As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
rigsby wrote:And what you are saying isn't sweeping?
Thoughts about Theo aside, I was making the point that the opposition matters little. It doesn't matter who you play you have to score against them. Saying it's only Blackpool means you are writing that team off, therefore shouldn't the players who have proven quality have torn them apart as well?
Whether Theo becomes a great player is irrelevant to what is posted about it 'just being blackpool'. If he banged in 3 against Man Utd, people would still be saying 'Its just one game' Who he plays against matters little, its how he concistantly does.
Of course it matters whom the opposition is! That is the difference between a player that looks brilliant in Div 1 or the Championship but then steps up to the PL and looks quite average. That's the difference between a player you pick for every game and one you leave on the bench. The ability to compete and dominate against the best teams is what makes champions.
This is part of him showing consistancy. Being consistant against relegation fodder is not being truly consistant.
Again, talking about whether other players tore them apart or not has nothing to do with Theo's performance. What exactly is tearing them apart? Winning 6-0? I would think so, particularly in a league where most games don't have 6 goals in them. It's relative where Blackpool are concerned. They are a weak team in the PL relevant to Arsenal, manure or the chavs, but they can beat Wigan on their day and will beat other teams this season. It isn't easy to score 6 against any team in the PL so by assocaiation the team must have performed to a certain level.
People seem to always defend Theo with "Yeah but Rosicky or Bendtner or whoever didn't play well!". I don't get that at all. The point is Theo looked brilliant yesterday against a weak 10 man team that will be relegated. I doubt he will look that good against the likes of manure, chavs, Villa, Citeh, scum and that is why the opposition is always relevent.
Yes, but Theo was looking really sharp even before Blackpool had a man sent off. Okay, it was 'only' Blackpool but I saw something different in him - a determination to prove people wrong, perhaps.
Also, it's very difficult to be consistent when you have suffered continuous injuries and when you manager never picks you for more than a couple of games in a roll or if you're either sub or substituted.
This season is the first that Theo enters both fully fit and well rested. The time to make a fairer judgement of him and his contribution - especially his consistency - should be at the end of this year.
I'm positive that even Theo's biggest critics - although probably not Radford 149 - hope that given those circumstances, he is able to show us that he is indeed worthy of being an Arsenal player.
"Theo Walcott says a full pre-season and hard work on the training ground could make the difference for him this season.
Last summer the striker's preparations were hampered by injury and, as a result, he did not make his first appearance until October.
However this year Walcott had a productive July, and the 21-year-old hopes that will make the difference to his season.
"I've had a very good pre-season," he reflected. "Not just me but the whole team. We are undefeated and I had a nice break, mentally, through the summer so I could think about things and I'm pushing on now.
"Pre-season is massive. I've been very unlucky with injuries last season. I'm 21 so I want to play games every week now, so it's a big season for me.
"I'm looking out for myself a bit more now - I'm one of the last to leave, I'm always staying behind now after training, practising things; crosses and set pieces and things like that.
"It's down to me, so I'll look after myself and I'm raring to go now."
After collecting the matchball following his hat-trick in Saturday's 6-0 victory over Blackpool, the Englishman asked his team-mates to sign the souvenir of his treble.
"It's a nice little thing I always do and hopefully there will be more to come," he said.
"I went off and [at the end of the game] I was trying to find the ball and one of the ballboys had it. But I nearly forgot to be honest."
"Scoring a hat-trick feels brilliant but the most important thing is that we got a win today and a clean sheet.
"It was a good result against Liverpool and Saturday, being the first game at home, was a big stepping stone and I think we need to push on from this result."
Well, its nice to hear. I was beginnign to think they didnt ACTUALLY practice things. I'm glad that he does at least SEEM to be showing progress, specifically with his crosses.
As for the comments saying he only played well because it was Blackpool, that may be true in part, and we shall see. However, things like crosses and set pieces are fairly independant of who we are playing, and they were mostly pretty good against Blackpool.
nino_rojo wrote:"I'm looking out for myself a bit more now - I'm one of the last to leave, I'm always staying behind now after training, practising things; crosses and set pieces and things like that.
Well, its nice to hear. I was beginnign to think they didnt ACTUALLY practice things. I'm glad that he does at least SEEM to be showing progress, specifically with his crosses.
As for the comments saying he only played well because it was Blackpool, that may be true in part, and we shall see. However, things like crosses and set pieces are fairly independant of who we are playing, and they were mostly pretty good against Blackpool.
From those training ground pictures during the summer, it seems him and nasri were working on free-kicks - seeing as they've been taking them in the 2 games so far. Would like to see if he can develop this side, as we really need someone who can actually score from a free-kick - unlike the mythical van Persie.
I Hate Hleb wrote:Yes, but Theo was looking really sharp even before Blackpool had a man sent off. Okay, it was 'only' Blackpool but I saw something different in him - a determination to prove people wrong, perhaps.
Also, it's very difficult to be consistent when you have suffered continuous injuries and when you manager never picks you for more than a couple of games in a roll or if you're either sub or substituted.
This season is the first that Theo enters both fully fit and well rested. The time to make a fairer judgement of him and his contribution - especially his consistency - should be at the end of this year.
I'm positive that even Theo's biggest critics - although probably not Radford 149 - hope that given those circumstances, he is able to show us that he is indeed worthy of being an Arsenal player.
Basically you're just agreeing with me! I too hope he can deliver the goods this season but he has to deliver consistantly and against the big clubs too. I just don't think people should now think Theo has somehow "arrived" because of one good performance!
rigsby wrote:I think impact sub atm, but imo Theo will never be the player he can be if he's constantly played out wide. Put him through the middle and then we'll see if he can be THAT player. Or if he is out wide he should cut in not go on the outside and cross, because he's not a natural winger and even natural wingers sometimes struggle to cross so what chance does Theo have?
I'ld just like to see him play for us how he did that night against Croatia, and by that I mean playing in that position of having someone hold the ball up, and Theo buzzing about.
I agree with the central part, he's more of a central type player and then I think he can show everyone what he can do instead of being judged out of position.
I Hate Hleb wrote:Yes, but Theo was looking really sharp even before Blackpool had a man sent off. Okay, it was 'only' Blackpool but I saw something different in him - a determination to prove people wrong, perhaps.
Also, it's very difficult to be consistent when you have suffered continuous injuries and when you manager never picks you for more than a couple of games in a roll or if you're either sub or substituted.
This season is the first that Theo enters both fully fit and well rested. The time to make a fairer judgement of him and his contribution - especially his consistency - should be at the end of this year.
I'm positive that even Theo's biggest critics - although probably not Radford 149 - hope that given those circumstances, he is able to show us that he is indeed worthy of being an Arsenal player.
Basically you're just agreeing with me! I too hope he can deliver the goods this season but he has to deliver consistantly and against the big clubs too. I just don't think people should now think Theo has somehow "arrived" because of one good performance!
Well I might be DB10 but think we've actually approached it from different ends of the spectrum. From your previous posts I think one can come to the assumption that you were never a fan of Theo's and didn't really think he had much to offer beyond pace (I could be wrong, but that's how it came across).
I have always thought that the talent was there, seeing enough on the admittedly few occasions in which he did play well - Chelsea 2007 League Cup Final; Liverpool and Sparta in the CL; Birmingham in the 'Gallas Tantrum' match - to come to the conclusion that he did have more than just pace and it was a question of him keeping injury free for a long spell, being used more often, and the team/manager utilising his assets better.
No, he hasn't 'arrived' because of one good performance; and yes, he most certainly does have to be more consistent - no-one can argue against that. Theo needs to show this season that the excuses - justifiable ones in my opinion - that the likes of me have been making for him, have been correct.
Now time might eventually prove us wrong and his critics - like Radford - right. Hopefully he will reward those who have had faith in him, as that way we all win.
Thing is for me, that Carling Cup 2007 final that you mention IHateHleb, was one in which Diaby, Denilson, Theo and Armand Traore all stood out as having great potential, and all played relatively well in considering their age and experience at the time. I agree with your sentiments on this.
I can certainly imagine why Wenger signed all four, but of the quartet, all seem to have gone backwards.
Diaby and Denilson have had injuries, but I just feel they have had the best opportunity to show what they can offer, and it does not look good enough to me at this stage.
Traore I cannot see as anything other than a wide midfielder, and he had every chance to show what his ability at Portsmouth.
It is Walcott who has not had the run of games because of quite serious injuries, which he appears to be over.
There are some harsh critics on this Forum, but at age 21 really think Walcott deserves two more seasons to show what he can do.
Last edited by QuartzGooner on Mon Aug 23, 2010 6:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.
QuartzGooner wrote:Thing is for me, that Carling Cup 2007 final that you mention IHateHleb, was one in which Diaby, Denilson, Theo and Armand Traore all stood out as having great potential, and all played relatively well in considering their age and experience at the time. I agree with your sentiments on this.
I can certainly imagine why Wenger signed all four, but of the quartet, all seem to have gone backwards.
Diaby and Denilson have had injuries, but I just feel they have had the best opportunity to show what they can offer, and it does not look good enough to me at this stage.
Traore I cannot see as anything other than a wide midfielder, and he had every chance to show what his ability at Portsmouth.
It is Walcott who has not had the run of games because of quite serious injuries, which he appears to be over.
There are some harsh critics on this Forum, but at age 21 really think Walcott deserves two more seasons to show what he can do.
Diaby and Walcott have both been at the club since 2005/06. Diaby has played 140 games in total, suffering a dreadful leg break and several other lower body injuries that have hampered his progress. He has also had to compensate for injury prone wide midfielders and has spent at least half of his appearances not playing in his best position
Walcott has played 138 games and has suffered a series of shorter term injuries but to the best of my knowledge none of them have been in the career-threatening bracket. He has been every bit as frustrating and inconsistent as Diaby so not sure how you arrive at your conclusion here.
Walcott gets afforded more time owing to his nationality and the hat-trick he scored for England.
BTW - Walcott was outstanding at the weekend, regardless of the opposition and I really hopes he proves a number of us wrong this year.
All I'm pointing out is that I don't buy this argument that he has had less time or opportunity than certain players you mention
But how many of Walcott's appearances have been as a sub, a late sub at that?
His injuries were career threatening had they not been solved by operations and physiotherapy, his shoulder dislocated every game.
When he has played, it is often for a couple of games in a row, but where is the long run of starts in his career?
Most players need a decent run of consecutive starts to show what they can do.
Walcott joined same time as Diaby, but Walcott was 16 when he joined.
Great things are expected of Benik Afobe's career, but not immediately if he is thrown into the first team this season.
Nationality does not come into it for me. I am all for giving a 20 year old Traore more time to see if he can make it as a wide midfielder, it is just that he seems so far from the first team that we might as well make cash from selling him and put it towards a goalkeeper.
(I would argue that Diaby and Walcott have been played "out of position", and the similarity is that I am not sure either quite fits a traditional position?
Walcott a mix between either-sided winger and striker, has been played in all three.
Diaby a mix between attacking central midfielder and number 10, but is played deep midfield in a defensive role that seldom gets the best from him.)
You make some good points but I'm not sure on what basis this other common argument springs up about Walcott being played out of position. Simply because he wears number 14, has pace to burn and lists the great TH14 amongst his idols it simply does not figure that he is a central striker.
To my mind he would need to show a far greater ability to deal with the physical aspects of the English game, and show much more positional awareness and timing of his runs to play down the middle. His finishing has also been hit and miss to say the least.
Other than the "Henry started out as a wide man" argument, I'm not sure where people get this view that Walcott should be played down the middle.
My view on Walcott as central striker is nothing to do with Henry.
It is just that when he (or some of our other players) run down the wing, too often for the last four seasons we as a team do not have anyone in the box to receive a cross, we lack enough good forward runs from central midfield.
So Walcott has to dwell on the ball in a tight position, and then the defenders surround him, and his chance of making a good to pass to a team mate is harder than it would be if he could cross it early.
Just hope with Chamakh and a fit RvP this will improve, (though whilst Chamakh is a good header, he often drops deep).
I think Walcott's best patterns of play are when he cuts in from wide with 50 - 25 yards to the goal, and can use his pace to scare relatively slow centre backs (i.e. Birmingham away 2008).
It makes me think a more central striker role could be on the cards in future.
As I said before though Quartz surely that game at Birmingham, and now Saturday’s as well, show that he doesn’t have to be playing as the central striker to find himself in those positions. He was after all being played on the right of a front 3 on Saturday wasn’t he? - ie “out of position.â€
- hope that given those circumstances, he is able to show us that he is indeed worthy of being an Arsenal player. 
