Mikel Arteta, success or failure? - Merged thread.

[OneBardGooner]

For 5 years and 800 million quid we should be seeing trophies, even if they are only cups. We should be seeing sustained challenges for the title. We should be seeing an ever improving squad. What we have is one, maybe two half decent pushes for the title that both collapsed when the pressure was on and a paper thin squad with no actual goal scoring striker to speak of.

I see this claim repeated a lot on this forum a lot. Of course it conveniently ignores the mess that Wenger left behind, not to mention the expensive salvage operation that had to follow which completely overwhelmed Emery. Plenty admitted on this forum that we'd become a midtable side because we'd sunk so low and our problems were uniquely unprecedented. All of a sudden we should be seeing sustained title challenges. There are at least 3 clubs who have spent more money in the period you quoted and we've done better than all 3. Man United and Chelsea (post Ruski) have tried every conceivable approach to become successful from excessive spending to hiring and firing managers and it hasn't worked. This is not to say that we should stick with Arteta but until we find a way to bring in truly elite players, the manager is not a significant consideration for me. FFFP rules limit what we can spend anyway so that's another hindrance. A new manager would bring his own raft of problems and create new debating lines for insatiable Arsenal fans.

Having popped in occasionally to have a check out this thread I promised myself I wouldn't get involved as it meanders and winds its way towards becoming indulgent and boring in its tit for tat type posts.

To the best of my knowledge No-one has ignored the Fact that the Senile, Despotic Greedy Fucker that was Wenger in his last 12 years of Managing (all things) Arsenal.. Had left the Club, Players, Coaching & Training Staff, the Finances and Fans in an absolute Shit Show of a Mess to the point that it was teetering on the edge of a crumbling cliff. Which is why that BaldyCUNT Gazidis jumped ship when he saw the extent of the damage that had been done and the HUGE task it was going to take to Fix it.

Unai Emery is a very good manager, but anyone coming in to the Shit Show of a Circus that Wenger had left in his enforced departure was always going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Emery did a great job considering and he laid some of the ground work for when Arteta took over.

It was Arteta that set out his plan (a 6 year renewal) of one of the biggest clubs in English football.

He has re-united the fans from the Warring Factions they had become (and although there are some who think Arteta is the Messiah, whilst some who think he should go now or at the end of the season. But there are those who occupy the Middle-Ground; I would say the Majority who are willing to give him more time).

He has made some Very Good signings: Rice, Raya, Havertz and Trossard. Also some Bad one's Jesus & Zinchenko, also Marquinhos, Lakonga and Tavares who just haven't worked .... Having said that ANY Signing is always a Gamble.

He has also Ignored the Desperate Need for a Striker, even those who see him as the Messiah say we need one.

The Kroenke's will stick with him and back him for the foreseeable future (this and next season) But should he not deliver either the Prem Title, a European Trophy and the FA or League Cup... He will be gone.

And even if that happens he will have changed the "Culture" at the club for the better on many levels.

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Buddy there are a lot of people on here that didnt rate Emery but even they will admit that emery NEVER WANTED pepe - it was well publicised at the time that emery wanted zaha but the AFC board over-ruled him, so by all means bash him if you wish, but dont throw absolute bullshit at him that was nothing to do with him
Secondly just because pep's cone boy sold the emery signings doesnt mean they were bad signings - the cone boy made it crystal clear that he wanted emery players out asap, but regardless of how it turned out in the end, in his first season you wouldnt have found too many Gooners slating torreira, guendouzi, sokratis etc as they came within 1pt of top 4. This bullshit about how lego head reunited the fan base just never seems to go away either - when we turned the scum over at the grove in emery's first season, the whole stadium were singing "we've got our Arsenal back", but its funny the way over time that little fact gets forgotten

Oooooh! Augie I think He Likes you!

[OneBardGooner]

For 5 years and 800 million quid we should be seeing trophies, even if they are only cups. We should be seeing sustained challenges for the title. We should be seeing an ever improving squad. What we have is one, maybe two half decent pushes for the title that both collapsed when the pressure was on and a paper thin squad with no actual goal scoring striker to speak of.

I see this claim repeated a lot on this forum a lot. Of course it conveniently ignores the mess that Wenger left behind, not to mention the expensive salvage operation that had to follow which completely overwhelmed Emery. Plenty admitted on this forum that we'd become a midtable side because we'd sunk so low and our problems were uniquely unprecedented. All of a sudden we should be seeing sustained title challenges. There are at least 3 clubs who have spent more money in the period you quoted and we've done better than all 3. Man United and Chelsea (post Ruski) have tried every conceivable approach to become successful from excessive spending to hiring and firing managers and it hasn't worked. This is not to say that we should stick with Arteta but until we find a way to bring in truly elite players, the manager is not a significant consideration for me. FFFP rules limit what we can spend anyway so that's another hindrance. A new manager would bring his own raft of problems and create new debating lines for insatiable Arsenal fans.

Having popped in occasionally to have a check out this thread I promised myself I wouldn't get involved as it meanders and winds its way towards becoming indulgent and boring in its tit for tat type posts.

To the best of my knowledge No-one has ignored the Fact that the Senile, Despotic Greedy Fucker that was Wenger in his last 12 years of Managing (all things) Arsenal.. Had left the Club, Players, Coaching & Training Staff, the Finances and Fans in an absolute Shit Show of a Mess to the point that it was teetering on the edge of a crumbling cliff. Which is why that BaldyCUNT Gazidis jumped ship when he saw the extent of the damage that had been done and the HUGE task it was going to take to Fix it.

Unai Emery is a very good manager, but anyone coming in to the Shit Show of a Circus that Wenger had left in his enforced departure was always going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Emery did a great job considering and he laid some of the ground work for when Arteta took over.

It was Arteta that set out his plan (a 6 year renewal) of one of the biggest clubs in English football.

He has re-united the fans from the Warring Factions they had become (and although there are some who think Arteta is the Messiah, whilst some who think he should go now or at the end of the season. But there are those who occupy the Middle-Ground; I would say the Majority who are willing to give him more time).

He has made some Very Good signings: Rice, Raya, Havertz and Trossard. Also some Bad one's Jesus & Zinchenko, also Marquinhos, Lakonga and Tavares who just haven't worked .... Having said that ANY Signing is always a Gamble.

He has also Ignored the Desperate Need for a Striker, even those who see him as the Messiah say we need one.

The Kroenke's will stick with him and back him for the foreseeable future (this and next season) But should he not deliver either the Prem Title, a European Trophy and the FA or League Cup... He will be gone.

And even if that happens he will have changed the "Culture" at the club for the better on many levels.

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Just saw this....

You really are a condescending *word censored* aren't you

[General]

For 5 years and 800 million quid we should be seeing trophies, even if they are only cups. We should be seeing sustained challenges for the title. We should be seeing an ever improving squad. What we have is one, maybe two half decent pushes for the title that both collapsed when the pressure was on and a paper thin squad with no actual goal scoring striker to speak of.

I see this claim repeated a lot on this forum a lot. Of course it conveniently ignores the mess that Wenger left behind, not to mention the expensive salvage operation that had to follow which completely overwhelmed Emery. Plenty admitted on this forum that we'd become a midtable side because we'd sunk so low and our problems were uniquely unprecedented. All of a sudden we should be seeing sustained title challenges. There are at least 3 clubs who have spent more money in the period you quoted and we've done better than all 3. Man United and Chelsea (post Ruski) have tried every conceivable approach to become successful from excessive spending to hiring and firing managers and it hasn't worked. This is not to say that we should stick with Arteta but until we find a way to bring in truly elite players, the manager is not a significant consideration for me. FFFP rules limit what we can spend anyway so that's another hindrance. A new manager would bring his own raft of problems and create new debating lines for insatiable Arsenal fans.

Having popped in occasionally to have a check out this thread I promised myself I wouldn't get involved as it meanders and winds its way towards becoming indulgent and boring in its tit for tat type posts.

To the best of my knowledge No-one has ignored the Fact that the Senile, Despotic Greedy Fucker that was Wenger in his last 12 years of Managing (all things) Arsenal.. Had left the Club, Players, Coaching & Training Staff, the Finances and Fans in an absolute Shit Show of a Mess to the point that it was teetering on the edge of a crumbling cliff. Which is why that BaldyCUNT Gazidis jumped ship when he saw the extent of the damage that had been done and the HUGE task it was going to take to Fix it.

Unai Emery is a very good manager, but anyone coming in to the Shit Show of a Circus that Wenger had left in his enforced departure was always going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Emery did a great job considering and he laid some of the ground work for when Arteta took over.

It was Arteta that set out his plan (a 6 year renewal) of one of the biggest clubs in English football.

He has re-united the fans from the Warring Factions they had become (and although there are some who think Arteta is the Messiah, whilst some who think he should go now or at the end of the season. But there are those who occupy the Middle-Ground; I would say the Majority who are willing to give him more time).

He has made some Very Good signings: Rice, Raya, Havertz and Trossard. Also some Bad one's Jesus & Zinchenko, also Marquinhos, Lakonga and Tavares who just haven't worked .... Having said that ANY Signing is always a Gamble.

He has also Ignored the Desperate Need for a Striker, even those who see him as the Messiah say we need one.

The Kroenke's will stick with him and back him for the foreseeable future (this and next season) But should he not deliver either the Prem Title, a European Trophy and the FA or League Cup... He will be gone.

And even if that happens he will have changed the "Culture" at the club for the better on many levels.

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Just saw this....

You really are a condescending *word censored* aren't you

Far from it. You saw it before but you’re now looking for an argument where one doesn’t exist. You must be bored
I agree with a lot of what you wrote.

[A11M11]

including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe.

I seem to remember that he wanted to buy Saha from Palace and was not in favour of buying Pepe.

[OneBardGooner]

I see this claim repeated a lot on this forum a lot. Of course it conveniently ignores the mess that Wenger left behind, not to mention the expensive salvage operation that had to follow which completely overwhelmed Emery. Plenty admitted on this forum that we'd become a midtable side because we'd sunk so low and our problems were uniquely unprecedented. All of a sudden we should be seeing sustained title challenges. There are at least 3 clubs who have spent more money in the period you quoted and we've done better than all 3. Man United and Chelsea (post Ruski) have tried every conceivable approach to become successful from excessive spending to hiring and firing managers and it hasn't worked. This is not to say that we should stick with Arteta but until we find a way to bring in truly elite players, the manager is not a significant consideration for me. FFFP rules limit what we can spend anyway so that's another hindrance. A new manager would bring his own raft of problems and create new debating lines for insatiable Arsenal fans.

Having popped in occasionally to have a check out this thread I promised myself I wouldn't get involved as it meanders and winds its way towards becoming indulgent and boring in its tit for tat type posts.

To the best of my knowledge No-one has ignored the Fact that the Senile, Despotic Greedy Fucker that was Wenger in his last 12 years of Managing (all things) Arsenal.. Had left the Club, Players, Coaching & Training Staff, the Finances and Fans in an absolute Shit Show of a Mess to the point that it was teetering on the edge of a crumbling cliff. Which is why that BaldyCUNT Gazidis jumped ship when he saw the extent of the damage that had been done and the HUGE task it was going to take to Fix it.

Unai Emery is a very good manager, but anyone coming in to the Shit Show of a Circus that Wenger had left in his enforced departure was always going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Emery did a great job considering and he laid some of the ground work for when Arteta took over.

It was Arteta that set out his plan (a 6 year renewal) of one of the biggest clubs in English football.

He has re-united the fans from the Warring Factions they had become (and although there are some who think Arteta is the Messiah, whilst some who think he should go now or at the end of the season. But there are those who occupy the Middle-Ground; I would say the Majority who are willing to give him more time).

He has made some Very Good signings: Rice, Raya, Havertz and Trossard. Also some Bad one's Jesus & Zinchenko, also Marquinhos, Lakonga and Tavares who just haven't worked .... Having said that ANY Signing is always a Gamble.

He has also Ignored the Desperate Need for a Striker, even those who see him as the Messiah say we need one.

The Kroenke's will stick with him and back him for the foreseeable future (this and next season) But should he not deliver either the Prem Title, a European Trophy and the FA or League Cup... He will be gone.

And even if that happens he will have changed the "Culture" at the club for the better on many levels.

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Just saw this....

You really are a condescending *word censored* aren't you

Far from it. You saw it before but you’re now looking for an argument where one doesn’t exist. You must be bored
I agree with a lot of what you wrote.

Nope! What's the point no one ever wins an argument, at least not on here. But Having posted endless diatribes and then to have an 'Attitude' by judging what I tried to contribute as 'a reasonable post', suggests very strongly that you judge others posts by some kind of Good, Bad or Indifferent level in comparison to your own, or maybe what appears to be your own very opinionated egotistical superior standard.

It's no wonder people don't bother getting involved and your posts end up not being engaged with, which surely is the main reason for the forum.

But Hey! What do I know.

[General]

For 5 years and 800 million quid we should be seeing trophies, even if they are only cups. We should be seeing sustained challenges for the title. We should be seeing an ever improving squad. What we have is one, maybe two half decent pushes for the title that both collapsed when the pressure was on and a paper thin squad with no actual goal scoring striker to speak of.

I see this claim repeated a lot on this forum a lot. Of course it conveniently ignores the mess that Wenger left behind, not to mention the expensive salvage operation that had to follow which completely overwhelmed Emery. Plenty admitted on this forum that we'd become a midtable side because we'd sunk so low and our problems were uniquely unprecedented. All of a sudden we should be seeing sustained title challenges. There are at least 3 clubs who have spent more money in the period you quoted and we've done better than all 3. Man United and Chelsea (post Ruski) have tried every conceivable approach to become successful from excessive spending to hiring and firing managers and it hasn't worked. This is not to say that we should stick with Arteta but until we find a way to bring in truly elite players, the manager is not a significant consideration for me. FFFP rules limit what we can spend anyway so that's another hindrance. A new manager would bring his own raft of problems and create new debating lines for insatiable Arsenal fans.

Having popped in occasionally to have a check out this thread I promised myself I wouldn't get involved as it meanders and winds its way towards becoming indulgent and boring in its tit for tat type posts.

To the best of my knowledge No-one has ignored the Fact that the Senile, Despotic Greedy Fucker that was Wenger in his last 12 years of Managing (all things) Arsenal.. Had left the Club, Players, Coaching & Training Staff, the Finances and Fans in an absolute Shit Show of a Mess to the point that it was teetering on the edge of a crumbling cliff. Which is why that BaldyCUNT Gazidis jumped ship when he saw the extent of the damage that had been done and the HUGE task it was going to take to Fix it.

Unai Emery is a very good manager, but anyone coming in to the Shit Show of a Circus that Wenger had left in his enforced departure was always going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Emery did a great job considering and he laid some of the ground work for when Arteta took over.

It was Arteta that set out his plan (a 6 year renewal) of one of the biggest clubs in English football.

He has re-united the fans from the Warring Factions they had become (and although there are some who think Arteta is the Messiah, whilst some who think he should go now or at the end of the season. But there are those who occupy the Middle-Ground; I would say the Majority who are willing to give him more time).

He has made some Very Good signings: Rice, Raya, Havertz and Trossard. Also some Bad one's Jesus & Zinchenko, also Marquinhos, Lakonga and Tavares who just haven't worked .... Having said that ANY Signing is always a Gamble.

He has also Ignored the Desperate Need for a Striker, even those who see him as the Messiah say we need one.

The Kroenke's will stick with him and back him for the foreseeable future (this and next season) But should he not deliver either the Prem Title, a European Trophy and the FA or League Cup... He will be gone.

And even if that happens he will have changed the "Culture" at the club for the better on many levels.

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Buddy there are a lot of people on here that didnt rate Emery but even they will admit that emery NEVER WANTED pepe - it was well publicised at the time that emery wanted zaha but the AFC board over-ruled him, so by all means bash him if you wish, but dont throw absolute bullshit at him that was nothing to do with him
Secondly just because pep's cone boy sold the emery signings doesnt mean they were bad signings - the cone boy made it crystal clear that he wanted emery players out asap, but regardless of how it turned out in the end, in his first season you wouldnt have found too many Gooners slating torreira, guendouzi, sokratis etc as they came within 1pt of top 4. This bullshit about how lego head reunited the fan base just never seems to go away either - when we turned the scum over at the grove in emery's first season, the whole stadium were singing "we've got our Arsenal back", but its funny the way over time that little fact gets forgotten

I’ve seen this rumour before and it is no more than made up speculation by some fans.

Emery joined us from the French league and knew Pepe very well. The problem is we overpaid for him and this typically doesn’t happen without the manager’s backing.

Think about it logically, If the board had overriding authority and imposed the signing on Emery, why was Arteta allowed to freeze him out to the extent that the club eventually had to cancel his contract which wasn’t cheap?

Also guess where Pepe plays now? Villarreal. Emery was their manager until he left for Villa in 2022. Yes he left before they signed Pepe but connect the dots. It is more likely than not that Emery endorsed his signing in both instances.

[Retro Gunner]

I see this claim repeated a lot on this forum a lot. Of course it conveniently ignores the mess that Wenger left behind, not to mention the expensive salvage operation that had to follow which completely overwhelmed Emery. Plenty admitted on this forum that we'd become a midtable side because we'd sunk so low and our problems were uniquely unprecedented. All of a sudden we should be seeing sustained title challenges. There are at least 3 clubs who have spent more money in the period you quoted and we've done better than all 3. Man United and Chelsea (post Ruski) have tried every conceivable approach to become successful from excessive spending to hiring and firing managers and it hasn't worked. This is not to say that we should stick with Arteta but until we find a way to bring in truly elite players, the manager is not a significant consideration for me. FFFP rules limit what we can spend anyway so that's another hindrance. A new manager would bring his own raft of problems and create new debating lines for insatiable Arsenal fans.

Having popped in occasionally to have a check out this thread I promised myself I wouldn't get involved as it meanders and winds its way towards becoming indulgent and boring in its tit for tat type posts.

To the best of my knowledge No-one has ignored the Fact that the Senile, Despotic Greedy Fucker that was Wenger in his last 12 years of Managing (all things) Arsenal.. Had left the Club, Players, Coaching & Training Staff, the Finances and Fans in an absolute Shit Show of a Mess to the point that it was teetering on the edge of a crumbling cliff. Which is why that BaldyCUNT Gazidis jumped ship when he saw the extent of the damage that had been done and the HUGE task it was going to take to Fix it.

Unai Emery is a very good manager, but anyone coming in to the Shit Show of a Circus that Wenger had left in his enforced departure was always going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Emery did a great job considering and he laid some of the ground work for when Arteta took over.

It was Arteta that set out his plan (a 6 year renewal) of one of the biggest clubs in English football.

He has re-united the fans from the Warring Factions they had become (and although there are some who think Arteta is the Messiah, whilst some who think he should go now or at the end of the season. But there are those who occupy the Middle-Ground; I would say the Majority who are willing to give him more time).

He has made some Very Good signings: Rice, Raya, Havertz and Trossard. Also some Bad one's Jesus & Zinchenko, also Marquinhos, Lakonga and Tavares who just haven't worked .... Having said that ANY Signing is always a Gamble.

He has also Ignored the Desperate Need for a Striker, even those who see him as the Messiah say we need one.

The Kroenke's will stick with him and back him for the foreseeable future (this and next season) But should he not deliver either the Prem Title, a European Trophy and the FA or League Cup... He will be gone.

And even if that happens he will have changed the "Culture" at the club for the better on many levels.

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Buddy there are a lot of people on here that didnt rate Emery but even they will admit that emery NEVER WANTED pepe - it was well publicised at the time that emery wanted zaha but the AFC board over-ruled him, so by all means bash him if you wish, but dont throw absolute bullshit at him that was nothing to do with him
Secondly just because pep's cone boy sold the emery signings doesnt mean they were bad signings - the cone boy made it crystal clear that he wanted emery players out asap, but regardless of how it turned out in the end, in his first season you wouldnt have found too many Gooners slating torreira, guendouzi, sokratis etc as they came within 1pt of top 4. This bullshit about how lego head reunited the fan base just never seems to go away either - when we turned the scum over at the grove in emery's first season, the whole stadium were singing "we've got our Arsenal back", but its funny the way over time that little fact gets forgotten

I’ve seen this rumour before and it is no more than made up speculation by some fans.

Emery joined us from the French league and knew Pepe very well. The problem is we overpaid for him and this typically doesn’t happen without the manager’s backing.

Think about it logically, If the board had overriding authority and imposed the signing on Emery, why was Arteta allowed to freeze him out to the extent that the club eventually had to cancel his contract which wasn’t cheap?

Also guess where Pepe plays now? Villarreal. Emery was their manager until he left for Villa in 2022. Yes he left before they signed Pepe but connect the dots. It is more likely than not that Emery endorsed his signing in both instances.

Sorry General, but some serious revisionism going on here. It was Raul Sanllehi that signed Pepe for the Arsenal, before his short and tainted spell as 'Head of Football' came to an end. It was heavily reported at the time that Emery wanted Saha, but Sanllehi was in a powerful position following the departure of Gazidis and Mislintat. He signed Pepe, as well as other no mark duds. The only quality signing he brought in was Saliba and Arteta almost ruined that situation.

So, the board would have had no problem off-loading Pepe once it transpired that he was fucking useless and given that Sanllehi had left under a cloud. It wasn't the Kroenkes that signed him, it was the man they had appointed, so why would they keep a dud that their new man, Arteta, didn't want?

It doesn't matter if you're pro or anti Emery, or Arteta, but rational analysis of what's gone on ought to be the position for all of us.

[General]

Having popped in occasionally to have a check out this thread I promised myself I wouldn't get involved as it meanders and winds its way towards becoming indulgent and boring in its tit for tat type posts.

To the best of my knowledge No-one has ignored the Fact that the Senile, Despotic Greedy Fucker that was Wenger in his last 12 years of Managing (all things) Arsenal.. Had left the Club, Players, Coaching & Training Staff, the Finances and Fans in an absolute Shit Show of a Mess to the point that it was teetering on the edge of a crumbling cliff. Which is why that BaldyCUNT Gazidis jumped ship when he saw the extent of the damage that had been done and the HUGE task it was going to take to Fix it.

Unai Emery is a very good manager, but anyone coming in to the Shit Show of a Circus that Wenger had left in his enforced departure was always going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Emery did a great job considering and he laid some of the ground work for when Arteta took over.

It was Arteta that set out his plan (a 6 year renewal) of one of the biggest clubs in English football.

He has re-united the fans from the Warring Factions they had become (and although there are some who think Arteta is the Messiah, whilst some who think he should go now or at the end of the season. But there are those who occupy the Middle-Ground; I would say the Majority who are willing to give him more time).

He has made some Very Good signings: Rice, Raya, Havertz and Trossard. Also some Bad one's Jesus & Zinchenko, also Marquinhos, Lakonga and Tavares who just haven't worked .... Having said that ANY Signing is always a Gamble.

He has also Ignored the Desperate Need for a Striker, even those who see him as the Messiah say we need one.

The Kroenke's will stick with him and back him for the foreseeable future (this and next season) But should he not deliver either the Prem Title, a European Trophy and the FA or League Cup... He will be gone.

And even if that happens he will have changed the "Culture" at the club for the better on many levels.

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Buddy there are a lot of people on here that didnt rate Emery but even they will admit that emery NEVER WANTED pepe - it was well publicised at the time that emery wanted zaha but the AFC board over-ruled him, so by all means bash him if you wish, but dont throw absolute bullshit at him that was nothing to do with him
Secondly just because pep's cone boy sold the emery signings doesnt mean they were bad signings - the cone boy made it crystal clear that he wanted emery players out asap, but regardless of how it turned out in the end, in his first season you wouldnt have found too many Gooners slating torreira, guendouzi, sokratis etc as they came within 1pt of top 4. This bullshit about how lego head reunited the fan base just never seems to go away either - when we turned the scum over at the grove in emery's first season, the whole stadium were singing "we've got our Arsenal back", but its funny the way over time that little fact gets forgotten

I’ve seen this rumour before and it is no more than made up speculation by some fans.

Emery joined us from the French league and knew Pepe very well. The problem is we overpaid for him and this typically doesn’t happen without the manager’s backing.

Think about it logically, If the board had overriding authority and imposed the signing on Emery, why was Arteta allowed to freeze him out to the extent that the club eventually had to cancel his contract which wasn’t cheap?

Also guess where Pepe plays now? Villarreal. Emery was their manager until he left for Villa in 2022. Yes he left before they signed Pepe but connect the dots. It is more likely than not that Emery endorsed his signing in both instances.

Sorry General, but some serious revisionism going on here. It was Raul Sanllehi that signed Pepe for the Arsenal, before his short and tainted spell as 'Head of Football' came to an end. It was heavily reported at the time that Emery wanted Saha, but Sanllehi was in a powerful position following the departure of Gazidis and Mislintat. He signed Pepe, as well as other no mark duds. The only quality signing he brought in was Saliba and Arteta almost ruined that situation.

So, the board would have had no problem off-loading Pepe once it transpired that he was fucking useless and given that Sanllehi had left under a cloud. It wasn't the Kroenkes that signed him, it was the man they had appointed, so why would they keep a dud that their new man, Arteta, didn't want?

It doesn't matter if you're pro or anti Emery, or Arteta, but rational analysis of what's gone on ought to be the position for all of us.

Just so we don’t lose sight of the original point before I get accused of perpetuating a merry go round debate, I was disagreeing with the argument that Emery ‘laid the ground work for when Arteta took over’. Augie then responded by stating that the board was responsible for the dud signing that is Pepe and not Emery. So how could Emery have laid the foundations if the board through Sanlehi had overriding authority for signings?

As I’ve stated previously, I like Emery but he undoubtedly exacerbated the mess the French waffler left behind once the honeymoon period was over.

Meanwhile back in the real world, it is highly likely that Pepe’s signing was agreed between the board, Sanlehi and Emery, regardless of any perceived rogue actions by Sanlehi noting that we would’ve scouted Pepe on multiple occasions probably going back a few years.
Even if we had granted Emery’s wishes like some are arguing and signed Zaha, this wouldn’t have solved anything. He plays in the Turkish league for reason.

Don’t disagree with me because I’m not blaming Arteta at the first opportunity. He’s guilty of a lot of things but £800m in 5years is nothing considering the complete mess Wenger left behind (I know some like to tiptoe around this subject) and the ensuing chaos in Emery’s second season.

[OneBardGooner]

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Buddy there are a lot of people on here that didnt rate Emery but even they will admit that emery NEVER WANTED pepe - it was well publicised at the time that emery wanted zaha but the AFC board over-ruled him, so by all means bash him if you wish, but dont throw absolute bullshit at him that was nothing to do with him
Secondly just because pep's cone boy sold the emery signings doesnt mean they were bad signings - the cone boy made it crystal clear that he wanted emery players out asap, but regardless of how it turned out in the end, in his first season you wouldnt have found too many Gooners slating torreira, guendouzi, sokratis etc as they came within 1pt of top 4. This bullshit about how lego head reunited the fan base just never seems to go away either - when we turned the scum over at the grove in emery's first season, the whole stadium were singing "we've got our Arsenal back", but its funny the way over time that little fact gets forgotten

I’ve seen this rumour before and it is no more than made up speculation by some fans.

Emery joined us from the French league and knew Pepe very well. The problem is we overpaid for him and this typically doesn’t happen without the manager’s backing.

Think about it logically, If the board had overriding authority and imposed the signing on Emery, why was Arteta allowed to freeze him out to the extent that the club eventually had to cancel his contract which wasn’t cheap?

Also guess where Pepe plays now? Villarreal. Emery was their manager until he left for Villa in 2022. Yes he left before they signed Pepe but connect the dots. It is more likely than not that Emery endorsed his signing in both instances.

Sorry General, but some serious revisionism going on here. It was Raul Sanllehi that signed Pepe for the Arsenal, before his short and tainted spell as 'Head of Football' came to an end. It was heavily reported at the time that Emery wanted Saha, but Sanllehi was in a powerful position following the departure of Gazidis and Mislintat. He signed Pepe, as well as other no mark duds. The only quality signing he brought in was Saliba and Arteta almost ruined that situation.

So, the board would have had no problem off-loading Pepe once it transpired that he was fucking useless and given that Sanllehi had left under a cloud. It wasn't the Kroenkes that signed him, it was the man they had appointed, so why would they keep a dud that their new man, Arteta, didn't want?

It doesn't matter if you're pro or anti Emery, or Arteta, but rational analysis of what's gone on ought to be the position for all of us.

Just so we don’t lose sight of the original point before I get accused of perpetuating a merry go round debate, I was disagreeing with the argument that Emery ‘laid the ground work for when Arteta took over’. Augie then responded by stating that the board was responsible for the dud signing that is Pepe and not Emery. So how could Emery have laid the foundations if the board through Sanlehi had overriding authority for signings?

As I’ve stated previously, I like Emery but he undoubtedly exacerbated the mess the French waffler left behind once the honeymoon period was over.

Meanwhile back in the real world, it is highly likely that Pepe’s signing was agreed between the board, Sanlehi and Emery, regardless of any perceived rogue actions by Sanlehi noting that we would’ve scouted Pepe on multiple occasions probably going back a few years.
Even if we had granted Emery’s wishes like some are arguing and signed Zaha, this wouldn’t have solved anything. He plays in the Turkish league for reason.

Don’t disagree with me because I’m not blaming Arteta at the first opportunity. He’s guilty of a lot of things but £800m in 5years is nothing considering the complete mess Wenger left behind (I know some like to tiptoe around this subject) and the ensuing chaos in Emery’s second season.

I think you'll find that the Majority on here see it as it was:


Wenger became a despot which brings with it Narcissism, Delusion and a "I am Right Everyone Else is Wrong" Mentality... All the Great and Memorable things he did in the first 10 years of his Tenure are un-deniable.... But after that the slow spiral into the Absolute Shit Show of a Circus we became is ALL Down to him; okay so the Kroenke's and that CuntyGazidis played their part in allowing him Ultimate Power... But Emery was on a hiding to nothing (like Moyes after Red Nose) and although he did contribute some Good things, he was never going to last... It's true he did want Saha (who was keen to come) instead of Zone-Out Pepe ... But who can say if Saha might have improved and worked out for us or ended up still heading to Turkey...we'll never know...I would have taken Saha over Pepe all day long At The Time. What is Fact is that whilst Arteta most certainly has his flaws and blindspots, he was able to re-unite the Fan Base in a relatively short space of time. And admittedly the Fan Base has changed since TOF's time...But there is more Positivity than Negativity generally speaking at Arsenal, but for how long only time will tell.


It's all down to Trophies or Lack Of.

[Retro Gunner]

This is a reasonable post and I don't disgaree with a lot of what you've said although I think you are in the minority here.

My point about ignoring the mess that Wenger left behind is based on the assertion that we've somehow spent 800million in 5years (the actual net figure is a lot less) and shoud be winning trophies(cups)/sustaining title challenges. Other notable clubs have spent more, hired and fired countless managers but have done worse. So based on the evidence, why do some fans think we should be doing better, especially coming from a cesspit of decline rarely seen at a major club??

I like Emery, he did well initially but he exacerbated some of the problems through bad recruitment, including blowing a large chunk of the transfer kitty on Pepe. All his acquisitions were gone within 3years of Arteta taking over so he hardly laid the ground work. The only difference is Arteta has been given more time and despite also being guilty of bad recruitment, the quality of the signings has improved and this has helped stabilise the club. Under Wenger, Rice would be at Man United and not Arsenal, and if Arteta gets the boot, the next manager would benefit from a significantly more stable squad with many players having their best years ahead of them.

Buddy there are a lot of people on here that didnt rate Emery but even they will admit that emery NEVER WANTED pepe - it was well publicised at the time that emery wanted zaha but the AFC board over-ruled him, so by all means bash him if you wish, but dont throw absolute bullshit at him that was nothing to do with him
Secondly just because pep's cone boy sold the emery signings doesnt mean they were bad signings - the cone boy made it crystal clear that he wanted emery players out asap, but regardless of how it turned out in the end, in his first season you wouldnt have found too many Gooners slating torreira, guendouzi, sokratis etc as they came within 1pt of top 4. This bullshit about how lego head reunited the fan base just never seems to go away either - when we turned the scum over at the grove in emery's first season, the whole stadium were singing "we've got our Arsenal back", but its funny the way over time that little fact gets forgotten

I’ve seen this rumour before and it is no more than made up speculation by some fans.

Emery joined us from the French league and knew Pepe very well. The problem is we overpaid for him and this typically doesn’t happen without the manager’s backing.

Think about it logically, If the board had overriding authority and imposed the signing on Emery, why was Arteta allowed to freeze him out to the extent that the club eventually had to cancel his contract which wasn’t cheap?

Also guess where Pepe plays now? Villarreal. Emery was their manager until he left for Villa in 2022. Yes he left before they signed Pepe but connect the dots. It is more likely than not that Emery endorsed his signing in both instances.

Sorry General, but some serious revisionism going on here. It was Raul Sanllehi that signed Pepe for the Arsenal, before his short and tainted spell as 'Head of Football' came to an end. It was heavily reported at the time that Emery wanted Saha, but Sanllehi was in a powerful position following the departure of Gazidis and Mislintat. He signed Pepe, as well as other no mark duds. The only quality signing he brought in was Saliba and Arteta almost ruined that situation.

So, the board would have had no problem off-loading Pepe once it transpired that he was fucking useless and given that Sanllehi had left under a cloud. It wasn't the Kroenkes that signed him, it was the man they had appointed, so why would they keep a dud that their new man, Arteta, didn't want?

It doesn't matter if you're pro or anti Emery, or Arteta, but rational analysis of what's gone on ought to be the position for all of us.

Just so we don’t lose sight of the original point before I get accused of perpetuating a merry go round debate, I was disagreeing with the argument that Emery ‘laid the ground work for when Arteta took over’. Augie then responded by stating that the board was responsible for the dud signing that is Pepe and not Emery. So how could Emery have laid the foundations if the board through Sanlehi had overriding authority for signings?

As I’ve stated previously, I like Emery but he undoubtedly exacerbated the mess the French waffler left behind once the honeymoon period was over.

Meanwhile back in the real world, it is highly likely that Pepe’s signing was agreed between the board, Sanlehi and Emery, regardless of any perceived rogue actions by Sanlehi noting that we would’ve scouted Pepe on multiple occasions probably going back a few years.
Even if we had granted Emery’s wishes like some are arguing and signed Zaha, this wouldn’t have solved anything. He plays in the Turkish league for reason.

Don’t disagree with me because I’m not blaming Arteta at the first opportunity. He’s guilty of a lot of things but £800m in 5years is nothing considering the complete mess Wenger left behind (I know some like to tiptoe around this subject) and the ensuing chaos in Emery’s second season.

Only just seen this and know I shouldn't respond, because it's a constant to-ing and fro-ing and the quote tower pisses everyone off. So I'll make it as brief as I can.

To suggest that Emery did nothing to correct the mess that the Old Fraud left behind is quite a stretch. It may ultimately have turned against him, but he started the process of change and had to contend with a real mess of senior management (Mislintat, Sanllehi etc) at the club and some iffy goings on. Those issues were largely removed by the time Arteta was appointed. It is, however, disingenuous to suggest that Emery had no influence because Sanllehi signed Pepe. It wasn't a zero sum game.

I was never a big exponent of signing Zaha, but again, disingenuous to say that he wouldn't have helped because he now plays in Turkey. The signing of Pepe was 5 years ago, so if Zaha had given us 2 or 3 good years, that would be 2 or 3 more than Pepe managed. Let's not forget that Pepe has been bouncing around on free deals since leaving us, one season of which was...yep you guessed it...in Turkey.

The main argument from me here is regarding your point in red. I've not come across anyone on here that doubts the mess Wenger left behind and how long it would take to correct was well discussed on here before the clown was finally gone. Similarly, few would have doubted that it might cost £800 million to re-build a side, but you're missing the point being made......Arteta has spent £800 million, but there are significant gaps in the first eleven, let alone in the squad and too many very average players in key positions. So, the question is, has he made the best use of the 800 million, especially as we're woefully short of a striker and a top quality centre mid? The answer's "no" in my book.

[DB10GOONER]

This fucking idiot needs to use January to get rid of Car Park Foot Partey and Jesuseless and CliveChenko and bring in a creator and a striker. At the very least.

[augie]

Some fans and meeja w*nkers were very quick to anoint the cone boy as a top manager, but no top manager would spend £800m without having a top quality striker in their squad Mark my words next months transfer window will close and he still wont have a top class striker in the door - he might buy a striker, but it wont be top quality striker that can make the difference in games like this

[IW8Goalmachine]

Arteta on Jesus in August

"I said from day one, the first feeling when I saw him after talking to him at the end of the season is that he was something different," Arteta said.

"I could sense it. His energy was different, the way he looks is different, the way he’s moving is different. He really wants it.

Pretty much shows how little he knows

[augie]

Arteta on Jesus in August

"I said from day one, the first feeling when I saw him after talking to him at the end of the season is that he was something different," Arteta said.

"I could sense it. His energy was different, the way he looks is different, the way he’s moving is different. He really wants it.

Pretty much shows how little he knows

au contraire - it shows that he knew the fans wanted a top striker, knew that the fans no longer believed in jesus, and was willing to lie through his teeth to appease modern fan boys who still believe in him

[IW8Goalmachine]

I fear the club with go down the shitter once he leaves but not because of his amazing management skills.

Saliba and Saka will be off soon.

The owners would give the next manager near as much to spend