Adebayor and Eboue not worthy of first team places (16/11)

[Gooneroonie]

you're wrong about Eboue. He plays with confidence and style, at the very highest level. The diving thing is an issue when you see it in the premier league I agree. But honestly, last fifteen minutes of the Champion's League final, how many Gooners werer saying, I hope Barca score here cos Eboue dived for our goal and it's just not right... I know I wasn't. Eboue performs consistently and thrives on pressure, that's his value to the team.

I for one wouldn't want to win the champions league, or any major trophy on the back of cheating. I fucking hate diving and there is no excuse.

I don't care if others do it, that does not make it right.

Presumably you campaigned for Robert Pires and Freddie Ljungberg to be sold then?

I didn't campaign for them to be sold but I did let my thoughts be known if I thought they had dived. To be fair, I don't think Freddie was that big of a culprit. Bobby would dive from time to time, but he didn't do all that rolling around on the floor nonsense which is just embarassing. He would leave his trailing foot to connect so there WAS usually contact, and therefore almost always debatable. Also, these two added so much in other areas that you would never doubt (stats or not) the impact they had on the side...

[26may1989]

To be fair, I don't think Freddie was that big of a culprit.

Freddie dived more often but less spectacularly than Pires. Freddie was one of the savviest free-kick winners around, and was therefore a prolific cheat.

Also, these two added so much in other areas that you would never doubt (stats or not) the impact they had on the side...

Exactly: they were better players than Eboue, so we forgave or accepted their cheating.

I don't mind slagging players off for cheating, I just think we should be honest when we're having a go at Eboue. I.e., it's not the cheating that bothers us, we just want him to be less obvious about it (i.e. more like Freddie and with less rolling around) and we'd also tolerate his cheating more if he were a better player.

[Galasso]

Agreed - People are happy to have a go at Eboue's cheating because he is seen as expendable. A bit more honesty on here wouldn't go amiss.

[Gooneroonie]

We are The Arsenal and should not be rolling around on the ground feigning injury when there has been no contact made. End of.

Also, we should not make a meal out of tackles that anyone who has played a game of football knows does not warrant that response.

It is that embarassing form of cheating that pisses me off. I hope this is clear.

[gasman]

lets get one thing straight there is a big difference between
" going down easy" to win a free kick or penalty, and falling to the floor holding your face trying to get some body sent off, eboue is embarrassing his antics have no place in football along with players at other clubs who do the same, if we as fans make our feelings known then perhaps we could rid our game of this evil.

[Gooneroonie]

lets get one thing straight there is a big difference between
" going down easy" to win a free kick or penalty, and falling to the floor holding your face trying to get some body sent off, eboue is embarrassing his antics have no place in football along with players at other clubs who do the same, if we as fans make our feelings known then perhaps we could rid our game of this evil.

Glad to see someone else writing sensibly. Thought I was going mad for a bit there.

[Galasso]

lets get one thing straight there is a big difference between
" going down easy" to win a free kick or penalty, and falling to the floor holding your face trying to get some body sent off, eboue is embarrassing his antics have no place in football along with players at other clubs who do the same, if we as fans make our feelings known then perhaps we could rid our game of this evil.

Glad to see someone else writing sensibly. Thought I was going mad for a bit there.

Now, you see this is what I hate - "someone else writing sensibly". Can't you just debate this issue without insulting those who disagree. And in your last post you wrote that classic of all contempary phrases - "end of". I assumed that this meant you were saying that you had revealed the truth of all thruts and therefore no further interaction was neccesary. Which is why I left it

Still, Eboue was hit in the face by Carragher although his reaction was over the top. He isn't the first and won't be the last and I am sure that he will grow out of this behaviour. However, your original reasoning included the fact that his overall contribution isn't as good as other "cheats". It goes in in every team, in every game and who are we to decide where the line is drawn.

Cheating is cheating.

[proudtosaythatname]

Sensible use of video evidence and appropriate punishment could stop cheating once and for all. But when did the FA last do anything sensible?

[Galasso]

Sensible use of video evidence and appropriate punishment could stop cheating once and for all. But when did the FA last do anything sensible?

Video evidence?

How about we use video evidence against people who actually threaten the careers of fellow professionals before we get all hot under the collar over those players who are perceived (smacked in the face by carragher) to cheat.

Alan Shearer - England captain, taking Neil lennon's head off with a head-high kick. Video evidence - no action - England captain!

Sunderland fuck - Abou Diaby's broken ankle - no action.

Why don't people wake up and realise that it is more important that we punish those players that jeopardise other player's careers. All we're doing is perpetuating this hard but fair myth that goes on in English football but allows the likes of carrgaher and shearer to get away with everything and for career-ending tackles to go on by others.

[Gooneroonie]

Galasso, we will have to agree to disagree on this one. The type of football that you clearly favour is one that could easily drive me, and many like-minded supporters away from football.

The reason why I put 'end of' is it is even more embarassing to see another Arsenal fan not criticising the type of cheating that I was talking about in a red and white shirt, than it is to see those offences being committed.

You clearly just are in the mood for a long drawn out debate, but I will be resting my case here, as I don't want to draw any more attention to the fact that some supporters favour this pathetic behaviour over more physical football.

PS. Are you one of the guys suing the club? Just thought I'd ask...

[Galasso]

I had already left it Gooneroonie but you had to denegrate my and others opinions for no reason. I might disagree with you - and if you read carefully I don't completely disagree - I don't leave a cute "aside" making out that my or others like-minded posters are somehow superior.

Please re-read. I'm not for Eboue's behaviour rather against abitary acceptance of cheating, which is sometimes based on how talented the player happens to be.

[proudtosaythatname]

Misread me too. I'm for video evidence to remove violent play as well as cheating.

[Gooneroonie]

I had already left it Gooneroonie but you had to denegrate my and others opinions for no reason. I might disagree with you - and if you read carefully I don't completely disagree - I don't leave a cute "aside" making out that my or others like-minded posters are somehow superior.

Please re-read. I'm not for Eboue's behaviour rather against abitary acceptance of cheating, which is sometimes based on how talented the player happens to be.

I wouldn't dream of 'denegrating' anyone

[dvbrisgooner1]

Once again I've read someone calling Adebayor lazy. I can only concluse that this is written by people who haven't seen him play live. He may be accused of lacking ability at times (and I can understand that, even if I don't agree) but I can't let people accuse him of laziness. This guy works harder than any other centre-forward in the Premier League.

As for Eboue, I can't abide his behaviour. However, my main reason for wanting him out of the team is that I can't see what he is contributing on the wing - young Walcott (who is far from being a top player) would be a much better bet on the wing (although I'd rather see him down the middle with Hleb out wide).

[DanielD]

Ade is one of my favorite players in this team. I think that as dvbris said, he is one of the hardest working strikers in the league and i definetly see him in the future of our team. I can't understand the fact that Manu Adebayor and Manu Eboue are written in the same sentence in terms of contribution to team.
Eboue is not only the worst right winger we got, he is the most childish player i have ever seen playing for Arsenal (our own C.Ronaldo, if you want). Diving, rolling on the floor, shouting at refs, elbowing other players, etc. He is not only paralyzing our attacks from the right side, he is doing it without any grace (Alex Hleb not shooting was very graceful for example ).