As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
And do you think the Board will back his demands for money 100%? After this was Ridsdale's man at Leeds When Leeds went boke, and reportedly he got sacked for challenging Doug Ellis over money at Villa(oddly enough right before Eliis cashed in and made big money selling out)
Hes got to the CL semi final, one less than AW
And in 14 less attempts as hes only be in it once or twice
Irish Gooner wrote: Hes got to the CL semi final, one less than AW
And in 14 less attempts as hes only be in it once or twice
All time appearance holder, Irish ( )
Lets roll
First off I'll repeat what has he won?
Second well know the answer.
Third - is the Champions League all we should compete for?
Like I say you sack amanger wiyth idea of improving the level of ssuccesss for the team not to just keep us in the the top four. There are managers who could do that but not with this club's current personnel as is and not without a healthy increase in the transfer budget and more realistic wage policy.
So again what will replacing the current manager accomplish ofther than us conning ourselves into beieving things will really change becuase they simply won't as long as Cesc Fabregas is on 30K and Samir Nasri 10K a week more than Denilson or Bendtner, and that blocks us from signing the same quality of players we happened to sign before 2006 under this same manager.
I'm not gonna argue with you Martin, but suffice to say it was your dear Mr Wenger who ENSURED that the likes of Denilson and Bendtner are on the extortionate money they are on!
He's got till may. After today I cant see improvement coming (what will that do for confidence?).
Im too gutted to get into any debate, but today was an all time low for a wenger team, if you cant get your team motivated against that lot.......if you cant get yourself motivated for that lot........
TeeCee wrote:I'm not gonna argue with you Martin, but suffice to say it was your dear Mr Wenger who ENSURED that the likes of Denilson and Bendtner are on the extortionate money they are on!
And you know this how. What proof do you have backed by a non-Board source that the Board are ready and willing to pasy our top serving players more or have expressed a desire to pay better mopre proven players more than they have paid to those players?
If you are right you must have some proof so share it then. Otherwise why should you be believed. You all expect me to produce some written staement of audio or viseo tape otr I cannot be right yet all you have to do is believe in the Board's hohor and tradition as gentlemen to be right. Well no - show me your proof. You have none and that is why you won't argue the point because you can't bear admitting you have no proof to justify blind faith.
You and others would just rather get rid of the manager or players or anyone else than admit that maybe the Board didn't live up to what you still believe them to be.
TeeCee wrote:Someone who wrote into ANR got it spot on, Wenger has 3 options
1) Win the league
2) Buy the players we actually need
3) Resign
Again what FACTUAL EVIDENCE do you have not quotes from the Board without any supporting actions that shows the Board are prepared to let this or any mew manager buy the players we need given one how much more they will cost to buy and two how much more they will cost to pay than are currently willing to spend to buy or pay them?
Something more than we have the money please. Show me one example of the Bpard stating a genuinely deisre that more money be spent at some point. If you are right beyond any doubt as your language and presentation suggest youmust have one genuine example supporting it so I invite you to shre it
USMartin wrote:Again what FACTUAL EVIDENCE do you have not quotes from the Board without any supporting actions that shows the Board are prepared to let this or any mew manager buy the players we need given one how much more they will cost to buy and two how much more they will cost to pay than are currently willing to spend to buy or pay them?
Something more than we have the money please. Show me one example of the Bpard stating a genuinely deisre that more money be spent at some point. If you are right beyond any doubt as your language and presentation suggest youmust have one genuine example supporting it so I invite you to shre it
Again what FACTUAL EVIDENCE do you have he's wrong??????
USMartin wrote:Again what FACTUAL EVIDENCE do you have not quotes from the Board without any supporting actions that shows the Board are prepared to let this or any mew manager buy the players we need given one how much more they will cost to buy and two how much more they will cost to pay than are currently willing to spend to buy or pay them?
Something more than we have the money please. Show me one example of the Bpard stating a genuinely deisre that more money be spent at some point. If you are right beyond any doubt as your language and presentation suggest youmust have one genuine example supporting it so I invite you to shre it
Again what FACTUAL EVIDENCE do you have he's wrong??????
Plenty - we know that the spending policies all changed at excatly the time the additional money to re-develop Highbury was bought which was purely the Board's decision on Keith Edelman's advice. Arsene Wenger had no say in concieving or approving that decision which doubled our debt by 2010 and incread our overall debt by 50% at that time and eliminated the means of paying off the new stadium loan by as much as 33%. Thiose are facts. Math does not lie.
The budget cutting that took place at the club was all down the Board's decision to re-develop Highbury. We know that it led the Board to limit wage increases on key players which is how the Ashley Cole arose. We know that if keith Edelman had any rolde in the sales of Patrick Vieira and Thierry henry which is all but certain since he replaced David Dein that he took knockdown prices for those players, in Vieira's case because we simply needed the cash, and in Henry's case because we could well have sold him to Barca in the summer of 2006 for more but the negative reaction would have been far higher then and might have negatively impacted ticket sales at The Emirates if not that first summer than possibly the next (had he been sold in 06 and ticket holders felt like they were cheated).
And there is more but consider this - if the Board are so eager to pay better players more money and to spend more on those players and have been since 2008 or even 2008 how come there had not been one single incident of one Board member on or off the recoord publically questiononing the manager's spending policy just once in now going on six years since 2006 and four since 2008... that's 1400 to 2200 days of newspaper and TV reports where one of the six or seven or eight or more men on our Board in that time could have said maybe just maybe we should spending a bit more on our team. I know that if I am trying to keep a real secret that long odds are its gonna get out but then I'm just a big-mouth but really how long can they keep their constant desire to spend some more under wraps? How long can they keep it secret from the manager who attends their meetings regularly?
Martin - You know as well as we all do that actual figures will not be disclosed, but I doubt that even you are stupid enough to believe that any player would sign a multi-year contract without getting improved terms. If I could be bothered, I could quote articles written in several newspapers quoting that Bendtner and Denilson got IMPROVED contracts and that Arsene Wenger handled the negotiations himself. I don't NEED to prove it because I know what I read in different publications and heard on Sky Sports.
The AST confirmed recently that Wenger sits in on board meetings AND has a say in financial strategy within the club. Are you calling the Arsenal Supporters trust liars?
If Wenger hadn't rewarded so many of our 'average' and young players with improved contracts then we could afford to pay top players more.
My final bit of evidence is the fact that Deloittes auditors report Arsenal's wage bill as well over £100m p.a. (This info is available from Companies House). As you have said many times previously yourself, it's believed Arsenal do not pay over £100k a week to anyone, so do the sums. With our wage bill it is obvious that we must be paying our squad players extortionate money. It's long been a problem at Arsenal that Wenger rewards failure, it shouldn't work that way.
TeeCee wrote:Martin - You know as well as we all do that actual figures will not be disclosed, but I doubt that even you are stupid enough to believe that any player would sign a multi-year contract without getting improved terms. If I could be bothered, I could quote articles written in several newspapers quoting that Bendtner and Denilson got IMPROVED contracts and that Arsene Wenger handled the negotiations himself. I don't NEED to prove it because I know what I read in different publications and heard on Sky Sports.
The AST confirmed recently that Wenger sits in on board meetings AND has a say in financial strategy within the club. Are you calling the Arsenal Supporters trust liars?
If Wenger hadn't rewarded so many of our 'average' and young players with improved contracts then we could afford to pay top players more.
My final bit of evidence is the fact that Deloittes auditors report Arsenal's wage bill as well over £100m p.a. (This info is available from Companies House). As you have said many times previously yourself, it's believed Arsenal do not pay over £100k a week to anyone, so do the sums. With our wage bill it is obvious that we must be paying our squad players extortionate money. It's long been a problem at Arsenal that Wenger rewards failure, it shouldn't work that way.
TeeCee get real. you have avoided the answering the question because you cannot honestly answer it without admitting there is no such evidence.
The simple fact is not once has anybody inside the club made one effort to offer an improved deal or improved terms to our best players that has been accepted since 2006 other than players we would both agree aren't good enough to get what they already get anywhere else. There is not instance of the Board stating we should offer any top player at the club or who might sign with the club the kind of wages they would get paid elsewhere. Not one example of the Board saying spend more money or questioing why it is not. Not one or you'd happily name it and there would be several to choose from.
The simple truth is you cannot name one and cannot just admit that because to admit that is to admit the Board may not have the club's success on the ptch as its first or main priority ahead of positioning themselves to make even bigger profits from the club's sale. Name one example.
And there would have to be such examples if again Arsene Wenger had on his own rejected years of tried-and-true financial policies against the Board's wishes. Now grow up and name one example of this or admit there is none and your faith in the Board is based on just that blind faith in their honopr and integrity without real facts.
I suspect I'll just get insulted and told to fuck off now because that's easier than being honest innit?
)
but really how long can they keep their constant desire to spend some more under wraps? How long can they keep it secret from the manager who attends their meetings regularly?
