CoronaVirus Latest

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SteveO 35
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by SteveO 35 »

With 1 in every 3 people with the virus supposedly completely asymptomatic, and university estimates at somewhere between 6m and 16m in the UK having contracted the virus as far back as May this year......one wonders when the 'maths' combining herd immunity plus the vaccinated community will start bringing cases downwards on a daily basis? Even the more cautious Cambridge Uni study predicted that 6.1m in England alone were likely to have contracted the virus by the end of May. 7 months later what would that figure have grown to?? Surely if the first case was here as recently as January/February, even with the lockdown measures in April/May, we would now be at between double and treble that number. If BJ is then saying millions will be vaccinated by the end of Q1, and we are detecting 50,000 cases+ per day......surely somewhere around half the population of England will either have had the virus or been vaccinated by end of March?

Need some light at the end of the tunnel !

A11M11
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by A11M11 »

Much of the problem is that nobody actually knows how long immunity lasts after infection . I have seen estimates saying permanent , 9 months and even 3 months.
To meet with vaccination probably 40 to 50 million would need to be injected to reach a figure of 60 plus % .
But it's all ifs and maybe's as there is no concrete evidence and won't be until it all pans out.

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

SteveO 35 wrote:
Sun Jan 03, 2021 1:36 pm
With 1 in every 3 people with the virus supposedly completely asymptomatic, and university estimates at somewhere between 6m and 16m in the UK having contracted the virus as far back as May this year......one wonders when the 'maths' combining herd immunity plus the vaccinated community will start bringing cases downwards on a daily basis? Even the more cautious Cambridge Uni study predicted that 6.1m in England alone were likely to have contracted the virus by the end of May. 7 months later what would that figure have grown to?? Surely if the first case was here as recently as January/February, even with the lockdown measures in April/May, we would now be at between double and treble that number. If BJ is then saying millions will be vaccinated by the end of Q1, and we are detecting 50,000 cases+ per day......surely somewhere around half the population of England will either have had the virus or been vaccinated by end of March?

Need some light at the end of the tunnel !
Herd immunity kicks in when over 70% of the population have contracted the virus, this is the figure used by the scientists when it comes to the number of people that need to be vaccinated to kill the vaccine off once and for all.

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SteveO 35
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by SteveO 35 »

nut flush gooner wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 6:32 am
SteveO 35 wrote:
Sun Jan 03, 2021 1:36 pm
With 1 in every 3 people with the virus supposedly completely asymptomatic, and university estimates at somewhere between 6m and 16m in the UK having contracted the virus as far back as May this year......one wonders when the 'maths' combining herd immunity plus the vaccinated community will start bringing cases downwards on a daily basis? Even the more cautious Cambridge Uni study predicted that 6.1m in England alone were likely to have contracted the virus by the end of May. 7 months later what would that figure have grown to?? Surely if the first case was here as recently as January/February, even with the lockdown measures in April/May, we would now be at between double and treble that number. If BJ is then saying millions will be vaccinated by the end of Q1, and we are detecting 50,000 cases+ per day......surely somewhere around half the population of England will either have had the virus or been vaccinated by end of March?

Need some light at the end of the tunnel !
Herd immunity kicks in when over 70% of the population have contracted the virus, this is the figure used by the scientists when it comes to the number of people that need to be vaccinated to kill the vaccine off once and for all.
Understand that, but wondered when the projections would get us to that level? If somewhere approaching 16m supposedly could have contracted the virus up to the end of May, and we're now running at 55,000+ new infections per day plus all of those between May and now............can't be too deep into 2021 before we would get to that number. Now, the issue of course is that unless everyone undertakes the antibody test we will never know.....but surely the natural trend will be that less infections start incurring..............unless of course people are unlucky enough to contract the virus twice within a few months

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

SteveO 35 wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 8:53 am
nut flush gooner wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 6:32 am
SteveO 35 wrote:
Sun Jan 03, 2021 1:36 pm
With 1 in every 3 people with the virus supposedly completely asymptomatic, and university estimates at somewhere between 6m and 16m in the UK having contracted the virus as far back as May this year......one wonders when the 'maths' combining herd immunity plus the vaccinated community will start bringing cases downwards on a daily basis? Even the more cautious Cambridge Uni study predicted that 6.1m in England alone were likely to have contracted the virus by the end of May. 7 months later what would that figure have grown to?? Surely if the first case was here as recently as January/February, even with the lockdown measures in April/May, we would now be at between double and treble that number. If BJ is then saying millions will be vaccinated by the end of Q1, and we are detecting 50,000 cases+ per day......surely somewhere around half the population of England will either have had the virus or been vaccinated by end of March?

Need some light at the end of the tunnel !
Herd immunity kicks in when over 70% of the population have contracted the virus, this is the figure used by the scientists when it comes to the number of people that need to be vaccinated to kill the vaccine off once and for all.
Understand that, but wondered when the projections would get us to that level? If somewhere approaching 16m supposedly could have contracted the virus up to the end of May, and we're now running at 55,000+ new infections per day plus all of those between May and now............can't be too deep into 2021 before we would get to that number. Now, the issue of course is that unless everyone undertakes the antibody test we will never know.....but surely the natural trend will be that less infections start incurring..............unless of course people are unlucky enough to contract the virus twice within a few months
If Infection rate is 55,000 per day that's 1.65m per month times by 5 so based on the figure you have quoted we wouldn't even be halfway there (42m = 70%). In reality, I am not convinced 16m have been infected including asymptomatics.

That's why the vaccine is the game-changer. If you can vaccinate 20m older and clinically vulnerable people by May it puts us in a position where the death rates will fall dramatically, because the groups who are most susceptible even if they get COVID won't be sick enough to be hospitalised or die. That's what the clinical trials have shown. We shall see if that works out over time.
Last edited by nut flush gooner on Mon Jan 04, 2021 12:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

augie wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:04 am
nut flush gooner wrote:
Sat Dec 19, 2020 7:46 pm
https://twitter.com/rupert_pearse/statu ... 0052290560

Great tweet from an ICU doctor, note what he says about the economy he's spot on.

"People debate impacts on the economy versus public health as if it’s a straight trade-off. It’s not. Poor health leads to poor wealth. A simple fact. It’s not credible that anyone would claim to care about economic impact on the little guy, but not worry if they live or die. 8/10"

People who haven't followed guidance only have themselves to blame.



And the ICU doctor is totally ignoring the impact lockdown's and the economy has on government departments - reality is that if people are losing their jobs or are on the pup scheme they are not paying taxes, and it is those very taxes that are paying the wages of that icu doctor and all his colleagues, and are running hospitals. That icu doctor (and his ilk) will be the very one's slating the governments for a lack of funding to tackle ongoing health problems (not just covid) and the lack of resources :roll:
I'm not dissing or belittling the work that the people in the health care system in countries all over the world are doing because no doubt they are doing trojan work, but isnt that what they were trained for and are paid for ? I can only talk about here in Ireland so I dunno if it is the same in (former european state :wink: ) uk, but over here our health care workers are being cannonised, and our teachers are complaining about the stress and pressure on them and the fact that they are being put at risk - I'm sorry but arent they being paid big bucks to educate our kids ?? There are shop workers, bakers, dairy workers and general factory workers who are working every day for a fraction of the wages teachers are on, but are doing so to ensure that all of us (inc teachers) have food on our tables, and there isnt a word from them (or their unions) looking for them to be allowed sit home on full wages :evil:

It seems to me that people have put too much faith in the plan that the vaccine will get the world back on it's feet again - the world health organisation have come out publicly and stated that the vaccines will not stop us getting covid and nor will it stop us transmitting it to others, so how significant a difference can it make ?? It seems (from all the medical statements coming from the qualified people) that the only way this virus is going anywhere is when enough people contract the virus and their bodies build an immunity to it, and lockdowns certainly wont help that. Are we looking at another 12 months of this shit ? We are 9 months into now and can we honestly say that we have made any progress ? This is my gripe when people call for schools to be closed down - should we consign our youth to an extended spell with no education ? What will we be doing to their futures both academically and job wise ? Are we expecting all these kids to stay home for as long as it takes to rid the world of this virus ? Are we expecting to take away their time in schools, their time playing sports and not expect them to go out meeting their friends during all that free time they have ? Given that the devil plays with (some) idle minds, do we believe that we wont see an increase in public order incidents when groups of kids meet up together in parks or towns ? I get that there understandable knee jerk demands for schools to be closed down and if it was a short term action that would make a significant long term impact I would support it - the reality is though that every time the countries open up a bit the numbers go through the roof again, and we need to accept that we are gonna need to live with this and face up to it
You've made quite a lot of points here Augie, so I am going to address the lives versus economy debate that is playing out in the UK and I suspect probably is in Ireland as well.

The point about the WHO saying taking the vaccine doesn't guarantee you from getting COVID is a valid point. However, the vaccine creates enough antibodies/T cells to prevent hospitalisations and death in older/vulnerable groups. So if the death rate from COVID is three to five times that of seasonal flu, and the vaccination brings that right down and it should do with the quoted efficacy percentages, then vaccinating the population is the way out of this over just allowing herd immunity to kick in which would cost hundreds of thousands more UK lives.

This is the thing with allowing or trying to allow the economy to function normally by not having lockdowns, inevitably the health service gets overrun, and that leads to a situation where people who are younger who may not get treatment for conditions that may be life-threatening. Not only that as a consumer-orientated economy, the confidence of the population to go out and spend their money because of the fear of infection would also severely diminish.

Then you have the situation of dealing with the aftermath of COVID ripping through 68 million people. Say 20m actually get symptomatic COVID and a proportion of this group get long COVID. The burden of dealing with long term health conditions for this number of people for the NHS would be huge and inevitably cost the economy billions in lost productivity and additional healthcare funding requirements. Then let's be honest we are an unhealthy nation of fat bastards, that in itself costs billions in healthcare costs both COVID and non-COVID related.

Looking at other countries, in particular, those in Asia who have dealt with the pandemic better than we have and the US whose economy seems to be weathering the covid storm despite a shocking death toll leads me to one conclusion. The fabric of our economy is broken, we have allowed our manufacturing base to whittle away to nothing, to the extent we can't make things like ventilators at short notice or on the technology side despite being responsible for the first vaccines to gain approval for widescale use, they have to be manufactured overseas. And yet pubs not being allowed to open in this country is a big deal despite a lot of landlords not really looking after their patrons by not disclosing covid outbreaks. Something is not quite right there. China's economy is pretty much back to normal, ok their authorities took draconian measures to ensure it didn't spread around the country away from Wuhan but look at Taiwan, Singapore and Japan. All of these countries managed.

As things stand, even with full/semi lockdowns people haven't followed the guidelines and done the right thing so the NHS is on the verge of being overwhelmed anyway. But that is of our own doing really, I have said this before on this thread I have absolutely no time for the muppets who think they have a divine right to do what they like while millions of people are following the guidelines socially distance etc. And that's the thing if as a collective had followed the guidance, then the new strain wouldn't have taken such a grip and the infection rates wouldn't be out of control.

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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by Gunner Rob »

what we are currently seeing is a slow motion action replay of the middle of March.

Boris back then you might recall dithered for about a week before imposing a national lockdown, and the same thing is happening all over again right now! Unbelievable. He must be the worst PM in UK history.

one thing that I really don't understand though is why our air borders have never been shut at any time. Correct me if I am wrong.
surely all non freight travel should be stopped immediately or am I missing something?


and I am beginning to think that a national lockdown should mean an end to all sport as well.
maybe the Premier League could continue in a bubble ? surely all lower leagues should now stop though.

xgtdec
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by xgtdec »

Sure a quick check of the Dublin airport arrivals pages tells me that level 5 lockdown cant be all that serious judging by the amount of flights arriving from a most varied list of locations around the world. Not to mention that aul border up north that you can hop skip and jump across with not a care in the world.

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SteveO 35
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by SteveO 35 »

Gunner Rob wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 2:07 pm
what we are currently seeing is a slow motion action replay of the middle of March.

Boris back then you might recall dithered for about a week before imposing a national lockdown, and the same thing is happening all over again right now! Unbelievable. He must be the worst PM in UK history.

one thing that I really don't understand though is why our air borders have never been shut at any time. Correct me if I am wrong.
surely all non freight travel should be stopped immediately or am I missing something?


and I am beginning to think that a national lockdown should mean an end to all sport as well.
maybe the Premier League could continue in a bubble ? surely all lower leagues should now stop though.
Testing is the key difference this time round, and the fact that the safety protocols/empty stadiums are in place - I think professional sport will be allowed to continue. It may seem trivial but its still a great release for so many people and it has been done with very few cases.....so if its safe, why not?

Sounds like we'll hear tonight how England is going to react. I love the way people say we need a "national lockdown" as Kier Starmer did today. A nice easy couple of little words that, but what does it actually mean for schools/home learning, support for parents, support for businesses, which businesses are allowed to remain open etc.

A fucking nightmare start to the year

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

SteveO 35 wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 4:25 pm
Gunner Rob wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 2:07 pm
what we are currently seeing is a slow motion action replay of the middle of March.

Boris back then you might recall dithered for about a week before imposing a national lockdown, and the same thing is happening all over again right now! Unbelievable. He must be the worst PM in UK history.

one thing that I really don't understand though is why our air borders have never been shut at any time. Correct me if I am wrong.
surely all non freight travel should be stopped immediately or am I missing something?


and I am beginning to think that a national lockdown should mean an end to all sport as well.
maybe the Premier League could continue in a bubble ? surely all lower leagues should now stop though.
Testing is the key difference this time round, and the fact that the safety protocols/empty stadiums are in place - I think professional sport will be allowed to continue. It may seem trivial but its still a great release for so many people and it has been done with very few cases.....so if its safe, why not?

Sounds like we'll hear tonight how England is going to react. I love the way people say we need a "national lockdown" as Kier Starmer did today. A nice easy couple of little words that, but what does it actually mean for schools/home learning, support for parents, support for businesses, which businesses are allowed to remain open etc.

A fucking nightmare start to the year
Lockdowns are a consequence of people's behaviour. You can't solely blame the govt anymore, but in saying that you can point at their inability to be decisive when it matters. It's happened on several occasions now. The schools should have been shut from today, I've just heard the first reports of Teachers dying over Christmas. It's ridiculous to have NHS workers being vaccinated without the same consideration given for teachers.

Just up the road from here in Epping, one of the areas for the highest infection rates in the country there was a party/rave on NYE in which 100 people turned up. This is a typical example of why we are in the shit.

I do agree about professional sport, they have the ability to create bubbles and test regularly. I do wish some of the players would understand how much responsibility lays on their shoulders. On the one hand, you have players like Marcus Rashford who has shown the good side of working-class footballers not forgetting their upbringing and trying to help others versus twats like Lamela who think he's exempt from the rules the rest of us are subject to.

The pandemic has spawned a WhatsApp group I am part of with other season ticket holders which is good fun, even if there are lots of arguments over certain players! We have all agreed that there's going to be one massive piss up when this is all over.

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SteveO 35
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by SteveO 35 »

Think they've already confirmed in Scotland that professional sport can continue despite the national lockdown that starts tonight

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Nos89
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by Nos89 »

nut flush gooner wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 4:47 pm
SteveO 35 wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 4:25 pm
Gunner Rob wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 2:07 pm
what we are currently seeing is a slow motion action replay of the middle of March.

Boris back then you might recall dithered for about a week before imposing a national lockdown, and the same thing is happening all over again right now! Unbelievable. He must be the worst PM in UK history.

one thing that I really don't understand though is why our air borders have never been shut at any time. Correct me if I am wrong.
surely all non freight travel should be stopped immediately or am I missing something?


and I am beginning to think that a national lockdown should mean an end to all sport as well.
maybe the Premier League could continue in a bubble ? surely all lower leagues should now stop though.
Testing is the key difference this time round, and the fact that the safety protocols/empty stadiums are in place - I think professional sport will be allowed to continue. It may seem trivial but its still a great release for so many people and it has been done with very few cases.....so if its safe, why not?

Sounds like we'll hear tonight how England is going to react. I love the way people say we need a "national lockdown" as Kier Starmer did today. A nice easy couple of little words that, but what does it actually mean for schools/home learning, support for parents, support for businesses, which businesses are allowed to remain open etc.

A fucking nightmare start to the year
Lockdowns are a consequence of people's behaviour. You can't solely blame the govt anymore, but in saying that you can point at their inability to be decisive when it matters. It's happened on several occasions now. The schools should have been shut from today, I've just heard the first reports of Teachers dying over Christmas. It's ridiculous to have NHS workers being vaccinated without the same consideration given for teachers.

Just up the road from here in Epping, one of the areas for the highest infection rates in the country there was a party/rave on NYE in which 100 people turned up. This is a typical example of why we are in the shit.

I do agree about professional sport, they have the ability to create bubbles and test regularly. I do wish some of the players would understand how much responsibility lays on their shoulders. On the one hand, you have players like Marcus Rashford who has shown the good side of working-class footballers not forgetting their upbringing and trying to help others versus twats like Lamela who think he's exempt from the rules the rest of us are subject to.

The pandemic has spawned a WhatsApp group I am part of with other season ticket holders which is good fun, even if there are lots of arguments over certain players! We have all agreed that there's going to be one massive piss up when this is all over.
What about retail workers? Apparently, they've been called key workers throughout the pandemic, working through all levels of tiering. Where are they on the vaccination list? Absolutely should be ahead of teachers.
In the last 12 days I've had direct contact with 5 confirmed cases at work. They tested positive after I sent them home to get tested as they exhibited some symptoms. All brought in through households. Unlike teachers, they came in because they didn't want to let their colleagues down. Whilst in the past that type of behaviour is heralded as commitment to the cause. Now it's irresponsible behaviour. I've actually been told to discipline them.
Those 5 cases were women of a certain age (middled aged) who have the mentality that going to work is paramount.
The biggest challenge to those in retail is changing a mentality that encourages people to go to work no matter what your health is like, to putting health first, work second.
As for blaming the government, the only way Boris will control this is by declaring a state of emergency and engaging the military to be on every street corner.

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

Nos89 wrote:
Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:08 am
nut flush gooner wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 4:47 pm
SteveO 35 wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 4:25 pm
Gunner Rob wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 2:07 pm
what we are currently seeing is a slow motion action replay of the middle of March.

Boris back then you might recall dithered for about a week before imposing a national lockdown, and the same thing is happening all over again right now! Unbelievable. He must be the worst PM in UK history.

one thing that I really don't understand though is why our air borders have never been shut at any time. Correct me if I am wrong.
surely all non freight travel should be stopped immediately or am I missing something?


and I am beginning to think that a national lockdown should mean an end to all sport as well.
maybe the Premier League could continue in a bubble ? surely all lower leagues should now stop though.
Testing is the key difference this time round, and the fact that the safety protocols/empty stadiums are in place - I think professional sport will be allowed to continue. It may seem trivial but its still a great release for so many people and it has been done with very few cases.....so if its safe, why not?

Sounds like we'll hear tonight how England is going to react. I love the way people say we need a "national lockdown" as Kier Starmer did today. A nice easy couple of little words that, but what does it actually mean for schools/home learning, support for parents, support for businesses, which businesses are allowed to remain open etc.

A fucking nightmare start to the year
Lockdowns are a consequence of people's behaviour. You can't solely blame the govt anymore, but in saying that you can point at their inability to be decisive when it matters. It's happened on several occasions now. The schools should have been shut from today, I've just heard the first reports of Teachers dying over Christmas. It's ridiculous to have NHS workers being vaccinated without the same consideration given for teachers.

Just up the road from here in Epping, one of the areas for the highest infection rates in the country there was a party/rave on NYE in which 100 people turned up. This is a typical example of why we are in the shit.

I do agree about professional sport, they have the ability to create bubbles and test regularly. I do wish some of the players would understand how much responsibility lays on their shoulders. On the one hand, you have players like Marcus Rashford who has shown the good side of working-class footballers not forgetting their upbringing and trying to help others versus twats like Lamela who think he's exempt from the rules the rest of us are subject to.

The pandemic has spawned a WhatsApp group I am part of with other season ticket holders which is good fun, even if there are lots of arguments over certain players! We have all agreed that there's going to be one massive piss up when this is all over.
What about retail workers? Apparently, they've been called key workers throughout the pandemic, working through all levels of tiering. Where are they on the vaccination list? Absolutely should be ahead of teachers.
In the last 12 days I've had direct contact with 5 confirmed cases at work. They tested positive after I sent them home to get tested as they exhibited some symptoms. All brought in through households. Unlike teachers, they came in because they didn't want to let their colleagues down. Whilst in the past that type of behaviour is heralded as commitment to the cause. Now it's irresponsible behaviour. I've actually been told to discipline them.
Those 5 cases were women of a certain age (middled aged) who have the mentality that going to work is paramount.
The biggest challenge to those in retail is changing a mentality that encourages people to go to work no matter what your health is like, to putting health first, work second.
As for blaming the government, the only way Boris will control this is by declaring a state of emergency and engaging the military to be on every street corner.
For the purposes of this pandemic, retail food shop staff are 100% key workers and should be treated in the same way as teachers (who I don't believe have been crying off sick by and large) the problem is where do you put them into the tier priority vaccine system.

Unless they are considered extremely clinically vulnerable or over age 65 they probably wont be vaccinated before Easter. Boris has said the top 4 tiers will be sorted by mid Feb, we shall see if that actually happens. He has a habit of missing targets.

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GoonerMuzz
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by GoonerMuzz »

I'd like to know if any of those calling for a national lockdown would consider a 20% reduction in wages in solidarity with those unable to go to work and actually in some cases having to pick up some of the workload of those saying schools should be closed. Interestingly in my youngests school over the whole period amongst staff and pupils there have been less than 30 confirmed cases amongst upwards of 1300 individuals.

We are royally fucked and will be for a year at least, God forbid this thing fucking mutates as severely again which in all probability it will. Currently we have no idea how long the vaccination will last, we, or should I say the scientists, still have no idea whether all, some or none of those vaccinated remain contagious, they still have no idea of the efficacy of the current vaccines against the new strain.

I said months ago this would continue for a long, long time because individuals cant follow simple rules and instructions and I wasnt wrong, we can each blame our governments for being slow, confused or whatever but ultimately it is the populace's fault for not following the rules time and time again.

As I said previously Pareto's principle when used on population says 80% of your problems are caused by 20% of your people, well in the UK that amounts to 13.5M people...... still it is fun living in a police state and maybe BJ should call out the military and reserves to patrol the streets I'm sure everyone would enjoy that and it wouldn't cause any problems :wink:

Anyway Gooners stay safe, isolate if you can and if you are in the vulnerable group continue to use as much common sense as possible, Covid is for Christmas but death is permanent and even if we dont like our politicians or agree with them all the time occasionally it is worth doing what they tell us too.

nut flush gooner
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Re: CoronaVirus Latest

Post by nut flush gooner »

GoonerMuzz wrote:
Tue Jan 05, 2021 12:30 pm
I'd like to know if any of those calling for a national lockdown would consider a 20% reduction in wages in solidarity with those unable to go to work and actually in some cases having to pick up some of the workload of those saying schools should be closed. Interestingly in my youngests school over the whole period amongst staff and pupils there have been less than 30 confirmed cases amongst upwards of 1300 individuals.

We are royally fucked and will be for a year at least, God forbid this thing fucking mutates as severely again which in all probability it will. Currently we have no idea how long the vaccination will last, we, or should I say the scientists, still have no idea whether all, some or none of those vaccinated remain contagious, they still have no idea of the efficacy of the current vaccines against the new strain.

I said months ago this would continue for a long, long time because individuals cant follow simple rules and instructions and I wasnt wrong, we can each blame our governments for being slow, confused or whatever but ultimately it is the populace's fault for not following the rules time and time again.

As I said previously Pareto's principle when used on population says 80% of your problems are caused by 20% of your people, well in the UK that amounts to 13.5M people...... still it is fun living in a police state and maybe BJ should call out the military and reserves to patrol the streets I'm sure everyone would enjoy that and it wouldn't cause any problems :wink:

Anyway Gooners stay safe, isolate if you can and if you are in the vulnerable group continue to use as much common sense as possible, Covid is for Christmas but death is permanent and even if we dont like our politicians or agree with them all the time occasionally it is worth doing what they tell us too.
Not sure where you live Muzz, but in Enfield before Christmas COVID was rife in the schools. In Barnet where my sister's kids go to school, they spent the final two weeks of term learning online. There is an infection rate of under 1 in 70 in this area. Our neighbours picked up COVID from their child who picked it up at school.

There was no choice but to lockdown, it's affecting everyone but as I have said in previous posts if the NHS gets overwhelmed we are all screwed. There are 283 covid patients in my local hospital the North Middlesex. Check out the figures in your area.

https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/s ... -activity/

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