WALCOTT - which position is best etc?

[hugh jardon]

I know that I have never worked half a day in football nor been a pro player but I have watched and played enough football over the years to know what is acceptable from a pro player and 3 shots and 2 crosses per game (or whatever ridiculous bullshit statement he said in that interview) is totally unacceptable to me

I would suggest that 3 shots and 2 crosses per game is a totally acceptable target for a professional footballer playing up front for a top club. If you disagree with the quote what do you suggest should be his match target and on which other players do you base that on?

[hugh jardon]

I know that I have never worked half a day in football nor been a pro player but I have watched and played enough football over the years to know what is acceptable from a pro player and 3 shots and 2 crosses per game (or whatever ridiculous bullshit statement he said in that interview) is totally unacceptable to me

I would suggest that 3 shots and 2 crosses per game is a totally acceptable target for a professional footballer playing up front for a top club. If you disagree with the quote what do you suggest should be his match target and on which other players do you base that on?

You lot are a journalist's dream - lapping up any old half-baked lazy headline or quote they put to print...

[hugh jardon]

Double post

[armchair]

Never heard theo get boo'ed. Lots of grumbles and "fcuk sakes" but absolutely never heard any booing.
Heard Wenger get boo'd though.

[QuartzGooner]

Heard boos at the Newcastle game this season, was sitting North East corner.

Heard boos last season, West Stand, near Red Action.

As far as the Shots and Crosses quote, I agree with "Huge".

For domestic games, three decent crosses is ok.
Add in a couple of cutbacks from the bye line, and a couple of runs into the box, and a couple of shots, and it is what one can expect from most players apart from the central striker who would be expected to have more shots.

[SteveO 35]

Heard boos at the Newcastle game this season, was sitting North East corner.

Heard boos last season, West Stand, near Red Action.

As far as the Shots and Crosses quote, I agree with "Huge".

For domestic games, three decent crosses is ok.
Add in a couple of cutbacks from the bye line, and a couple of runs into the box, and a couple of shots, and it is what one can expect from most players apart from the central striker who would be expected to have more shots.

Was at the Newcastle game and it was a very positive atmosphere throughout and Walcott did well in that game and the fans were fully behind him. You must have been very unlucky where you were sitting because I heard none of it

Which games last season? If you mean in the last few weeks when we were desperate e.g. Villa, Blackburn, Sunderland then he could have been one of several on the end of some stick

If you compare performances over the past few years with fan reaction, he has been the luckiest of all the players in the sqaud

[QuartzGooner]

He certainly gets the Feo Feo chants, not questioning that.

But last season and this season has had the boos and the groaning creeping in.
Plus lots of online and pundit criticism.

He may well get support where others do not, but seems to get over the top criticism too.

Newcastle game he had that good run early on, then got a lot of criticism where I was sitting.

[SteveO 35]

He certainly gets the Feo Feo chants, not questioning that.

But last season and this season has had the boos and the groaning creeping in.
Plus lots of online and pundit criticism.

He may well get support where others do not, but seems to get over the top criticism too.

Newcastle game he had that good run early on, then got a lot of criticism where I was sitting.

So basically he's getting a few moans and groans and some stick from the media after 5 years of being at the club.

Are you saying that there is a problem with that ??

Bloody hell Quartz, people are more on Gervinho's case after six months ! And Arshavin despite having been around for less time and almost single-handedly getting us to the top four in his first year has been booed and jeered much more readily than Walcott.

I would remind people that some of these young men are earning salaries that shame FTSE 100 Chief Executives and certainly more than MPs that get a media slaughtering day in, day out. He takes the money and if after 5 years people are eventually starting to run out of patience, then a few moans and groans should be something he laughs off. We are talking about a guy who will probably sign a new deal to earn himself £4m-£5m per year and who by the middle of next season will have been at the club for 7 years.

He joined in the same transfer window as Abou Diaby - but clearly one is brainless, thick, a Tottenham shirt wearing c++t etc etc, blah blah blah, who should be burned at the stake, whilst the other can not even have a few minor groans aimed his way after underperfoming for the same length of time

Incredible logic

[the moog]

I know that I have never worked half a day in football nor been a pro player but I have watched and played enough football over the years to know what is acceptable from a pro player and 3 shots and 2 crosses per game (or whatever ridiculous bullshit statement he said in that interview) is totally unacceptable to me

I would suggest that 3 shots and 2 crosses per game is a totally acceptable target for a professional footballer playing up front for a top club. If you disagree with the quote what do you suggest should be his match target and on which other players do you base that on?

please say you're kidding. really, 3 shots and two crosses from a forward on that kind of money. shocking

[hugh jardon]

I know that I have never worked half a day in football nor been a pro player but I have watched and played enough football over the years to know what is acceptable from a pro player and 3 shots and 2 crosses per game (or whatever ridiculous bullshit statement he said in that interview) is totally unacceptable to me

I would suggest that 3 shots and 2 crosses per game is a totally acceptable target for a professional footballer playing up front for a top club. If you disagree with the quote what do you suggest should be his match target and on which other players do you base that on?

please say you're kidding. really, 3 shots and two crosses from a forward on that kind of money. shocking

If it's shocking tell me how many shots and crosses he should be making per game and how you have come to that figure?

[QuartzGooner]

So basically he's getting a few moans and groans and some stick from the media after 5 years of being at the club.

Are you saying that there is a problem with that ??

Bloody hell Quartz, people are more on Gervinho's case after six months ! And Arshavin despite having been around for less time and almost single-handedly getting us to the top four in his first year has been booed and jeered much more readily than Walcott.

I would remind people that some of these young men are earning salaries that shame FTSE 100 Chief Executives and certainly more than MPs that get a media slaughtering day in, day out. He takes the money and if after 5 years people are eventually starting to run out of patience, then a few moans and groans should be something he laughs off. We are talking about a guy who will probably sign a new deal to earn himself £4m-£5m per year and who by the middle of next season will have been at the club for 7 years.

He joined in the same transfer window as Abou Diaby - but clearly one is brainless, thick, a Tottenham shirt wearing c++t etc etc, blah blah blah, who should be burned at the stake, whilst the other can not even have a few minor groans aimed his way after underperfoming for the same length of time

Incredible logic

The criticism directed at Walcott is well out of proportion to the games where he does not perform well.

He always runs hard, occasionally fails to track back, but is that laziness, or more of a failure to pick up an opponent's run?

I say it is the latter.
When he does catch the opposing left winger he is not afraid to tackle and does win the ball more than might be expected of an attacking player.

Henry would only run a limited amount of full pace sprints per game of more than 25 metres, perhaps four or five. There are only so many times a player can run full speed because of recovery times.
Other times he would cruise just below top speed in the way a 400 metre runner does on the back straight.

The salaries are irrelevant, have already said that many Arsenal senior squad players earn more in a week than nurses do in a year but it is not the players' fault that happens.

[SteveO 35]

Quartz, none of the points in your last post address anything in mine (except for the money issue which I did not say was his fault but was merely pointing out that if you want a £5m salary and a life in the spotlight then you can expect to be criticised if you don't perform)

I was addressing your points about unfair criticism. You can only cite one game where there were a few moans and groans - I completely agree that is not in proportion to his level of performance in over six years i.e. he has been damn fucking lucky that people have been so patient

I'm not sure what on earth you are on about with all this hard running and tracking back argument. Gervinho tracks back a lot and runs hard, but he's had more than a few moans and groans after less than one season. Aaron Ramsey runs hard and tracks back. Denilson ran hard and tracked back.

Theo Walcott considers himself to be a striker first and foremost and I'm afraid his record over six years has not been anywhere near good enough. His finishing is still awful at times, especially when he has time to think about it. The miss at home to QPR was a very good example of why he will never be a centre forward

[nexum5me]

Ok what talent is that exactly ? I mean I know he is fast but what else is top level standard ? I think if you said he is a victim of his own lack of talent then we might be closer to the truth.

presumably you agree with every point i made you didn't respond to

right, i haven't got the patience to hack up a quote so i'll just address this one, by "talent" i mean using his best attribute (yes, his pace) along with his instinct for making runs timed well enough to get into dangerous positions. now you can't deny this, because if he didn't get into dangerous positions regulary, then no one would ever have made statements like "no footballing" brain based on him taking the wrong option in dangerous positions, because you have to be there in the first place!

IHH: surely you realise i was exaggerating and over emphasising how well he'd have to do for people to change their minds about him?! if he literally did what i said then barca would just buy him for £40m and it'd all be moot anyway. i mainly based that statement on having read many match threads, when walcott will score or get an assist or whatever and still get generally slated throughout the game, whereas rvp can do fuck all, all game, score a goal and everyone sucks him off regardless. now don't get me wrong i'd far rather have rvp in the team than walcott, but you get my drift (if i remember rightly walcott was getting abuse in the wolves thread despite winning the pen and scoring the 2nd, i can't be bothered to go and check though so feel free to prove me wrong if i am)

i don't even know how i've come to be arguing the case "for" walcott anyway, i'm not a massive fan of his as such, just think he's a decent, useful player who, giving our record of replacing players who leave (or rather, of not replacing them) i'd rather have him than not. and it's nothing to do with ox chambo, i've already said i'd rather have him AND walcott start, with gerv on the bench.

[QuartzGooner]

SteveO

I mention the tracking back and running because criticism of Walcott on here and in the seats involves not just goalscoring and creative matters, but he is also perceived as lazy and soft.

But I just do not agree with that criticism.

Gervinho works hard and Ramsey works hard agree, but I felt Denilson did not run enough and far too often failed to track back and pick up his man.

As for Walcott's goalscoring, it has to be considered that he is played in attacking midfield, only very rarely as a striker. Double figures from wide midfield is respectable.

Only RvP has scored more this season.

Walcott does appear better when he shoots on instinct rather than when he think about the chance, but off the top of my head what of his run in the Blackburn game where he ran into the box and retained possession to release it to Oxlade-Chamberlain who then scored.

Shows growing ball skills and decision making from Walcott this season, as do regular assists for Van Persie to score, more than have been made by any other of our players.

[the moog]

please say you're kidding. really, 3 shots and two crosses from a forward on that kind of money. shocking

If it's shocking tell me how many shots and crosses he should be making per game and how you have come to that figure?[/quote]

i do not have a figure but for a player to state the figures quoted is a disgrace. 2 crosses FFS he plays out wide. i could go on. the bloke is as thick as they come and has not got a clue.