The Rooney Rule

Post by **Barriecuda** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:42 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rooney_Rule

For those of you who don't know, it's an American pigskin football rule where all teams must interview at least one visible minority for a coaching position.

Have heard some rumblings that some in the FA want to try it. Thoughts?

Post by **REB** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:47 pm

the mirror are trying there best to bring it in.
best man for the job no matter what creed or colour is my opinion. i dont see why clubs should be forced to interview someone because he comes from a minority.

arseofacrow · Post by **arseofacrow** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:49 pm

Might increase the number of English managers in the Premier League

Post by **QuartzGooner** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:57 pm

Certainly there are few Black managers and coaches compared to the amount of Black players.

I think it a good thing as it encourages meritocracy without forcing a club to take an unsuitable candidate for a job.

rodders999 · Post by **rodders999** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:01 pm

arseofacrow wrote:Might increase the number of English managers in the Premier League

Or at least decrease the number of French ones.

Babatunde · Post by **Babatunde** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:02 pm

REBEL GOONER wrote:the mirror are trying there best to bring it in.
best man for the job no matter what creed or colour is my opinion. i dont see why clubs should be forced to interview someone because he comes from a minority.

It does not force clubs to give a minority the job.
It forces them to give them an opportunity to interview for it.

That cannot be a bad thing. As a white person can still end up always getting the job...

safcftm · Post by **safcftm** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:05 pm

Well, firstly I'm against "positive discrimination" in any form. The idea that because black people were unfairly held back in the past they should now be unfairly pushed forwards is a fucking joke imo. The best thing to do is forget about the past and treat everyone equally. If a black lad is the best man for the job, he should get it, if he isnt, he shouldnt.

Also though, its actually a completely pointless PR exercise. It sounds good, but in practice since they cant force a team to actually appoint a black bloke it wont change anything. If a club doesnt want a black manager, they'll simply interview one black bloke to tick the box and give the job to the white bloke they want to give the job to. If a club would happily consider appointing a black manager then they would do so regardless of the "rooney rule", if the right black man applied, he'd get the job. So whats the benefit of it? A few black lads get dragged along to an interview for a job that they have no chance of getting because the club has already decided who they want. Fucking waste of time

It is very strange how few black managers there are given the % of black players in england (since almost all managers are ex-players you'd expect a similar percentage to go into management) but having said that, whilst there is obviously an element of institutionalised racism in that respect, it also just seems that for whatever reason not many black players try to get into management. I cant say i can think of many black players who have tried and tried to get managerial jobs and never got one. Maybe Paul Ince could have hoped to have started at a higher level but then he has since proved himself to be fairly shit as a manager.

rodders999 · Post by **rodders999** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:06 pm

Babatunde wrote: It does not force clubs to give a minority the job.
It forces them to give them an opportunity to interview for it.

That cannot be a bad thing. As a white person can still end up always getting the job...

Is that meant to be intentionally racist?

Post by **REB** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:07 pm

Babatunde wrote:
REBEL GOONER wrote:the mirror are trying there best to bring it in.
best man for the job no matter what creed or colour is my opinion. i dont see why clubs should be forced to interview someone because he comes from a minority.
It does not force clubs to give a minority the job.
It forces them to give them an opportunity to interview for it.

That cannot be a bad thing. As a white person can still end up always getting the job...

i never said it did. i said it would force a club to interview a minority not give the job because someone was a minority.

Henry Norris 1913 · Post by **Henry Norris 1913** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:18 pm

oh no, not many black or asian managers in the football league, we must make english clubs interview at least one minority , then no-one can be accused of prejudice!

:sunshine_happy:

the world is a better place now, thanks pc brigade . next stop: force clubs to employ at least 10 physically handicapped ballboys. yes they won't be very quick at getting the ball back into play, but we mustn't be discriminatory

Babatunde · Post by **Babatunde** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:27 pm

safcftm wrote:Well, firstly I'm against "positive discrimination" in any form. The idea that because black people were unfairly held back in the past they should now be unfairly pushed forwards is a fucking joke imo. The best thing to do is forget about the past and treat everyone equally. If a black lad is the best man for the job, he should get it, if he isnt, he shouldnt.

Also though, its actually a completely pointless PR exercise. It sounds good, but in practice since they cant force a team to actually appoint a black bloke it wont change anything. If a club doesnt want a black manager, they'll simply interview one black bloke to tick the box and give the job to the white bloke they want to give the job to. If a club would happily consider appointing a black manager then they would do so regardless of the "rooney rule", if the right black man applied, he'd get the job. So whats the benefit of it? A few black lads get dragged along to an interview for a job that they have no chance of getting because the club has already decided who they want. Fucking waste of time

It is very strange how few black managers there are given the % of black players in england (since almost all managers are ex-players you'd expect a similar percentage to go into management) but having said that, whilst there is obviously an element of institutionalised racism in that respect, it also just seems that for whatever reason not many black players try to get into management. I cant say i can think of many black players who have tried and tried to get managerial jobs and never got one. Maybe Paul Ince could have hoped to have started at a higher level but then he has since proved himself to be fairly shit as a manager.

1. Perhaps not many black managers don't bother going into management for the same reason that I refuse to keep paying for flowers to be delivered to Helena Christensen's door: POINTLESS excercise.

2. This is not positive discrimination. Affirmative action is. No advantage is accrued from the actual outcome. What it does do, is to generate the opportunity for people who would otherwise potentially not even come under consideration. I repeat: it doesn't force anyone to give anyone a job, unlike the US.

3. This rule doesn't force any quotas, you seem to be confused on this one dude. They wouldn't have to drag any old black managers along BUT if any black managers did apply, they'd be obliged to give at least one an interview based on competence criteria

I think, with all due respect, it is very easy for middle-aged white men to cast aspersions on what does and does not constitute racism without ever actually having undergone it themselves. It does make me laugh at times! It's easy to be dismissive of just how far-fetched and institutional racism is in so many facets of life, unless again, you've undergone it yourself.

No one is forced to give a minority a job with this rule and I agree with you Sunderland man that the BEST man for the job should always be the one who gets it. Then again, take a look at someone like Lawrie Sanchez at Fulham or someone like Billy Davies at Preston, and tell me there wasn't a single capable black/ethnic manager anywhere that could have done an equal/better job?

I agree with you that perhaps they just don't apply. So ask yourself: WHY do they not apply?

dudbux · Post by **dudbux** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:31 pm

how many football clubs actually interview?

Dont most have 1 person in mind, if he is available then done deal, if not they go to second on the list.

I doubt the have 5 names, get them all in and play them off against each other, especially in the prem league.

skizz_b · Post by **skizz_b** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:38 pm

I'll be honest here, I thought this was going to be about something to the effect of "bang three grannies and you qualify for a free hair transplant".

Post by **I Hate Hleb** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:51 pm

But Babatunde, how long would it be before people started moaning 'despite all the additional black managers that got an interview, only bla, bla percentage actually got a job!' and there would be a similar outcry for that. I think we can all guess what the next logical step from there would be.

MegaGooner · Post by **MegaGooner** » Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:56 pm

skizz_b wrote:I'll be honest here, I thought this was going to be about something to the effect of "bang three grannies and you qualify for a free hair transplant".

Me too