Arsenal FC, not PLC

[Arsenal 1991]

I agree with Mike.

2 simple questions/statements.

We pay the highest ticket prices in the world, we have a right to expect that the money will be reinvested in the team. Im sure Quartz or Steveo can put it into better words than that.

No you don't, we pay the highest ticket prices, for that we expect to see a game of football, there are no strings attached to paying for a ticket.

Why are they charging such high prices if they aren't going to invest it in the team?

[Its Up 4 Grabs Now]

I do agree with the jist of your post IU, having made the same basic point more briefly earlier in the thread .

I'm just not as fluent with my tongue as you I guess, marc.

although i dont tap the keys with my tongue, i can give head, and debate the under investment at Arsenal simultaenously.

Is that just a fancy way of saying you talk a lot of bollocks?

[Gunnersaurus]

I agree with Mike.

2 simple questions/statements.

We pay the highest ticket prices in the world, we have a right to expect that the money will be reinvested in the team. Im sure Quartz or Steveo can put it into better words than that.

No you don't, we pay the highest ticket prices, for that we expect to see a game of football, there are no strings attached to paying for a ticket.

Why are they charging such high prices if they aren't going to invest it in the team?

Because they can, this is why I find this movement nothing more then a joke, it is driven by so called realists with their heads in the clouds and no sense of reality.

Get a grip, its embarrassing.

[Its Up 4 Grabs Now]

I agree with Mike.

2 simple questions/statements.

We pay the highest ticket prices in the world, we have a right to expect that the money will be reinvested in the team. Im sure Quartz or Steveo can put it into better words than that.

No you don't, we pay the highest ticket prices, for that we expect to see a game of football, there are no strings attached to paying for a ticket.

Why are they charging such high prices if they aren't going to invest it in the team?

According to the AST, the ST-rise is partly cos for the 1st time in years our wages have gone above the 50% revenue that the "fair play" regulations will mean you have to be under. But if the wage-distribution issue isnt part of the protest it's hard to raise that point. Which is why a) some serious clarification still needs to be done about what this is/isn't gonna be about (cos everything's linked) & b) I'd personally say it would be a good idea getting in touch with the AST just to get as clear a picture as possible of the lay of the land financially.

[Arsenal 1991]

I agree with Mike.

2 simple questions/statements.

We pay the highest ticket prices in the world, we have a right to expect that the money will be reinvested in the team. Im sure Quartz or Steveo can put it into better words than that.

No you don't, we pay the highest ticket prices, for that we expect to see a game of football, there are no strings attached to paying for a ticket.

Why are they charging such high prices if they aren't going to invest it in the team?

Because they can, this is why I find this movement nothing more then a joke, it is driven by so called realists with their heads in the clouds and no sense of reality.

Get a grip, its embarrassing.

So we're supposed to just sit here while they increase prices, make us much worse off just to line their pockets and not say anything at all.

The only other way to make them notice would be not to go but understandably people still want to watch The Arsenal and aren't willing to give their season tickets up.

[QuartzGooner]

IU4GN

So far this is a mission statement, open to revision as we go along. I think Point 2 is what you and USMartin are concerned about.

In point 1 I have added a clause in brackets, anyone got any thoughts ???? It allows us to address tickets prices, but without treading of the toes of AISA.


1.) To encourage the club to visibly invest in quality players, (who reflect the high ticket prices paid?), to allow Arsenal to compete for the major club competition trophies domestically and in Europe.

2.) To seek clarity over the club's youth policy, with particular regard to the policy of rewarding young players with long term contracts that have increased the club's annual wage bill yet not resulted in trophies.

3.) To understand the PLC's longer term vision and strategy. As supporters we have clear goals and ambitions, measured by winning trophies. As an organisation involved in various business sectors, but whose principle activity is a football club, we believe that this should also be the clear and measured objective of the PLC.

[Its Up 4 Grabs Now]

IU4GN you raise some fair points...but no movement unless it is a movement of one has unanimity on any aspect of the goals it pursues...

Naturally, but at the same time you cant go completely the other way. Not to get all Mr Miyagi or anyfink but most successful revolutions will be those seeking a certain outcome, even if the path towards it isn’t so clear cut from the beginning. I’m just saying people need to be 100% clear about what it is that they, and the group as a whole, are seeking from this. Cos I’m not sure everyone’s on the same page yet.

And we will work our way through it because we all share the same main goal - what is best for Arsenal Football Club.

Of course, but as lovely as that sounds, the point is different people have different ideas about what is best for Arsenal.

[Arsenal 1991]

I agree with Mike.

2 simple questions/statements.

We pay the highest ticket prices in the world, we have a right to expect that the money will be reinvested in the team. Im sure Quartz or Steveo can put it into better words than that.

No you don't, we pay the highest ticket prices, for that we expect to see a game of football, there are no strings attached to paying for a ticket.

Why are they charging such high prices if they aren't going to invest it in the team?

According to the AST, the ST-rise is partly cos for the 1st time in years our wages have gone above the 50% revenue that the "fair play" regulations will mean you have to be under. But if the wage-distribution issue isnt part of the protest it's hard to raise that point. Which is why a) some serious clarification still needs to be done about what this is/isn't gonna be about (cos everything's linked) & b) I'd personally say it would be a good idea getting in touch with the AST just to get as clear a picture as possible of the lay of the land financially.

Tim Payton from the AST tweeted that if we had gone through to the quarter finals then we would have earned £8m in revenue, the price increase will earn about £5m!!!

Their line is they are concerned at the impact on supporters and would like to see more focus on commerical revenues and reducing wage bill.

[Arsenal 1991]

IU4GN

So far this is a mission statement, open to revision as we go along. I think Point 2 is what you and USMartin are concerned about.

In point 1 I have added a clause in brackets, anyone got any thoughts ???? It allows us to address tickets prices, but without treading of the toes of AISA.


1.) To encourage the club to visibly invest in quality players, (who reflect the high ticket prices paid?), to allow Arsenal to compete for the major club competition trophies domestically and in Europe.

2.) To seek clarity over the club's youth policy, with particular regard to the policy of rewarding young players with long term contracts that have increased the club's annual wage bill yet not resulted in trophies.

3.) To understand the PLC's longer term vision and strategy. As supporters we have clear goals and ambitions, measured by winning trophies. As an organisation involved in various business sectors, but whose principle activity is a football club, we believe that this should also be the clear and measured objective of the PLC.

The 2nd and third are good imo but I think the first needs revision. I think it needs to be simple and more about the fact that we are paying increasingly high prices to see the money just sitting in the bank.

[Gunnersaurus]

I agree with Mike.

2 simple questions/statements.

We pay the highest ticket prices in the world, we have a right to expect that the money will be reinvested in the team. Im sure Quartz or Steveo can put it into better words than that.

No you don't, we pay the highest ticket prices, for that we expect to see a game of football, there are no strings attached to paying for a ticket.

Why are they charging such high prices if they aren't going to invest it in the team?

Because they can, this is why I find this movement nothing more then a joke, it is driven by so called realists with their heads in the clouds and no sense of reality.

Get a grip, its embarrassing.

So we're supposed to just sit here while they increase prices, make us much worse off just to line their pockets and not say anything at all.

The only other way to make them notice would be not to go but understandably people still want to watch The Arsenal and aren't willing to give their season tickets up.

The only way they will ever listen is if the attendance drops, unfortunately your hands are tied if you still want to go, this is the nature of football, we attend, they run the club and play, that is the nature of the beast, to think you can force change is not the real world and as a realist you will know this.

You've not really thought this through have you?

There is no shame in caring, we all do but be realistic which is what you are supposed to pride yourself on, going is a choice, its optional, if that's not an option then get fucking real and take the rough with the smooth.

[Its Up 4 Grabs Now]

Tim Payton from the AST tweeted that if we had gone through to the quarter finals then we would have earned £8m in revenue, the price increase will earn about £5m!!!

Their line is they are concerned at the impact on supporters and would like to see more focus on commerical revenues and reducing wage bill.

Dont disagree with that at all, but I'm saying the club's response to ticket prices will partially be to say it's do with wages, so it's hard for that issue not to form part of the protest. And to be fair, Quartz seems to be saying it is, but others aren't.

[Its Up 4 Grabs Now]

IU4GN

So far this is a mission statement, open to revision as we go along. I think Point 2 is what you and USMartin are concerned about.

Number 3 is probably my #1 to be fair, cos everything else flows down from there.

My point was partially just asking what does the protest plan to do in the event Wenger/the club don’t listen? What is the end-game? And whatever it is, imo it has to be made clear from the start so people can choose properly whether to back it or not.

[USMartin]

IU4GN you raise some fair points...but no movement unless it is a movement of one has unanimity on any aspect of the goals it pursues...

Naturally, but at the same time you cant go completely the other way. Not to get all Mr Miyagi or anyfink but most successful revolutions will be those seeking a certain outcome, even if the path towards it isn’t so clear cut from the beginning. I’m just saying people need to be 100% clear about what it is that they, and the group as a whole, are seeking from this. Cos I’m not sure everyone’s on the same page yet.

And we will work our way through it because we all share the same main goal - what is best for Arsenal Football Club.

Of course, but as lovely as that sounds, the point is different people have different ideas about what is best for Arsenal.

THe difference in response to both comments is that we have already worked past the point of rejecting one another viewpoints ouright ahead of time as has been going on here in all directions for some time now. The fact that we now see ousrselves - based on the diverse list of people and views and personalities in this effort - as after the same thing is a huge shift in itself over a matter of moths really but in fact that occurred practically just in a week or so not even that long.

I think this effort will succeed because of its diversity. The road to that success may be fairly interesting certainly but I sincerely think we will get there, or at the very least be able to holds our heads high wherever we end up.

[Arsenal 1991]

No you don't, we pay the highest ticket prices, for that we expect to see a game of football, there are no strings attached to paying for a ticket.

Why are they charging such high prices if they aren't going to invest it in the team?

Because they can, this is why I find this movement nothing more then a joke, it is driven by so called realists with their heads in the clouds and no sense of reality.

Get a grip, its embarrassing.

So we're supposed to just sit here while they increase prices, make us much worse off just to line their pockets and not say anything at all.

The only other way to make them notice would be not to go but understandably people still want to watch The Arsenal and aren't willing to give their season tickets up.

The only way they will ever listen is if the attendance drops, unfortunately your hands are tied if you still want to go, this is the nature of football, we attend, they run the club and play, that is the nature of the beast, to think you can force change is not the real world and as a realist you will know this.

You've not really thought this through have you?

There is no shame in caring, we all do but be realistic which is what you are supposed to pride yourself on, going is a choice, its optional, if that's not an option then get fucking real and take the rough with the smooth.

You haven't thought this through! Basically what you're saying is we should just lie down and get what we're given and if we don't like it then we should fuck off!

Terrible attitude to take.

[augie]

Unless I am reading his post wrong (and I might be cos it was a long post ) IU4GN seems to be saying the same thing as I have said before........fundementally this protest can only be deemed a success if wenger ends up leaving. That may well not be the aim of the group but being honest can anybody see wenger changing his mentality even if 50,000 home fans voice their displeasure at every home game ? For me the best case scenario from this would see wenger leave as manager, either cos he throws his dummy out of the pram again as people dare to question him or that the board suddenly awaken to the dis-satisfaction amongst the fans and start to lean on wenger to shake things up. In my opinion there is only one way that wenger can turn fans like me back on his side and that is if he brings in some quality players and dispenses with the players who are simply not good enough and do not have the right attitude (dont need to name them again do I ?) and whatever about wenger buying in some quality players I think we all know that the likes of diaby and denilson are not leaving anytime soon.