners Drinking Buddy wrote:A load of old tosh - such a subjective post and only your over-negative peers would agree that Wenger had never done anything for this club - id go as far to say its the single worst post ive read on here.

"Graveyard for English talent" - all English players that were good enough for Arsenal were given a chance - look up how many english players came through our academy and had a football career for other sides - good players, but were just not good enough for Arsenal.

Wenger is, and always will be a legend at this club for what he has done and only an idiot would say he has "never known". He has faults now, the team has faults now - and while i dont agree that he should go by any stretch i respect some people's view they want him to go. Its the blatant lack of respect by some people that is frustrating.

hows the green and gold...sorry, black scarf movement going?

Exactly.
Also AW said when he took over that it'll take at least 10 years for good English players to come through at Arsenal due to poor technical abilities and bad habits picked up. In Wilshere, Gibbs and Frimpong you're starting to see the first of many talented, young English players coming through and playing for the Arsenal.