Buy back Cesc Fabregas, or let Man Utd buy him?

[donaldo]

Just a reminder

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jr1JALrpxBg

A mixture of pure joy that I had the chance to see this guy represent our club with outstanding performances but of course sadness that he is no longer carrying these deadbeats on his back

On a side issue, did anyone else notice just how many of those great chances created by Cesc were actually missed by our strikers ?

Take a look at this augie and weep.How many 50 yard passes played to an on running strikers feet.None of your tippy tappy shit we have now.The amount of guilt edge chances this guy set up.Who at the club now can pass the ball 50 yards on a plate like Cesc? When i read some of the things the English media write about Jack i think Christ what would they have said about Cesc if he was English?Just a great great player

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sRebqUOWY8

[QuartzGooner]

The style of play we play atm is pretty average, but we do have something and that is we are far more direct. 2008 was a really frustrating year because we kept doing this tippy tappy stuff. Always in front of the centre back and no penetration.

I strongly disagree.
2007 - 2008 we were the best side we have been since we last won a trophy in 2005.
I think we are far less direct now.
A major criticism of our current team is that we pass the ball too slowly, build up too slowly, take too few shots from distance.

Yes, in 2007 - 2008 Hleb messed around with the ball, very skillfully though, but we had Rosicky and Flamini running from midfield, and Theo sprinting down the wing to cross for Adebayor.

Hard to say if we are better or worse without Cesc alone, as we have lost RvP too.

[LDB]

Just a reminder

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jr1JALrpxBg

If even half of those passes were done by stevie meee the english media would ***** itself blind

[SteveO 35]

The style of play we play atm is pretty average, but we do have something and that is we are far more direct. 2008 was a really frustrating year because we kept doing this tippy tappy stuff. Always in front of the centre back and no penetration.

I strongly disagree.
2007 - 2008 we were the best side we have been since we last won a trophy in 2005.
I think we are far less direct now.
A major criticism of our current team is that we pass the ball too slowly, build up too slowly, take too few shots from distance.

Yes, in 2007 - 2008 Hleb messed around with the ball, very skillfully though, but we had Rosicky and Flamini running from midfield, and Theo sprinting down the wing to cross for Adebayor.

Hard to say if we are better or worse without Cesc alone, as we have lost RvP too.

Agree 100% Quartz and that's when I lost all respect for Wenger for dismantling that side. In some ways he had to rebuild the Invincibles and I forgive him for the departures of Henry, Vieira and Pires because despite what anyone says they had enjoyed their best days......but to dismantle a side that were genuine title contenders playing some great football, selling players in their prime years took Wenger into new territory and proved to me beyond any reasonable doubt that he is a professional sell-out merchant, and not in the slightest bit bothered about the supporters who provide the bulk of his 7m income

He destroyed the midfield of that side within six months and despite getting a handsome price for Adebayor never replaced his 30 goals in one season adequately and has since spunked reasonable sums of money on complete no-hopers up front

[g88ner]

Agree 100% Quartz and that's when I lost all respect for Wenger for dismantling that side. In some ways he had to rebuild the Invincibles and I forgive him for the departures of Henry, Vieira and Pires because despite what anyone says they had enjoyed their best days......but to dismantle a side that were genuine title contenders playing some great football, selling players in their prime years took Wenger into new territory and proved to me beyond any reasonable doubt that he is a professional sell-out merchant, and not in the slightest bit bothered about the supporters who provide the bulk of his 7m income

He destroyed the midfield of that side within six months and despite getting a handsome price for Adebayor never replaced his 30 goals in one season adequately and has since spunked reasonable sums of money on complete no-hopers up front

My memory on that season is fading a little, but how did Wenger dismantle the 2008 team exactly?

You say he destroyed the midfield within 6 months, but the midfield that season was Rosicky, Flamini, Cesc and Hleb; Rosicky picked up a serious injury and didn't play at all in 2008/09; Flamini wouldn't sign a new contract as he wanted to join his favourite team, AC Milan; and Hleb had a clause in his contract allowing him to leave for Barca.

I don't think Wenger wanted to lose any of those players so I'm not sure it's fair to say he dismantled the team (which suggests he did it out of choice... ) - admittedly, he probably handled the back-up players badly (Diarra and Gilberto), which contributed to losing them as well.

The ridiculous thing was not losing the players against our will, but that we didn't replace the outgoing central midfielders and instead embarked on the biggest waste of time and money of the Wenger era.... "project youth" with Song, Diaby and Denilson given far far far too much responsibility. Needless to say, it was a complete fuck up from which we've never really recovered. - in fact, 5 years on, I'm still waiting for a proper holding midfielder to arrive...

The summer of 2008 was when I started to seriously lose faith in our manager

[QuartzGooner]

Agree 100% Quartz and that's when I lost all respect for Wenger for dismantling that side. In some ways he had to rebuild the Invincibles and I forgive him for the departures of Henry, Vieira and Pires because despite what anyone says they had enjoyed their best days......but to dismantle a side that were genuine title contenders playing some great football, selling players in their prime years took Wenger into new territory and proved to me beyond any reasonable doubt that he is a professional sell-out merchant, and not in the slightest bit bothered about the supporters who provide the bulk of his 7m income

He destroyed the midfield of that side within six months and despite getting a handsome price for Adebayor never replaced his 30 goals in one season adequately and has since spunked reasonable sums of money on complete no-hopers up front

My memory on that season is fading a little, but how did Wenger dismantle the 2008 team exactly?

You say he destroyed the midfield within 6 months, but the midfield that season was Rosicky, Flamini, Cesc and Hleb; Rosicky picked up a serious injury and didn't play at all in 2008/09; Flamini wouldn't sign a new contract as he wanted to join his favourite team, AC Milan; and Hleb had a clause in his contract allowing him to leave for Barca.

I don't think Wenger wanted to lose any of those players so I'm not sure it's fair to say he dismantled the team (which suggests he did it out of choice... ) - admittedly, he probably handled the back-up players badly (Diarra and Gilberto), which contributed to losing them as well.

The ridiculous thing was not losing the players against our will, but that we didn't replace the outgoing central midfielders and instead embarked on the biggest waste of time and money of the Wenger era.... "project youth" with Song, Diaby and Denilson given far far far too much responsibility.

The summer of 2008 was when I started to seriously lose faith in our manager

This is the crux of it for me, that we did not replace with adequate quality or experience.

Flamini was asking huge money, in hindsight we would have been better paying him it than Adebayor but at the time few foresaw what a mess Adebayor would be the following season.

Hleb left, he did not want to stay and that was out of Wenger's control.

Diarra had to be shifted on, he was a hot potato.

Going back further I think we should have made more effort to keep Vieira and Pires, they had enough left in them to contribute for a few more seasons.

Henry was on the slide, though was still better than most.
But of all the players, I got then, and still have the feeling now, that he chose when to leave, I cannot believe the club pushed him out.
He knew he was losing pace, and that his effectiveness would be reduced in English football.
He was also getting divorced, and my hunch is he felt like "pastures new".

[SteveO 35]

He let Gilberto, Flamini and Diarra leave within six months.......and then signed Ramsey and Coquelin. If that doesn't qualify as dismantling a midfield I don't know what does

[g88ner]

He let Gilberto, Flamini and Diarra leave within six months.......and then signed Ramsey and Coquelin. If that doesn't qualify as dismantling a midfield I don't know what does

Flamini left on a free. We can speculate all day long as to whether that was Wenger's fault or not, but Flamini's father is Italian and he admitted it was a dream come true to join AC Milan, so maybe we couldn't stop him wanting to make the move.

Either way, losing Flamini, Diarra and Gilberto within 6 months of each other and choosing not to replace any of them with an experienced player was unforgivable - I'd like to say Wenger learnt from his mistake of over-relying on youth and rectified it in 2009, 2010 or 2011.... but he didn't, and that's why I've lost respect for the bloke

[augie]

Diarra was a hot potato cos he wasn't getting played - he was a French international that joined us to play in the DM position (left the chavs cos fed up playing at full back) and he was stuck behind a guy that was nowhere near the French squad and who had shown no interest in committing his future to the club

[g88ner]

Disarray was a hot potato

Was that disarray/desiree potato pun intended?

edit: you've changed it to "Diarra was a hot potato" - I preferred it as it was

[SteveO 35]

Diarra was a hot potato cos he wasn't getting played - he was a French international that joined us to play in the DM position (left the chavs cos fed up playing at full back) and he was stuck behind a guy that was nowhere near the French squad and who had shown no interest in committing his future to the club

Exactly right. I have to say Wenger snatched defeat from the jaws of victory with this one, because believe me signing him for £2m from Chelsea was an absolute fucking masterstroke given the bloke's class. Diarra was already pissed at playing part time right back at Chelsea and Wenger proceeded to do exactly what you said by then dicking him around in favour of a bloke that was a one season wonder and had ample opportunities to extend his contract and chose not to.

Its too convenient to say Diarra was a rotten egg. Any top quality international footballer frozen out of the first team after two consecutive moves would be pissed

[spendsum4uckingmoney]

From what I saw of Diarra at Madrid I thought he was excellent.

[g88ner]

From what I saw of Diarra at Madrid I thought he was excellent.

Never really cemented a place in the side at Chelsea, Arsenal, Real Madrid or France. The only place he was a regular was Pompey.

He's now 28yrs old and playing for Anzhi in Russia.

That's either a wasted career or a player not quite good enough for the top level. Personally, I've not seen enough of him to say.

[northbank123]

In reality as well as Flamini was playing he should have been dropped or punished in some way for refusing to sign a new deal - it must have been so obvious to those in the know that he was going to fuck off on a free. Such short-term thinking to sell Diarra.

[SteveO 35]

In reality as well as Flamini was playing he should have been dropped or punished in some way for refusing to sign a new deal - it must have been so obvious to those in the know that he was going to fuck off on a free. Such short-term thinking to sell Diarra.

Yes but we got Ramsey and Coquelin who had 'great potential'.......potential that 5 years later is still awaiting fulfilment. Still we've got all the time in the world......