END OF THE ROAD ARSENE!

[augie]

It will come as no surprise to any of you that I agree 100% with everything gus has said. However I would like to challenge some comments made in the replies plus make a few comments of my own -

There are 2 issues surrounding wenger and our decline and the 1st theory is obviously financial problems. It has been suggested that wenger has not got any money to spend and as a result is covering the boards ineptitude but I'm sorry but that doesnt quite wash with me. If you are operating on a limited budget why would you spend £15m on a winger when you have no strong commanding midfielder dominating in the middle of the park ? What is the point in having arshavin out on the wing but dependent on alex fcuking song to (a) win a fcuking tackle to get the ball & (b) be actually able to pass the ball to him ? That to me dilutes any arguement about a lack of finances cos it shows a lack of awareness of where our problems and priorities lie and that is attributed to wenger and his coaching staff not the board.

It has also been suggested that wenger would be sacked if he came out and admitted that the board havent given him any money to spend but again that doesnt wash with me. We are all supporters who are witnessing a major major slide (although some dont realise how big a slide it is ) right in front of our eyes and are getting very frustrated as a result and are directing much of that frustration at wenger and the players - dont you think that the object of that frustration would change drastically if it turned out that it was all the boards fault ? Dont you believe that 60,000 would turn up protesting at the board and supporting wenger and that the board would rightly be afraid to sack wenger for fear of starting a riot ? Even those of us that believe that wenger has lost the plot want to believe that it isnt his fault at all and would be willing to back him over this

My 2nd theory is tactical - some of you may look for financial excuses for wenger but you cannot excuse his woeful lack of judgement when it comes to some players. Prior to last night I had began to start feeling a bit more confident on our back 4 again with kolo and djouru looking like a good combination but for some unknown reason wenger yet again decides to restore gallas to the starting line up and if somebody can give me a valid reason (other than a fear of gallas demanding a move if he wasnt re-instated) then I would like to hear it Wenger has spouted bullshit about his young players for 2 or 3 years now so why isnt he playing them ? Can he honestly say that ramsey isnt better than song ? Can he honestly say that vela or wilshire wouldnt offer us more on the wings than either eboue or bedtner ? Is he really serious than any big club can harbour genuine hopes of success with an almunia as 1st choice keeper ? These are all weaknesses in wenger's judgement my friends and cannot be excused away by citing financial problems. Personally I would be much more willing to except our shortcomings if wenger was playing our vela's, ramseys and wilshires instead of our songs, eboue's and bedtners who are either nowhere near good enough or give a shit one way or another

I have zero doubt that this board has past its expiry date and needs a total overhaul. At the moment they are trading on the confusion amongst the fans who dont know whether to blame wenger or the board for our problems and that is our fault and nobody else's. We all talk about the need for clarity and honesty with the fans but how do we think we are going to get any of that from the board ? We certainly are not going to get it by discussing it amongst ourselves and imo it is way past the time where the fans need to get up off their arses and protest at the lack of investment in the playing side of the club but of course there appears to be no way that will ever happen cos we are The Arsenal and we dont behave like that

[QuartzGooner]

If you are operating on a limited budget why would you spend £15m on a winger when you have no strong commanding midfielder dominating in the middle of the park ? ? That to me dilutes any arguement about a lack of finances cos it shows a lack of awareness of where our problems and priorities lie and that is attributed to wenger and his coaching staff not the board.

QUARTZ SAYS:


IF we do sign Arshavin,

Perhaps it is because a £15M Arshavin is an "icon" signing, a big name, to excite the fans and keep the crowds from dropping off?

Perhaps because Arshavin and Theo will play wide next season and Nasri will play in central midfield, with Cesc central midfield for Barcelona?

It has also been suggested that wenger would be sacked if he came out and admitted that the board havent given him any money to spend but again that doesnt wash with me.

QUARTZ SAYS:

The board employ Wenger.

They can sack him, but he cannot sack them.

They own the club. He has to toe the line.

Dont you believe that 60,000 would turn up protesting at the board and supporting wenger and that the board would rightly be afraid to sack wenger for fear of starting a riot ?

QUARTZ SAYS:

Might actually get some atmosphere for once!

My 2nd theory is tactical - some of you may look for financial excuses for wenger but you cannot excuse his woeful lack of judgement when it comes to some players.

QUARTZ SAYS:

Agreed.

Wenger's line ups and tactics this season baffle me, particularly his substitutions.

I have zero doubt that this board has past its expiry date and needs a total overhaul.

QUARTZ SAYS:

The board is in the middle of an overhaul.

Four members have left in the last two years, and a new member has been added in the same time period (Kroenke).
Make that two if Gazidis is counted as a board member?

It may even happen that Usmanov is invited to join the board.

Make no mistake, the club is now in the hands of four men.

Wenger, Fiszmann, Kroenke and Usmanov.

Hill-Wood and Friar play bigger roles than many give them credit for, but at their age how long will they continue to be involved?

[Nice_Guy]

This is all well & good but I will say now what I have said everytime someone wants Wenger out:

Who can you HONESTLY see replacing him?

Do you think a new guy is going to come in & magically pull £50m out of the air? Will Cesc & RVP leave as a result?

Now Gazididis is in we have someone who can deal with the transfers. Wenger was doing too much for too long, we were stretched to the limit.

[gus ceasar is a legend]

Nice Guy that is a tired and weak arguement!

If Wenger was to fall over dead today are we to expect Arsenal ceasing to exist?

There were great managers before Wenger and there will be after. Who would be best to replace him is of course a matter of opinion but let us not think Arsene Wenger is irreplacable.

Arsene Wenger is not the be all and end all of Arsenal Football Club.

[Nice_Guy]

Gus, it is not a weak argument, its a valid question. Every action must cause a reaction. You cant want someone out then walk away.

If Wenger held a press conference now & announced he was resigning, which is what some of you want, who would come in?

[BT]

TeeCee - sums it all up perfectly.
Quartz - Leaders, bloody leaders. That's exactly what we haven't got on the pitch. There were no players revving the others up last night and if it wasn't for one second of brilliance we would have got what we deserved out of the game, nothing.
In my eyes only Djorou came out of the game with any credit over the 90 mins. We desperately need people in that team who will talk, shout etc.

Well done for making the trip mate and we did hear the Arsenal on the internet stream

Your exactly right about no-one revving the side up - look when we scored and the reaction of Bendtner at the back post - nothing and other players the same. The same with Song on the bench, and maybe others but I didn't see, against Hull when Nasri scored - no reaction! I'm not saying jump around and all that but surely something? When benayoun scored last night and torres was 1 yard from goal he threw his arms in the air as a natural reaction - I know these players aren't fans but surely there is some sort of reaction to a team mate scoring. All this shit from Wenger about "spirit" is bollocks. It seems that the team is split into groups, egos and self-interest with the blame being passed around and no-one taking responsibility.

Though that might point to a lack of team spirit, it might also indicate that the players know what we do; a draw isnt good enough and a last minute equaliser, or finally pulling back the lead against Hull, wasn't a major cause for celebration. Credit to Gallas, he picked up the ball after RVP scored in the vain hope of getting something else in the last minute. I'm not sure RVP and the others should have been covering themselves in glory while there was still a minute or two to play, however slim the chance.

[gus ceasar is a legend]

Gus, it is not a weak argument, its a valid question. Every action must cause a reaction. You cant want someone out then walk away.

If Wenger held a press conference now & announced he was resigning, which is what some of you want, who would come in?

Like I said that is purely down to personal opinion.

I could simply list all the decent managers out there right now if you like? Some may want Capello, others Mourinho or maybe a Van Basted Bergkamp combination.

That is not the reson though I said that your arguement is weak though. The fact is that Arsene Wenger has fialed to deliver succes over the last four years and although I would agree that each teams has transitional periods ours have been for the negative.

Wenger has got things very wrong in many areas. That should be acknowledged and acted upon.

[TeeCee]

Galasso,

Spot on about Song, I remember when the camera went to him just after we'd scored and the look on his face was like he'd just been told that Vik Akers wasn't gonna manage the Arsenal ladies anymore - he could not give a flying f***.
My contempt for that guy in particular cannot be put into words, genuinely the worst player in at least 20 years at Arsenal.

[TeeCee]

sorry, bloody PC still playing up!!

[Nice_Guy]

Galasso,

Spot on about Song, I remember when the camera went to him just after we'd scored and the look on his face was like he'd just been told that Vik Akers wasn't gonna manage the Arsenal ladies anymore - he could not give a flying f***.
My contempt for that guy in particular cannot be put into words, genuinely the worst player in at least 20 years at Arsenal.

Im big on psychology in football & to me this isnt that Song doesnt give a hoot, but to do with team morale as a whole.

I remember last year when Rosicky scored against Pompey then him, Cesc, Hleb & I think Adebayor did some stupid celebration but all the while with massive smiles. They were in it together, as mates. If we'd put a 15 year contract in front of Cesc he would have signed it, he loved it.

When we score now we just go back to the centre circle. Theres no togetherness. Its not that they dont care, they arent happy in their work place.

Weve all worked with people that we hate & you start to think "why should I do overtime to help that tw*t". Ive had a job thats poor pay but Ive loved the people & was happy to work harder because I wanted us all to succeed. Football is no different, they are together every day, eat, drink, train & travel. If your not happy, your not happy.

The side last year massively over achieved & I think people forget that. The character & togetherness shone through but that day in Birmingham tore a lot of that apart. They came so close to the league because they fought for each other. The reason Jimmy Bullard was wanted by so many clubs isnt purely down to his technical ability, its his influence on his team mates.

My overall point is that with the right characters brought in, players like Song will start to play with smiles on faces again. He is no different from anyone else at the club but clearly they are not happy as a unit.

Oh & worst player in 20 years? I can name a dozen worse.....

[Galasso]

Good points nice guy and that was what I was getting at - there is no spirit and it seems the players are either on their own or in little groups. I guess this is the same at most clubs though but the difference is that what brings these players together is respect for one and others abilities and talent and ability to produce. That's why sheringham and cole who couldnt stand each could work together on the pitch. And that's why I have had no respect for some of the colleagues I have had because they were useless at their jobs and didnt put the graft in and others who did whom I respected enormously.

For me, I couldnt care less whether song goes around looking happy or sad - as long he puts the work in - minimum. And he doesn't and he's not the only one.

The 1998, 2002 and 2004 sides were all able to look each other in the eye and say - yep, your fucking quality and you're putting the work in. Can the current lot do the same?

[Boomer]

Good points nice guy and that was what I was getting at - there is no spirit and it seems the players are either on their own or in little groups. I guess this is the same at most clubs though but the difference is that what brings these players together is respect for one and others abilities and talent and ability to produce. That's why sheringham and cole who couldnt stand each could work together on the pitch. And that's why I have had no respect for some of the colleagues I have had because they were useless at their jobs and didnt put the graft in and others who did whom I respected enormously.

For me, I couldnt care less whether song goes around looking happy or sad - as long he puts the work in - minimum. And he doesn't and he's not the only one.

The 1998, 2002 and 2004 sides were all able to look each other in the eye and say - yep, your fucking quality and you're putting the work in. Can the current lot do the same?

You've reminded me a small off track point which is we've never won on the back off a World cup or Euro Champs.

[Nice_Guy]

Good points nice guy and that was what I was getting at - there is no spirit and it seems the players are either on their own or in little groups. I guess this is the same at most clubs though but the difference is that what brings these players together is respect for one and others abilities and talent and ability to produce. That's why sheringham and cole who couldnt stand each could work together on the pitch. And that's why I have had no respect for some of the colleagues I have had because they were useless at their jobs and didnt put the graft in and others who did whom I respected enormously.

For me, I couldnt care less whether song goes around looking happy or sad - as long he puts the work in - minimum. And he doesn't and he's not the only one.

The 1998, 2002 and 2004 sides were all able to look each other in the eye and say - yep, your fucking quality and you're putting the work in. Can the current lot do the same?

No your absolutely right. I mean look at Villa. Im sorry but they are not better than us on paper but the Curtis Davies & Zat Knights & even the Luke Youngs are literally playing at the top of their games at the moment, they are us last season. Most of our squad are playing at 70% of what they can do, last season we were at 100% for months.

Cesc was visibly unhappy before his injury & its no surprise his form dipped. He had the year of his life in 07/08 culminating in a Euro win but then comes back to the petty squabbles at Arsenal. If there is 1 player or 1 group causing disruption then they need to be sold, dont care who it is.

This is why I get annoyed when people say Wenger has lost the plot. He is trying to keep a team of youngsters to maintain their belief. He could go the other way & do an Arry but what good as that done Spurs? Confidence is HUGE in football, you cant buy it. Its why Mourinho was so successful, he galvanised Chelsea. Granted everyone else hated them but now you look back, they were league champions twice & thats what counts. Everyone hated us under Vieira n co. but we were succesful.

Phil Brown said he kept Dean Windass at the club because he was good for morale & let Marlon King go because he was trouble.

[Gooner Jim]

MAYBE arsene isnt as good as he was before BUT who would we get in? He is the best person to get us out of a shitty situation IF our problems are financial rather than his at times questionable philosophy. All Im saying is which avaliable manager could keep arsenals status as one of the top teams in europe?????????

[piresistible]

Right i think you need to cheer up now!!!

we don’t have Benitez as manager. Remember this man is rated as a really tip top manager in Europe. He demands total control over the spending of the club (just like twenger and he picks the players, and talks to the press (just like most managers except Sir Alex F-Word).

But if you heard a recording of his commentary about yesterday’s game you’d have noticed the ravings of a mind completely out of control (and on this topic I speak as one who knows). “Crazy gamesâ€