Mikel Arteta, success or failure? - Merged thread.

[mcdowell42]

DB merging this tomorrow with the already Arteta thread

[A11M11]

And will be hamstrung by the fact that he is there to coach . Sanllehi , Fahmy , Edu and Venkatesham will be doing the buying and selling . He no doubt will have a wish list but they will make the final decisions.

[GoonerMuzz]

And will be hamstrung by the fact that he is there to coach . Sanllehi , Fahmy , Edu and Venkatesham will be doing the buying and selling . He no doubt will have a wish list but they will make the final decisions.

Whilst true the same applies for Emery, although he should have been able to have more say than Arteta will...... whether he did or not is a different story

[rodders999]

Anyone know how many games we went unbeaten during that run last season?

I’m sure it was mentioned here once but I can’t seem to find the post?

[gazzatt2]

how are the Emery fan boys this weekend ?
after there GOATS's weekend

Dyhce out thought tactically by Mourhinio

Ancelotti schooled by Fat Frank

[DB10GOONER]

DB merging this tomorrow with the already Arteta thread

Done.

[DB10GOONER]

Anyone know how many games we went unbeaten during that run last season?

I’m sure it was mentioned here once but I can’t seem to find the post?

[DB10GOONER]

I'll take a shocking performance every time if we win Augie

Agree 100% with you mc - the point I am making is that there are still some pointing to mythical improvements (see today's game thread), which are not there. We won and have made up ground on those above us, but we are still playing shit and will continue to play shit as long as the team is infiltrated by sub-standard c.unts like xhaka, and ozil, and players like pepe who are not good enough -

The goalposts move regularly, the previous manager won a lot of games in his first year but that was never enough, it needed to be like 1970s Brazil or the 3 points were devalued, now we will take a win even if the performance is shocking.

All luck last season mate - every single minute of those 22 games! Not like this year's unbeaten run (the one that conveniently forgets about losing to Olympiacos so isn't actually a run at all).

City up next and we'll see how the luck carries on against Wolves, Leicester, Scum and Mickeys next month

Can either of you two lads point the rest of us to the posts that called every minute of the 22 game unbeaten run "luck" please? No?

[SteveO 35]

Anyone know how many games we went unbeaten during that run last season?

I’m sure it was mentioned here once but I can’t seem to find the post?

While you're researching it would be handy too if someone could find out how many shots Watford had against us earlier in the season too - a rarely mentioned stat round these parts

[mcdowell42]

Anyone know how many games we went unbeaten during that run last season?

I’m sure it was mentioned here once but I can’t seem to find the post?

While you're researching it would be handy too if someone could find out how many shots Watford had against us earlier in the season too - a rarely mentioned stat round these parts

Was it 22

[gooner265]

Quite simply whether you are for or against either manager you have to give him the same time as Emery was allowed before you can compare the two . The problem is two things here , firstly no-one wanted Arteta so he is being judged more harshly than Emery when he first arrive and secondly he is giving second chances to players most fans despise and wanted gone .This doesn't win him any friends and buy him time , if he had dropped and alienated all three I think he would be getting more sympathy.

[SteveO 35]

Quite simply whether you are for or against either manager you have to give him the same time as Emery was allowed before you can compare the two . The problem is two things here , firstly no-one wanted Arteta so he is being judged more harshly than Emery when he first arrive and secondly he is giving second chances to players most fans despise and wanted gone .This doesn't win him any friends and buy him time , if he had dropped and alienated all three I think he would be getting more sympathy.

The unbeaten run that this forum wants airbrushed from history started at Emery's 3rd game in charge (the first two being against the champions from the previous two seasons), but yet those same folk who now say what a load of shit it was are saying its way too early to be judging Arteta. How that works god only knows...

I didn't want Arteta as manager but it doesn't mean I won't be humble enough if he outperforms Emery and leads us to better things, to come out and say I was wrong.

Emery lost 2 of his first 24 games as manager - against a City side that went on and got 100 points and a very unlucky, narrow defeat at the Chavs (where Comedy Iwobi couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo). Arteta has lost 2 of his first 14 - one also against the Chavs which was his first game, and other against Olympiacos which was as shambolic display as I've seen in seasons. If he goes on to lead us through April not having lost any of those fixtures and in line for a CL place then I will gladly eat huge helpings of humble pie and say what an amazing job he has done. I like the bloke - did as a player, and no axe to grind with him as person or even his philosophy for playing the game. City probably are missing him as a coach. I just think a transitional Arsenal like this with a c.unt of an owner is such a massive gamble for a first timer. Pep cut his teeth on a Barca side that had the finest player on the planet, and a midfield that won everything for club and country. Arteta has got the players Dick couldn't offload and a few promising kids. If he gets us into a CL finish, I'd say he's done a better job than the early days of Pep's.

I do also agree with your point about the players he has restored and that is my main gripe. I read the West Ham thread and saw Xhaka coming in for the sort of stick again that he did under previous managers. He was absolutely gone (even if on loan) in the January window, probably along with Mustafi and possibly Lacazette too. I haven't seen anything that would make me change my views on those 3 over the past few weeks so that feels like a missed opportunity. Whilst some might say they deserve to be given a clean slate, in this day and age where you can watch footage of every minute of every game, I believe its a sad mistake to be reinstating a bloke who has played 100+ times and who for the best part has been shit every time

[Clash]

Quite simply whether you are for or against either manager you have to give him the same time as Emery was allowed before you can compare the two . The problem is two things here , firstly no-one wanted Arteta so he is being judged more harshly than Emery when he first arrive and secondly he is giving second chances to players most fans despise and wanted gone .This doesn't win him any friends and buy him time , if he had dropped and alienated all three I think he would be getting more sympathy.

The unbeaten run that this forum wants airbrushed from history started at Emery's 3rd game in charge (the first two being against the champions from the previous two seasons), but yet those same folk who now say what a load of shit it was are saying its way too early to be judging Arteta. How that works god only knows...

I didn't want Arteta as manager but it doesn't mean I won't be humble enough if he outperforms Emery and leads us to better things, to come out and say I was wrong.

Emery lost 2 of his first 24 games as manager - against a City side that went on and got 100 points and a very unlucky, narrow defeat at the Chavs (where Comedy Iwobi couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo). Arteta has lost 2 of his first 14 - one also against the Chavs which was his first game, and other against Olympiacos which was as shambolic display as I've seen in seasons. If he goes on to lead us through April not having lost any of those fixtures and in line for a CL place then I will gladly eat huge helpings of humble pie and say what an amazing job he has done. I like the bloke - did as a player, and no axe to grind with him as person or even his philosophy for playing the game. City probably are missing him as a coach. I just think a transitional Arsenal like this with a c.unt of an owner is such a massive gamble for a first timer. Pep cut his teeth on a Barca side that had the finest player on the planet, and a midfield that won everything for club and country. Arteta has got the players Dick couldn't offload and a few promising kids. If he gets us into a CL finish, I'd say he's done a better job than the early days of Pep's.

I do also agree with your point about the players he has restored and that is my main gripe. I read the West Ham thread and saw Xhaka coming in for the sort of stick again that he did under previous managers. He was absolutely gone (even if on loan) in the January window, probably along with Mustafi and possibly Lacazette too. I haven't seen anything that would make me change my views on those 3 over the past few weeks so that feels like a missed opportunity. Whilst some might say they deserve to be given a clean slate, in this day and age where you can watch footage of every minute of every game, I believe its a sad mistake to be reinstating a bloke who has played 100+ times and who for the best part has been shit every time

Interesting points as always mate.

And with regard to the highlighted part, I think a clean slate under a new manager is fair enough if you are talking about a players conduct or off field behaviour. They just might not have got on with a previous manager for whatever reason and it would have negatively affected their game.

But when it comes to the performance and ability of a player it is nonsense to think you can give a player like Xhaka a fresh start. Quite simply he is a lost cause because he is absolutely shit! No manager anywhere will ever get anything worth having from him and this is the biggest question mark against Arteta so far for me. I will hold off until the summer before making too big of a thing about it but if Arteta doesnt take the opportunity at the end of the season to get him out and replace him with something better (surely not hard to find) then it will become a massive black mark against the manager,

[augie]

It is the last paragraph that I agree with and winds me up the most - having grown up in an era where we were still known as The Arsenal and had a classy reputation that other clubs were envious of, it saddens me that we have allowed a dogshit player to abuse the fans like he did, and still come out and play for the club again. There is no defending that in my mind - if it was the last game of the season and we needed to play xhaka to win the league or avoid relegation, I would honestly say that I would rather lose the game than play him again. Some fans will slate me on that, but they are the same fans who will openly say that football has sold it's soul, and yet they would happily sell out the respect and pride of a club for the sake of one trophy.
I will happily admit that I don't hate mustafi or even dislike him - he is an honest defender who is just nowhere near the required level

[DB10GOONER]

Quite simply whether you are for or against either manager you have to give him the same time as Emery was allowed before you can compare the two . The problem is two things here , firstly no-one wanted Arteta so he is being judged more harshly than Emery when he first arrive and secondly he is giving second chances to players most fans despise and wanted gone .This doesn't win him any friends and buy him time , if he had dropped and alienated all three I think he would be getting more sympathy.

The unbeaten run that this forum wants airbrushed from history started at Emery's 3rd game in charge (the first two being against the champions from the previous two seasons), but yet those same folk who now say what a load of shit it was are saying its way too early to be judging Arteta. How that works god only knows...

Steve mate you are just making stuff up now ffs!

Who on this forum wants the 22 game unbeaten run "airbrushed from history"? I think most of us enjoyed that run and gave both Emery and the players due credit - but also admitted to ourselves and each other that we were poor at times during it and we were lucky at times during it. And after the run was over Emery got steadily worse and so did the results culminating in the PL collapse and the EL final debacle.

I mean honestly should we all have ignored Wenger's last disastrous 10 years because he went unbeaten in 2004? I know that's an extreme comparison but I think it's relevant enough.

Don't recall anyone saying the 22 game unbeaten run was "a load of shit" either.

You are looking for a conspiracy here where there is none mate.

Arteta for me was the wrong choice (as Dick ultimately also proved to be) but he has to be given the same chance as Dick to get it right before he can be fairly judged I suppose. Having said that if the club sacked him tomorrow and brought in Simeone or Allegri I'm not sure too many of us would complain tbh.....