Wenger is a nearly man and it is not about the money

[USMartin]

question is whether Wenger is managing the club with one hand tied behind his back or whether he's refusing to spend the money made available to him. We just don't know, and that's what pisses most people off!

Very good post thpoughout really but particualrly this. That is what the effort now underway is all about. We need to find out which it is and then seek the necessary changes to correct the situation, not simply to make a change to feel a bit better for a few minutes, only to realize too late we advocated for the wrong change, and accomplished nothing positive.

[kgw129]

I disagree. Trophies on the sideboard is THE ONLY true barometer with which to assess a manager or a coach.

Really?

But surely whether you win a trophy or not is also down to the financial resources at your disposal and the quality/financial resources of your rivals? - it's not just based on the quality of the manager - not by a long shot!

Look around at any major league, be it Italy, England, France, Germany, Spain, etc. and you find in the vast majority of cases that the most successful clubs are the wealthiest... I'd say that is more significant than the quality of the coach, to be honest.

The Wenger debate will roll and roll, but for the money invested, he's done an incredible job considering the financial might of our rivals - question is whether Wenger is managing the club with one hand tied behind his back or whether he's refusing to spend the money made available to him. We just don't know, and that's what pisses most people off!

I do not agree that "whether you win a trophy or not is also down to the financial resources at your disposal" which is the main theme of my original post. Whether won won the Carling Cup this year or not was down to whether or not the manager gave an instruction to his centre back as basic as "if in doubt fucking hoof it into row Z!" an instruction that Wenger obviously did not give. No money necessary for that. Obviously money has an influence up to a point. But any successful team is usually greater the sum of it's parts which is where the manager comes in. Wenger is also very adept at picking up very good players for comparative peanuts which really negates any financial disadvantage with the likes of Chelsea and Man City.

I will make the point once again. With the Players at his disposal Wenger should win the Carling Cup and the League this year but he will win neither in my opinion and that is due to his shortcomings as a manager and nothing to do with the amount of money that he has to spend. most of us agree that we needed strengthening at centre back which Wenger did last summer yet it was the very player that Wenger signed to strengthen in that area that gave the goal away in the Carling Cup final!

[kgw129]

I disagree. Trophies on the sideboard is THE ONLY true barometer with which to assess a manager or a coach.

Really?

But surely whether you win a trophy or not is also down to the financial resources at your disposal and the quality/financial resources of your rivals? - it's not just based on the quality of the manager - not by a long shot!

Look around at any major league, be it Italy, England, France, Germany, Spain, etc. and you find in the vast majority of cases that the most successful clubs are the wealthiest... I'd say that is more significant than the quality of the coach, to be honest.

The Wenger debate will roll and roll, but for the money invested, he's done an incredible job considering the financial might of our rivals - question is whether Wenger is managing the club with one hand tied behind his back or whether he's refusing to spend the money made available to him. We just don't know, and that's what pisses most people off!

I do not agree that "whether you win a trophy or not is also down to the financial resources at your disposal" which is the main theme of my original post. Whether won won the Carling Cup this year or not was down to whether or not the manager gave an instruction to his centre back as basic as "if in doubt fucking hoof it into row Z!" an instruction that Wenger obviously did not give. No money necessary for that. Obviously money has an influence up to a point. But any successful team is usually greater the sum of it's parts which is where the manager comes in. Wenger is also very adept at picking up very good players for comparative peanuts which really negates any financial disadvantage with the likes of Chelsea and Man City.

I will make the point once again. With the Players at his disposal Wenger should win the Carling Cup and the League this year but he will win neither in my opinion and that is due to his shortcomings as a manager and nothing to do with the amount of money that he has to spend. most of us agree that we needed strengthening at centre back which Wenger did last summer yet it was the very player that Wenger signed to strengthen in that area that gave the goal away in the Carling Cup final!

Also Wenger's team is actually the complete opposite in that it is not as good as the sum of it's parts. Players such as RVP, Fabregas, Arshavin (when he can be bothered - another one of Wenger's failings - motivation), Nasri, Walcott, Wilshire, these are top class players who on their day personally I would not swap for many others in the Premier League. Yet they fail to win trophies - why? Because the manager neglects the defensive organisation necesary to win trophies. Even the defenders we have are good individuals such as Sagna, Vermaelan, Djourou, Gibbs / Clichy but without organisation they will never be effective as a unit.

[Forever Clock End]

Wenger's ban...

'Before and during the match, Wenger will not be allowed to go in the team's dressing-room, the tunnel, or the technical zone, or on the pitch. He will also not be allowed to communicate with his team.'

Errr.....

1. Dressing Room (he doesn't talk to the players anyway)
2. Tunnel/Technical Zone (ok, so no arm waving for that game)
3. Not allowed to communicate with team (refer to point 1)

Who is Pat Rice going to nod and say yes to for this enthralling Champions League (hopefully) encounter?

[I Hate Hleb]

So no loss there then.

We should also remember that last time Arsene had a touchline ban, we beat Spurs 4-1 at the Lane!!

One more thing: When he has been in actually charge of the team, Pat Rice has got an unbeaten record.

[Henry Norris 1913]

last time wenger had a touchline ban we beat the scum 4-1 at the shithole so I think it could be a blessing in disguise

[I Hate Hleb]

Too slow!!!

[topgoon]

On the best team arguements, the best of his title wins....or at least the one I enjoyed the most was the double winning side 02. Especially the run after Graham Poll let the geordies beat us at home over Xmas.

The invincibles were fantastic and everything and I enjoy knowing we still have that record(Ha,Ha Surrey Utd better luck next time ) but I enjoyed the ride more in 02'