As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
USMartin wrote:Can I ask all the "wenger out" what hard evidence do you have that if a new manager is brought in there will be a clear and noticable change in our spending and team-building policy ? What can you point to besides quotes from the Board about money being available to spend all the way back to 2005 really but with no actual action of anysort that backed theses claims?
My concern is simple - this won''t end with a new manager unless whatever the Board is out to do now has been accomplished already. There will be no major change and possibly no change at all in our spending otherwise no matter who is managing the team.
In which case a lot of the ciriticism levelled at the manager may in fact be very unfair and just plain untrue.
If I genuinely knew in fact the manager was the sole impediment to investing more in better players I'd reluctantly but immediately stand with the "wenger out" group but I see no real evidence that that is the case.
Anmd that is not the case not only is it terribly unfair to him but tour selves as well as we will be the ones who are let down if there is no real change.
So again does anyone have hard evidence that the manager chose to reject money to sign certain players or a certain level of quality players?
As much as I can't be arsed to get involved in this AW in/out fight for a manger with a new 4 year contract, the board don't pick the team. We had at least 2 players on the bench who could have won us that game or saved the humiliation but AW didn't pick them.
So unless you're saying he gets call during the game telling him who he can or cannot pick to start the game from PH-W, Fizsman,Kroenke and whoever else, then this arguement is for another time
USMartin wrote:Can I ask all the "wenger out" what hard evidence do you have that if a new manager is brought in there will be a clear and noticable change in our spending and team-building policy ? What can you point to besides quotes from the Board about money being available to spend all the way back to 2005 really but with no actual action of anysort that backed theses claims?
My concern is simple - this won''t end with a new manager unless whatever the Board is out to do now has been accomplished already. There will be no major change and possibly no change at all in our spending otherwise no matter who is managing the team.
In which case a lot of the ciriticism levelled at the manager may in fact be very unfair and just plain untrue.
If I genuinely knew in fact the manager was the sole impediment to investing more in better players I'd reluctantly but immediately stand with the "wenger out" group but I see no real evidence that that is the case.
Anmd that is not the case not only is it terribly unfair to him but tour selves as well as we will be the ones who are let down if there is no real change.
So again does anyone have hard evidence that the manager chose to reject money to sign certain players or a certain level of quality players?
My problem with wenger isn't spending, you only have to look at lpool to see what can hapen with financial mismanagement.
My issues are ineptitude, stubbornness and arrogance.
I'm saying again what I have said many times on this forum "we will never win another trophy under wenger."
goonersid wrote:
Do you honestly believe that? the only people who might, are the devoutest of Wengerites, the fact is we shouldn't be in this position as it has been an obvious weakness for years, It is wengers fault and his alone, and using a 20 year old scapegoat won't wash with me nor should with anyone else.
I believe anything is better than Almunia and Fabianski at the minute. I am not happy with AW not buying a keeper but calling for his head is not going to help the cause partly because he has just extended his contract
ok then I will bury my head in the sand for the next 4 years and everything will be fine. And in saying anything is better than Almunia etc, I I fear you are merely doing the same.
Mate! You can do whatever you like. Go in to hibernation if you want but AW is here to stay whether you like it or not.
I didn't understand the comment what am I 'doing the same'
I don't think he will see out the 4 year as I believe he will eventually be forced out when the fans turn on him.
As for the comment "doing the same" I meant you were doing exactly as I was suggsting I should do, "hoping all would be fine". When quite clearly it's not.
Well at the moment we can only speculate whether AW will see out his contract or not but he will not be sacked and I can't see a massive number of fans turning on him. Not just yet atleast. Depends on how the next 6 to 12 months pan out.
It's not fine. Losing to a yoyo team is unacceptable and embarrassing
USMartin wrote:Can I ask all the "wenger out" what hard evidence do you have that if a new manager is brought in there will be a clear and noticable change in our spending and team-building policy ? What can you point to besides quotes from the Board about money being available to spend all the way back to 2005 really but with no actual action of anysort that backed theses claims?
My concern is simple - this won''t end with a new manager unless whatever the Board is out to do now has been accomplished already. There will be no major change and possibly no change at all in our spending otherwise no matter who is managing the team.
In which case a lot of the ciriticism levelled at the manager may in fact be very unfair and just plain untrue.
If I genuinely knew in fact the manager was the sole impediment to investing more in better players I'd reluctantly but immediately stand with the "wenger out" group but I see no real evidence that that is the case.
Anmd that is not the case not only is it terribly unfair to him but tour selves as well as we will be the ones who are let down if there is no real change.
So again does anyone have hard evidence that the manager chose to reject money to sign certain players or a certain level of quality players?
My problem with wenger isn't spending, you only have to look at lpool to see what can hapen with financial mismanagement.
My issues are ineptitude, stubbornness and arrogance.
I'm saying again what I have said many times on this forum "we will never win another trophy under wenger."
i think your wrong SID"y..we will never win a trophy with sooty and sweep in goal
donaldo wrote:
Its been two years since both Clichy and Sagna were anything like top class.The way Sagna got done up like a kipper for the 1st goal you would have thought he was against Messi not a championship player,But the alternative is that clown Eboue that says it all
It's quite clear . At elast before you could say either we can't afford to or don't want to invest in a squad of sufficemnt quality to win the League. Now its pretty clear we don't want to invest in such a squad. And the manager is fine with that or unwilling to risk his very well-paying job to demand the support he needs obviously.
The one way to take the heat off the of everyone - the Club, the Board, The Manager, and the Team would be to at least genuinely c hallenge to win the Premiership, and on today's performance they already had given up that idea ahead of today which is inexcusable and really sad.
Probably most fans will agree with me that if we finish 3rd or 4th (and not challenge for the league) and win the fa cup and carling cup, they will be quite happy
Certainly those in the directors's box would.
I thiunk you are as gulity of underestimating the feelings of the supporters base as the Board is or Mr. Wenger was of West Brom today.
Besides what does it matter if all, most, some, or any of us happy? The Board doesn't care and are under no obigation to care as you were suggesting last night, and we have no right to expect them to or even to ask them to. So even if you were in fact right which I doubt at this point(three years ago, yes you'd be right)it would matter not a jot to the BBoard according to you and should not matter and we should be happy they allow us to pay the highest prices in English Football for the privelege of being an Arsenal supporter and shut the hell up.
That is what you think, right? I don't want to mis-speak
Look this is not about the board. Can you do a post without mentioning the word 'board' or 'directors'. I am not talking about the board here. I dont care about the board and the board does not care about me and I dont want that to change. Trust me the fans will be happy for winning cups at Wembley. I can guarantee you that
USMartin wrote:Can I ask all the "wenger out" what hard evidence do you have that if a new manager is brought in there will be a clear and noticable change in our spending and team-building policy ? What can you point to besides quotes from the Board about money being available to spend all the way back to 2005 really but with no actual action of anysort that backed theses claims?
My concern is simple - this won''t end with a new manager unless whatever the Board is out to do now has been accomplished already. There will be no major change and possibly no change at all in our spending otherwise no matter who is managing the team.
In which case a lot of the ciriticism levelled at the manager may in fact be very unfair and just plain untrue.
If I genuinely knew in fact the manager was the sole impediment to investing more in better players I'd reluctantly but immediately stand with the "wenger out" group but I see no real evidence that that is the case.
Anmd that is not the case not only is it terribly unfair to him but tour selves as well as we will be the ones who are let down if there is no real change.
So again does anyone have hard evidence that the manager chose to reject money to sign certain players or a certain level of quality players?
As much as I can't be arsed to get involved in this AW in/out fight for a manger with a new 4 year contract, the board don't pick the team. We had at least 2 players on the bench who could have won us that game or saved the humiliation but AW didn't pick them.
So unless you're saying he gets call during the game telling him who he can or cannot pick to start the game from PH-W, Fizsman,Kroenke and whoever else, then this arguement is for another time
I won't argue with you you if you don't wish to, but the team is slected by the signing of players be the players brought through the youth system or players bought from other clubs - and the odd Bosman signing -
The question is would we be looking at the same pool of players to select from for the team and the first eleven if Mr. Wenger had the same support he had prior to 2005?
The manager selects the team he sends onto the pitch, but the team he can select from is determined by how much we are willing to pay to bring a player to this club and then how much we are willing to pay to keep them.
I mean how else did we get the teams we had from 1998-2005 that the manger could select his first eleven from? My point is that no new manager will have better options to pick from so long as the Board continues to run the finances as it is, and its naive to conclude otherwise.
Feel free to respond at a time and place or thread of your choosing but do consider that in all of this. The Board isn't telling him who can choose to play but its limiting who he has the chance to choose from before that point is reached even.
Metalheadz Gooner wrote:just got in from the game. Well played WBA!
We were so poor though. Wilshere needed to start! That c**t of a keeper was only a mistake away from losing us the game.
This could be a seriously bad week! I'm keeping the faith and hoping Bolton can do something tomorrow.
mate..it doesnt really matter how Bolton do to be honest.
We have at least till january and probably the end of the season for our 2 tossers of a goalie to fuck up..We wont win a fucking thing because of those 2 wankers.
ya know,i was getting behind Almunia today because i think its the done thing.
THEN he reverts to type.
5. you can't create a mean defense with a shit goalkeeper.
6. you can't create a mean defense with a shit goalkeeper.
Were you at the game today BG? if so I commiserate with you, as I know the empty feeling when you travel for a game that should be a formality, only to be dissappointed.
A word of advice , don't let it spoil one minute of your night in what I consider to be the greatest city on the planet.
USMartin wrote:Can I ask all the "wenger out" what hard evidence do you have that if a new manager is brought in there will be a clear and noticable change in our spending and team-building policy ? What can you point to besides quotes from the Board about money being available to spend all the way back to 2005 really but with no actual action of anysort that backed theses claims?
My concern is simple - this won''t end with a new manager unless whatever the Board is out to do now has been accomplished already. There will be no major change and possibly no change at all in our spending otherwise no matter who is managing the team.
In which case a lot of the ciriticism levelled at the manager may in fact be very unfair and just plain untrue.
If I genuinely knew in fact the manager was the sole impediment to investing more in better players I'd reluctantly but immediately stand with the "wenger out" group but I see no real evidence that that is the case.
Anmd that is not the case not only is it terribly unfair to him but tour selves as well as we will be the ones who are let down if there is no real change.
So again does anyone have hard evidence that the manager chose to reject money to sign certain players or a certain level of quality players?
As much as I can't be arsed to get involved in this AW in/out fight for a manger with a new 4 year contract, the board don't pick the team. We had at least 2 players on the bench who could have won us that game or saved the humiliation but AW didn't pick them.
So unless you're saying he gets call during the game telling him who he can or cannot pick to start the game from PH-W, Fizsman,Kroenke and whoever else, then this arguement is for another time
I won't argue with you you if you don't wish to, but the team is slected by the signing of players be the players brought through the youth system or players bought from other clubs - and the odd Bosman signing -
The question is would we be looking at the same pool of players to select from for the team and the first eleven if Mr. Wenger had the same support he had prior to 2005?
The manager selects the team he sends onto the pitch, but the team he can select from is determined by how much we are willing to pay to bring a player to this club and then how much we are willing to pay to keep them.
I mean how else did we get the teams we had from 1998-2005 that the manger could select his first eleven from? My point is that no new manager will have better options to pick from so long as the Board continues to run the finances as it is, and its naive to conclude otherwise.
Feel free to respond at a time and place or thread of your choosing but do consider that in all of this. The Board isn't telling him who can choose to play but its limiting who he has the chance to choose from before that point is reached even.
It's not a case of just not wanting to do the arguement but seriously USM can you agree with me on one point we had enough players on the bench to win the game today if we'd played our strongest team yes...
mrgnu1958 wrote:
We have at least till january and probably the end of the season for our 2 tossers of a goalie to fuck up..We wont win a fucking thing because of those 2 wankers.
ya know,i was getting behind Almunia today because i think its the done thing.
THEN he reverts to type.
This is the thing - we could accept the whole dicking around all summer - no matter who is behind it if there was a way when it was clearly proven a mistake we could at least try to address the problem before January as you can't win the League now or even in January but you can lose it by then.
