You should be ashamed

[marcengels]

[
There is no argument there whatsoever, just empty rhetorics and cries of "if you don't like it stay away/go support Chelsky/manUre" But your wish might just come true because people are having enough of forking out £60+ to watch Almunia scoring own goals, Wallcott doing 30 meter runs into nowhere particular, Bendtner missing from 5 yards and so on, if I want to watch Groundhog day i'll get it on play.com...

I see you are getting tired of this and that, but peculiary, you're not getting tired of Chelsky and ManUre humiliating us now on regular basis and Citeh being on a way to do the same *we conceded 10 goals in our last 3 visits there). Do we have to wait till scum from shite hart lane starts beating us regulary before inevitable happens.

No player is bigger than a club and same goes for a manager. And certinaly no one is irreplacable.

Skipper I hear you ,my post was all about put up or shut up ,if you don't like it make yourself heard AT THE GROUND instead of hiding behing the Gooner curtains,sniping from the keyboards like the gutless wonders I am sure most of you to be.

Many of you have opinions that Wenger is to go but I've yet to hear a single positive, like ,who would be better, given of course that WE HAVE NO MONEY .

Jesus ,Frodo Baggins,or Bruce Willis are not going to burst in and save the Arsenal and there are no big name managers who would come to a selling club who will not or cannot splash the cash.

Few or any of you ever saw the worst of the 70's Terry Mancini,John Halwley,Rankin et all ............this isnt the 70's and we are still 3rd .
You don't know how bad it was but trust me ive been in home crowds that frequently were less than 20 k and remember going to West Brom away and counting 78 people in the away end !

The fact is Arsenal fans have become the product of the me me me thatcher years ,instant gratification or die.

You have the choice stay or go its not rhetoric its a freedom issue.
Its yours to excerise or not ,however ,the press pick up on sites like this and use it to cause disharmony within my club,and that pisses me off.

Your views arent the majority they are a very small minority but if we enter into dialogue you attempt to riducule us .

The gooner attracts wannabee hacks,always has,it does not represent the fans as a whole and as I said before ,if people feel so strongly then put down your mouse and put up a banner,see how much support you get !

Simple eh !

Happy Birthday to Eugene Conway ,clock end in the sky !

Please provide evidence that there is no money to spend. I thought that 70% of that money from the sale to city was ring-fenced for transfers and wages, plus any additional money made available? Can you show me information otherwise? Just you saying that if money was available it would be spent, isn't good enough.

Need to be a bit better than that mate.

[ambarron]

[
There is no argument there whatsoever, just empty rhetorics and cries of "if you don't like it stay away/go support Chelsky/manUre" But your wish might just come true because people are having enough of forking out £60+ to watch Almunia scoring own goals, Wallcott doing 30 meter runs into nowhere particular, Bendtner missing from 5 yards and so on, if I want to watch Groundhog day i'll get it on play.com...

I see you are getting tired of this and that, but peculiary, you're not getting tired of Chelsky and ManUre humiliating us now on regular basis and Citeh being on a way to do the same *we conceded 10 goals in our last 3 visits there). Do we have to wait till scum from shite hart lane starts beating us regulary before inevitable happens.

No player is bigger than a club and same goes for a manager. And certinaly no one is irreplacable.

Skipper I hear you ,my post was all about put up or shut up ,if you don't like it make yourself heard AT THE GROUND instead of hiding behing the Gooner curtains,sniping from the keyboards like the gutless wonders I am sure most of you to be.

Many of you have opinions that Wenger is to go but I've yet to hear a single positive, like ,who would be better, given of course that WE HAVE NO MONEY .

Jesus ,Frodo Baggins,or Bruce Willis are not going to burst in and save the Arsenal and there are no big name managers who would come to a selling club who will not or cannot splash the cash.

Few or any of you ever saw the worst of the 70's Terry Mancini,John Halwley,Rankin et all ............this isnt the 70's and we are still 3rd .
You don't know how bad it was but trust me ive been in home crowds that frequently were less than 20 k and remember going to West Brom away and counting 78 people in the away end !

The fact is Arsenal fans have become the product of the me me me thatcher years ,instant gratification or die.

You have the choice stay or go its not rhetoric its a freedom issue.
Its yours to excerise or not ,however ,the press pick up on sites like this and use it to cause disharmony within my club,and that pisses me off.

Your views arent the majority they are a very small minority but if we enter into dialogue you attempt to riducule us .

The gooner attracts wannabee hacks,always has,it does not represent the fans as a whole and as I said before ,if people feel so strongly then put down your mouse and put up a banner,see how much support you get !

Simple eh !

Happy Birthday to Eugene Conway ,clock end in the sky !

I have never actually seen this section of the website (despite using it for about 2 years). Interesting argument the Herd and take your point re fans hiding behind keyboards etc and not doing it at the ground!!! I would take the opinion that we go to the ground to support the team and use the forum to discuss our feelings!!

I have said before i find some comments on the forum disrespectful ie calling wenger a prick or whatever else however I agree with Skipper that everyone has a shelf life!!! i agree in his comments your sick of AW being criticised but not sick of losing EVERY big game to Chelsea and Utd (tell me the last time we beat one of them when it REALLY mattered????)

As for who to replace AW with, thats not our job, same if we feel we need a forward? as fans we can just state "we are crying out for a tall target man" thats up to the club to find him!!

As for who to replace AW, again thats not up to us, i think people have put forward names, Mourinho, Hiddink etc but again thats up to the club, who had heard of AW when we appointed him????

[marcengels]

I have never actually seen this section of the website (despite using it for about 2 years). Interesting argument the Herd and take your point re fans hiding behind keyboards etc and not doing it at the ground!!! I would take the opinion that we go to the ground to support the team and use the forum to discuss our feelings!!

I have said before i find some comments on the forum disrespectful ie calling wenger a prick or whatever else however I agree with Skipper that everyone has a shelf life!!! i agree in his comments your sick of AW being criticised but not sick of losing EVERY big game to Chelsea and Utd (tell me the last time we beat one of them when it REALLY mattered????)

As for who to replace AW with, thats not our job, same if we feel we need a forward? as fans we can just state "we are crying out for a tall target man" thats up to the club to find him!!

As for who to replace AW, again thats not up to us, i think people have put forward names, Mourinho, Hiddink etc but again thats up to the club, who had heard of AW when we appointed him????

Some valid points amb, ones that I have brought up in the general chat section previously.

The forum is like a pub. We all bitch and moan but when you get to the ground, it's time to support. You may get frustrated with players and actions, but by and large we get behind the team there, we dissect here.

And the arguement with respect to who else is out there who could do a better job/ be a better centre half, etc...doesn't wash. It's not our job to find the next manager or centre half. That's why we have highly paid professionals and a world class scouting system. All we can hope to base any judgemnet on is what we see in front of us, what AW says...and what the finances say.

[Cloggs]

Some got stuck in their "In Arsene we trust" mantra.
If I was a shareholder I would chant it all day long but unfortunately I'm not.

So what is it gonna be? Ofcourse there's no money! There will never be enough money as long as Abramowich et al writes off his money as easy as he whipes his arse.

So, as the whole world knows, we cannot bite them so ending up 3rd is our place. Which is not bad at all on a *relative* small budget and with your best forward crippled for half the season. But if we would grab the title then it's not the work of Monsieur Wenger, the tactical genius, (tongue in cheek) but because Chelski and Manure dropped the points, for whatever reason.

I can live with that because it is reality, but what annoys the shit out of me then is the constant "We can compete, it's the best team I ever had, I am convinced we get a trophy this year, title hopes are not over, I only buy when he adds something" blablabla bullocks! Google: "Wenger + Team + Title + Trophy".

No wonder that some fans get frustrated because each time they got lured into Wenger's and the club's "manage their expectations!" empty rethorics, things won't work out as "promised".

The lining up at Stoke was a joke and an insult. But by putting his bet on the FA he would have been saying the obvious, wouldn't he?
Didn't see a "Wenger knows" banner there.

The match against Manure could have been a draw if he adjusted his tactics to the opponent.

But enough of all this, In the end I don't give a shit who's managing the squad, the question is how many seasons without silverware will be swallowed?

[skipper]

[
There is no argument there whatsoever, just empty rhetorics and cries of "if you don't like it stay away/go support Chelsky/manUre" But your wish might just come true because people are having enough of forking out £60+ to watch Almunia scoring own goals, Wallcott doing 30 meter runs into nowhere particular, Bendtner missing from 5 yards and so on, if I want to watch Groundhog day i'll get it on play.com...

I see you are getting tired of this and that, but peculiary, you're not getting tired of Chelsky and ManUre humiliating us now on regular basis and Citeh being on a way to do the same *we conceded 10 goals in our last 3 visits there). Do we have to wait till scum from shite hart lane starts beating us regulary before inevitable happens.

No player is bigger than a club and same goes for a manager. And certinaly no one is irreplacable.

Skipper I hear you ,my post was all about put up or shut up ,if you don't like it make yourself heard AT THE GROUND instead of hiding behing the Gooner curtains,sniping from the keyboards like the gutless wonders I am sure most of you to be.

Many of you have opinions that Wenger is to go but I've yet to hear a single positive, like ,who would be better, given of course that WE HAVE NO MONEY .

Jesus ,Frodo Baggins,or Bruce Willis are not going to burst in and save the Arsenal and there are no big name managers who would come to a selling club who will not or cannot splash the cash.

Few or any of you ever saw the worst of the 70's Terry Mancini,John Halwley,Rankin et all ............this isnt the 70's and we are still 3rd .
You don't know how bad it was but trust me ive been in home crowds that frequently were less than 20 k and remember going to West Brom away and counting 78 people in the away end !

The fact is Arsenal fans have become the product of the me me me thatcher years ,instant gratification or die.

You have the choice stay or go its norhetoric its a freedom issue.
Its yours to excerise or not ,however ,the press pick up t on sites like this and use it to cause disharmony within my club,and that pisses me off.
Your views arent the majority they are a very small minority but if we enter into dialogue you attempt to riducule us .

The gooner attracts wannabee hacks,always has,it does not represent the fans as a whole and as I said before ,if people feel so strongly then put down your mouse and put up a banner,see how much support you get !

Simple eh !

Happy Birthday to Eugene Conway ,clock end in the sky !

So it's me or anyone who dares to question and criticise Arsene Wenger that is causing disharmony within a club??? Sorry mate, but that statement is absolute crap!

Let me tell you, if every Arsenal supporter behaved the way you did, and never question anything Wenger or Board do, there wouldn't be any improvement.

Do you honestly think Wenger would react the way he did at half time againt Liverpool at Anfield, if he wasn't under pressure?

Do you think that improved defnsive performance last night had nothing to do with displeasure of majority of Arsenal fans with the way we defended in last 4-5 games?

I work in RM del office in Highbury and there was unusualy high number of letters addressed to one Arsene Wenger that went through my hands on tuesday and wednesday. Let me tell you, they were not "congratulations" cards. On one of them it was written: "give it to HIM personally, or send it back!!!" There was a lot of anger in those handwritings, trust me.

So we might be minority, but our voice is loud and clear.


Don't forget, we are on same side here, we support same team.

[Herd]

111)I think that the signing of silvestre and cambell would be ample evidence to not having money to spend.
There is also a clause in the 250 million wrapped loan that prevents us spending more than 20 m per annum net on players per annum.
222) I hear u on Its not out job to pick a new management but surely its imcumbent on anyone not to ditch a flawed genius unless they have found something better.
333) I have frequently vented my spleen to the club,and berated a very flustered david dein in the past direct up front and very personally when I think things are wrong.
444) If you seriously think that the gooner protests pressurred wenger into improving the defence weds then i think again.

I have no problem with dissent just dont like it bieng presented as fact and wisdom,best give your opinions in the pub not the internet.

[marcengels]

111)I think that the signing of silvestre and cambell would be ample evidence to not having money to spend.
There is also a clause in the 250 million wrapped loan that prevents us spending more than 20 m per annum net on players per annum.
222) I hear u on Its not out job to pick a new management but surely its imcumbent on anyone not to ditch a flawed genius unless they have found something better.
333) I have frequently vented my spleen to the club,and berated a very flustered david dein in the past direct up front and very personally when I think things are wrong.
444) If you seriously think that the gooner protests pressurred wenger into improving the defence weds then i think again.

I have no problem with dissent just dont like it bieng presented as fact and wisdom,best give your opinions in the pub not the internet.

The signing of Campbell and Silvestre provides no evidence at all, let alone "ample" evidence. Just a manager who's very tight and takes his responsibility towards the clubs finances to the highest degree, over and above what is neccessary.

You might be right on the 20m per annum, but I suggest that is a base figure that does not include money made from sales, which was the point that I wanted addressed. The money made from sales is available.

As said, I personally don't want to ditch Wenger. But who of us can possibily know who would be better or worse in the long run. After all, Wenger was a virtual unknown in the country prior to him coming to us.

I think maybe you see too much in the internet. I too think people get a little carried away with presenting things but better vented here where it is essentialy harmless than around the ground. People debate here like they do in a pub and some good banter can take place. Some of it is shit though and some people take themselves too seriously. Just have to take it for what it is. After all, you're using it to respond to something you don't like.

I prefer the pub.

[Herd]

I'ts impossible to say I have concrete proof there is or there is not money to spend,however I would bet my house on him being given no money to spend. (3 bedroom semi Aberdeen Park)

Wenger would never untill recently sign an oldie just as he has never given any player a contract who is older than 30 more than 1 year extention.

If we had more money im sure Wenger would use it ,as stubborn as he can sometimes be he isnt stupid .

To say these forums are harmless is also not true ,the press can and do pick up on this site and use it as evidence that "the fans are not happy with wenger and want a change",to say my argument is crap on this one once again proves that some of you cannot take any argument without a put down.

I dont support Arsenal I am Arsenal,so to say we are all on the same side is wrong.
I hate a lot of so called Arsenal fans as much as I hate spurs !

[marcengels]

I'ts impossible to say I have concrete proof there is or there is not money to spend,however I would bet my house on him being given no money to spend. (3 bedroom semi Aberdeen Park)

Wenger would never untill recently sign an oldie just as he has never given any player a contract who is older than 30 more than 1 year extention.

If we had more money im sure Wenger would use it ,as stubborn as he can sometimes be he isnt stupid .

To say these forums are harmless is also not true ,the press can and do pick up on this site and use it as evidence that "the fans are not happy with wenger and want a change",to say my argument is crap on this one once again proves that some of you cannot take any argument without a put down.

I dont support Arsenal I am Arsenal,so to say we are all on the same side is wrong.
I hate a lot of so called Arsenal fans as much as I hate spurs !

You're arguement's not crap - but you said "WE HAVE NO MONEY" shouting out to the rest of us like it's a statement of fact - something by the way, you seem not to like in others. Sorry mate, but if you make an argument, don't boo hoo when others pick you up on it and ask for evidence of your statement. "he wouldn't do this or that" doesn't wash.

My argument is, without knowing the full facts, is that Arsene Wenger is taking his responsibility over finance to an over-cautious degree. That's it, and I think through what he says, through the money that is available through sales, that my argument is based upon some sound footing. I don't know for sure and niether do you.

The club will make up their own mind unless their is an uprising in the stadium - something which aint gonna happen accoring to you, so why worry that the press inflates a few arguements. I'm sure they're all grown up and intelligent enough to realise the true feelings of fans.

As for the last statement Mr Arsenal...it explains alot.

[jmardon]

Skipper, the minority of fans questioning Arsene's decisions hold no sway with the board at all, nor should they. I guess the only time the board would really start to pay attention to unhappy fans is if demand continues to decrease and we fail to sell out on a more regular basis. Your second comment about Arsene only reacting that way at anfield due to pressure is also bollox. Do you not think Arsene was pissed off with the performance himself? He didnt rant at them because he was worried of fan pressure. He ranted because he cares. He cares far more than you are giving him credit for. Yes there are somethings that need addressing. The keeper, the lack of a centre forward, etc, but there are a far more positives to having Arsene than being without him.

There seems to me to be a large number of Arsenal fans who turn up and feel entitled to win every game, whilst loving the moan they can have when we fail to do just that. The type of fan who would have written Alex Song off after that fulham performance and probably wanted Arsene out before the unbeaten season.

I repeat that there are things he may have done differently this season, but he's in a better position to analysis and correct that than anyone else and we should trust him to do so. I will also add that we would be in a very very strong position now with RVP not out for so long and the moaners would have f**k all to say.

Get behind Arsene and realise how lucky we are to have him and just stop the f**king moaning.

[marcengels]

Do you think that it would have been possible to get in on loan at the very least, someone to cover for RvP?

If we had this player available or that player available doesn't wash on this count. We had the chance to get someone in and didnt take it. We sold a main striker last year and didn't replace. Error compounded by error.

I am sorry to moan , but AW is head of our team the CEO of the team and therefore is there to answer critics. If Bendtner scores, 10+ goals and we win something, then job done. But you can't blame people for being sceptical.

[Herd]

You're arguement's not crap - but you said "WE HAVE NO MONEY" shouting out to the rest of us like it's a statement of fact - something by the way, you seem not to like in others. Sorry mate, but if you make an argument, don't boo hoo when others pick you up on it and ask for evidence of your statement. "he wouldn't do this or that" doesn't wash.

My argument is, without knowing the full facts, is that Arsene Wenger is taking his responsibility over finance to an over-cautious degree. That's it, and I think through what he says, through the money that is available through sales, that my argument is based upon some sound footing. I don't know for sure and niether do you.

The club will make up their own mind unless their is an uprising in the stadium - something which aint gonna happen accoring to you, so why worry that the press inflates a few arguements. I'm sure they're all grown up and intelligent enough to realise the true feelings of fans.

As for the last statement Mr Arsenal...it explains alot.

Im not boo hooing mr engels ,however ive been arguing for a couple of years that we cant have any money else it would have been spent,however this argument is a cue for howls of derision and abuse by those who seem to be or present themselves as "in the know" I repeated my words in in capitals for effect. I stand by what I said and U either agree with the statement or u dont its your choice.

My previous arguments were simple if you want Wenger out stop carping from the keyboards and make yourself known at the Ground .
My contention is that u wouldnt get much if any support from the rank and file in fact you might get a kick in the bellamys,but hey thats democracy for you.

Its a point of view not shared by some here ,so what ?? some of my pals share your views but dont feel the need to vent their spleens on this site.
If your right and whilst I doubt it you could be then someone should force Wenger to get the cheque book out and buy ............starting with a goalkeeper !

Scuse the Mr Arsenal bit should have left that off,I beleive it but thats not adding anything to the argument.

[jmardon]

Do you think that it would have been possible to get in on loan at the very least, someone to cover for RvP?

If we had this player available or that player available doesn't wash on this count. We had the chance to get someone in and didnt take it. We sold a main striker last year and didn't replace. Error compounded by error.

I am sorry to moan , but AW is head of our team the CEO of the team and therefore is there to answer critics. If Bendtner scores, 10+ goals and we win something, then job done. But you can't blame people for being sceptical.

it may have been possible to get someone in on loan up front and it looks like he
may have at the last minute. He also obviously has the Bordeaux striker lined up for the summer, but that doesn't help us now! I'm not saying Arsene couldn't have done things differently, and the keeper situation looks even worse this morning, I'm just saying if people are questioning his overall position at the club then, in my opinion, they
are wrong and unappreciative of his achievements and intelligence to get it right again.
People should be careful what they wish for because without arsene things would be far far worse.

[skipper]

It's boring to hear time after time the mantra of "If Wenger leaves things will turn for worse"

On what exactly are you guys basing that? On what?

I'm convinced things will turn for better once Wenger leaves. There. My guess is as good as yours.

And for Mr Arsenal, aka Herd, listen mate, there are some Fabianski jerseys on sale down Armoury, just thought I'll let you know, you would surely want to wear it proudly on saturday, wouldn't you mr Arsenal

[jmardon]

It's boring to hear time after time the mantra of "If Wenger leaves things will turn for worse"

On what exactly are you guys basing that? On what?

I'm convinced things will turn for better once Wenger leaves. There. My guess is as good as yours.

And for Mr Arsenal, aka Herd, listen mate, there are some Fabianski jerseys on sale down Armoury, just thought I'll let you know, you would surely want to wear it proudly on saturday, wouldn't you mr Arsenal

I'm basing it on what he has done for us and the current position we find ourselves in with a view to long term stability. Hows that new stadium? Not bad? Wouldnt be in it without the modern Arsenal that Wenger has created. The fact he has still managed to qualify for the champions league every year since moving stadiums and without a pot to piss in is quite an achivement as well. Now its not silverware I know, but its put us in a strong position to go and win some sliverware in the coming years as the debt eases and he might finally start to spend. Thats not good enough for some who fail to see the bigger picture but whats the alternative? Skipper, youre saying we'd be better off without Arsene - so who to come in and do the job Wenger has on the budget he has? In the coming years Arsene should have the budget to at least try and compete after having to be prudent over the last few years, and he should be given the chance to spend it. F**kin pisses me off the lack of appreciation some show towards Arsene. Thank f**k its the minority. Finally, skipper, you get rid of Arsene and you also get rid of Cesc and any chance we have of keeping him over the next couple of years - however slim that chance might be!