Liverpool kit launch sparks anger among Hillsborough familie

[DarylAFC]

As I said it's all my opinion which to be honest wont change. In my opinion, based on speaking to poeple who were there (Both sets of fans) and reading eye-witness accounts of what happened makes me sure that the police commited mass murder that day and it was covered up. As I said earlier, why hide facts from inquiries?

I admit Liverpool fans play the victim card too much which is disgusting and cringeworthy, but doesn't change my view that football fans were murdered that day.

Look up the definition of murder and I'm sure you'll change your mind. It will be manslaughter at best. And that is pretty tenuous considering the actions of hundreds of pissed up ticketless scousers.

We clearly wont agree on this so why not agree to disagree? I do see it as murder. Before I reserched Hillsborough in depth I thought it was 50/50, now I'm convinced it was more 99.9/0.01. In my opinion, it was mass murder. Just because the top cop was stupid doesn't absolve him from responsibility.

Yes, the media should have reported the Bradford Anniversary. Yes, Liverpool fans play the victim card too often. And I hate Liverpool as much as the next guy. But we are all football fans and if this happened at Ladies day or the Epson derby, the cop would be infront of a judge. But because it was only football fans, it didn't matter.

Just out of curiousity daryl do you mind me asking how old you are ? I am not trying to be a wise ass here so it isnt a trick question but I am curious to know if your opinions are influenced by your age like I would say my opinions are

Don't worry mate. I'm only 17 so I wasn’t alive when Hillsborough happened but I’ve done a lot of research into it (History geek you see) and as far as I’m concerned the police are mostly to blame. I’m not one of these “F**k authority” chav types, but in this instance, the police were in the wrong.

[augie]

I dont want to sound condescending here mate but I would suggest that growing up in an era where nobody is ever responsible for their actions is influencing your position in this debate - being 42 years old now I grew up in an era where if you fcuked up as a kid you got a severe clip around the ear (and that is putting it mildly) and you knew that you were being held accountable so might be reluctant to do the same thing again but nowadays will all this phsyco babble bullshit no c**t is ever responsible for their actions cos either they werent shown enough affection as a kid or they were shown too much affection as a kid Most of us oldies would be the first to acknowledge that the cops were not blameless that day but the initial problem was caused by thousands of boozed up scousers turning up late at the turnstiles late and trying to force their way in and this is something that the scousers themselves have never taken responsibility for - I suppose it is easier to blame the cops than admit that your family member was killed by their own people but until the scousers start taking some responsibility for what happened that day they will not get fcuk all sympathy for their refusal to play on that date or this bullshit with their new kit

[armchair]

I got my first ride when I was 17.

[I Hate Hleb]

I got my first ride when I was 17.

What number bus was it?

[Chips and Chocolate]

That shirt is amazing... And I don"t see why they're moaning, the flames are still there FFS

[DarylAFC]

I dont want to sound condescending here mate but I would suggest that growing up in an era where nobody is ever responsible for their actions is influencing your position in this debate - being 42 years old now I grew up in an era where if you fcuked up as a kid you got a severe clip around the ear (and that is putting it mildly) and you knew that you were being held accountable so might be reluctant to do the same thing again but nowadays will all this phsyco babble bullshit no c**t is ever responsible for their actions cos either they werent shown enough affection as a kid or they were shown too much affection as a kid Most of us oldies would be the first to acknowledge that the cops were not blameless that day but the initial problem was caused by thousands of boozed up scousers turning up late at the turnstiles late and trying to force their way in and this is something that the scousers themselves have never taken responsibility for - I suppose it is easier to blame the cops than admit that your family member was killed by their own people but until the scousers start taking some responsibility for what happened that day they will not get fcuk all sympathy for their refusal to play on that date or this bullshit with their new kit

That's how I was brought up, not like most of these idiots these days.

As I said before, I know my view isn't the majority but wouldnt the world be a crappy place if we were all the same eh?

[GranadaJoe]

Daryl, I think it's laudable that you have taken an interest in the Hillsboro' tradegy, but stating that the police committed mass-murder needs challenging.

1) When a book is titled "The Truth", it probably isn't.

2) 'Reading a couple of books' doesn't constitute 'research'.

3) Phil Straton was not an independent investigator. He was a Liverpool fan with existing issues with the police. He did not accpet that any Liverpool fans had done anything wrong, which is very much a minority view.

4) Murder is the killing of people with the 'intention to cause death or serious injury'. The police undoubtedly made poor decisions (opening an exit gate to relieve pressure outside the ground, which unfortunately led to greater pressure within the ground for example) but I haven't seen any evidnce that suggests that any policemen wanted to kill or seriously injure.

5) Drunk and/or ticketless Liverpool fans were not the primary cause of the tradegy but they were aggravating factors.

6) 14 Liverpool fans who killed their Italian counterparts at Heysel were convicted of 'involuntary manslaughter' and received around three years. How then could the actions of the Hillsboro' police constitute mass-murder'?

When I was young I read Chariot of the Gods which proved the existence of aliens and a cover up. It spawned further books and documentaries but was later shown to be complete bollocks. The 'Truth' is almost impossible to come by and anybody claiming to speak with complete authority should be treated very critically.

[DarylAFC]

Daryl, I think it's laudable that you have taken an interest in the Hillsboro' tradegy, but stating that the police committed mass-murder needs challenging.

1) When a book is titled "The Truth", it probably isn't.

2) 'Reading a couple of books' doesn't constitute 'research'.

3) Phil Straton was not an independent investigator. He was a Liverpool fan with existing issues with the police. He did not accpet that any Liverpool fans had done anything wrong, which is very much a minority view.

4) Murder is the killing of people with the 'intention to cause death or serious injury'. The police undoubtedly made poor decisions (opening an exit gate to relieve pressure outside the ground, which unfortunately led to greater pressure within the ground for example) but I haven't seen any evidnce that suggests that any policemen wanted to kill or seriously injure.

5) Drunk and/or ticketless Liverpool fans were not the primary cause of the tradegy but they were aggravating factors.

6) 14 Liverpool fans who killed their Italian counterparts at Heysel were convicted of 'involuntary manslaughter' and received around three years. How then could the actions of the Hillsboro' police constitute mass-murder'?

When I was young I read Chariot of the Gods which proved the existence of aliens and a cover up. It spawned further books and documentaries but was later shown to be complete bollocks. The 'Truth' is almost impossible to come by and anybody claiming to speak with complete authority should be treated very critically.

All just my opinion mate. I dont trust the "official" version of events completely. There's too many gaps in there story and too many proven lies. If they did nothing wrong they didn't have too lie did they?

And I admit, maybe murder is the wrong word to use, manslaughter is more accurate.