THE WENGER THREAD

[armchair]

i agree.

clough had it. lost it.

dalglish had it. lost it.

venables had it. lost it. (he managed Barca FFS)

Robson had it. lost it (the England Manager, not that drunken plank).

George Knew. Then he didn't.


football moves on, the game evolves and coaches get left behind.

I do understand it - you need a big ego to be a successful leader, and that ego gives you the confidence to make decisions and follow your judgement. which is great when you're right, but can be a bad thing when you're wrong.

ego for football managers, futures traders and poker players has to be tempered with outside influences - Wenger, like Nick Leeson (who brought down Barings Bank) refuses to believe he's wrong, as Leeson did. so Leeson doubled up his position. and again and again, fully convinced he was right and the singapore market was wrong.

eventually he broke the bank with a eight billion pounds loss from a 20 million pound original loss.

because no one could convince him he was wrong - sound familiar ?

its the same ego that convinces poker players that their 'system' works....

Now, I hate to admit it but there is a reason that Harvard Business School pays Fergie a very large sum of money to lecture there each Summer - he is a very very good manager. not just a football manager - as others have said, he realises the need to freshen up the coaching staff, to change out the medical team, to change his tactics (like dropping rooney for the more mobile RvP last night).

as drunk and red faced obnoxious git that he is, he clearly recognises his own limitations, and the need for teamwork in management.

The Wise Woman doesn't.

neither did, clough, venables, dalglish or George etc.

So its not the board, or the stadium, or City or Chelsea - if it was why are we only 2 points ahead of Everton after 28 games ?

Nice post mate.

[Steve_I]

Armchair, a few examples from literally hundreds if you search just the term AKB - this in response to your comment (I beleive used out of context)

"that "such as me" get abused without any evidence of said "abuse "

the akb remind me of the cow in this picture been fucked by the club http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/8330/dairyfail.jpg

8908. AKB's (from tony pulis etc etc thread)

But as I'd say to any AKB muppet

F*CK ME AKB on 5Live saying Wenger has no money to spend! Even the show host is getting pissed off with him! Yep. Listening to it. Yeah some dull twat called alan..Unbelievable.... ... (of course it might be that Alan is a dull twat and this example I am using unfairly)

Fuck the AKB's

any AKB's who seriously think that Wenker is still the man then take a long hard look at this result and ask yourself HOW MANY MORE SEASONS WILL YOU IDIOTS BE HAPPY TO PUT UP WITH THIS SHIT

the saddest thing of all though is that there are still so many AKB'S,it makes it almost impossible to get the point across,brain washed fuckin idiots,

Ok Armchair I'm perhaps being facetious but you surely must have seen such posts and you have just effectively accused me of not backing up a point I made which I now have. I do not feel I have any misguided loyalty but understand how you might feel that I do.

[Wengerball]

I think at the end of the day we'll have to agree to disagree. I am a fully signed up member of the Arsene Out Brigade but even though I completely disagree with some of the puzzling arguments in the Pro-Wenger camp they have just as much right to have their say, even if it makes no sense to the rest of us. Most of the fans want the best for the club but have radically different ideas about what is best for the club. We're not all going to agree and I think we all accept that. The term AKB was born out of sheer frustration at those who are perceived to see the sun shining out of Wengers arse. For what its worth I think in reality there is a spectrum and each person has their tipping point.

All of us were AKB at one point or another but the team has polarised opinions so much in recent years that I think it would be unfair to say someone was a moron or a sheep.

On the flip side however is folk in the Pro-Wenger movement who are cultists and have come to blows at games with fans who have a different opinion. These JCL wankers can take a flying fuck to themselves.

[Steve_I]

I think at the end of the day we'll have to agree to disagree. I am a fully signed up member of the Arsene Out Brigade but even though I completely disagree with some of the puzzling arguments in the Pro-Wenger camp they have just as much right to have their say, even if it makes no sense to the rest of us. Most of the fans want the best for the club but have radically different ideas about what is best for the club. We're not all going to agree and I think we all accept that. The term AKB was born out of sheer frustration at those who are perceived to see the sun shining out of Wengers arse. For what its worth I think in reality there is a spectrum and each person has their tipping point.

All of us were AKB at one point or another but the team has polarised opinions so much in recent years that I think it would be unfair to say someone was a moron or a sheep.

On the flip side however is folk in the Pro-Wenger movement who are cultists and have come to blows at games with fans who have a different opinion. These JCL wankers can take a flying fuck to themselves.

Nice post. See both sides can agree.

[armchair]

But Steve you said you're not an AKB

Anyway all your examples were non specific and not directed to anyone on this forum and just internet ranting. Hardly "abuse" and surely not a valid reason to avoid substantiating your position.

Dont get me wrong, and I think you know that I may disagree with your opinion (whatever that is I still havent worked out 100%) but I'll fight to the death for your right to hold it.

[Steve_I]

But Steve you said you're not an AKB

Anyway all your examples were non specific and not directed to anyone on this forum and just internet ranting. Hardly "abuse" and surely not a valid reason to avoid substantiating your position.

Dont get me wrong, and I think you know that I may disagree with your opinion (whatever that is I still havent worked out 100%) but I'll fight to the death for your right to hold it.

Quite rightly too imo!

[clockender1]

Steve, If I may chime in a little too - i was an AKB too last year. then after the bad finish last year i was cautious about this year....

i have turned because the wallet and patience has had enough and i'm done with him. and no i don't think i'm short sighted.

and yes, i used that argument against others in 2011 and 2012, which makes me a hypocrite but not wrong.

everyone has a tether to which there is an end - and after nearly 400 games over 35 years i have reached mine.

and i'm tired of the excuses - it is now almost seven years since we moved into the bowl. seven years.

that is almost longer than Georges entire reign at the club.

[augie]

Our manager seems to be concerned about morale in the squad being seriously affected after recent defeats

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football ... e-too-hard

Where is that mental strength you continue to talk about you senile old c**t ?

[DB10GOONER]

Steve, If I may chime in a little too - i was an AKB too last year. then after the bad finish last year i was cautious about this year....

i have turned because the wallet and patience has had enough and i'm done with him. and no i don't think i'm short sighted.

and yes, i used that argument against others in 2011 and 2012, which makes me a hypocrite but not wrong.

everyone has a tether to which there is an end - and after nearly 400 games over 35 years i have reached mine.

and i'm tired of the excuses - it is now almost seven years since we moved into the bowl. seven years.

that is almost longer than Georges entire reign at the club.

Not hypocritical at all, mate. As you say we all have a tether to which there is an end. People become disillusioned, or stop believing, at different times. Some are more patient then others, some believe for longer, some just don't see the reality until later, some are Wenger Cultists - there are many reasons. Every single one of us was an AKB and proud of it at some stage. If you look at the threads on here in 2006 and early 2007 it's mostly pro-Wenger stuff. Anyone on here that says they were actively wanting Wenger out before August 2006 is either a liar or an idiot.

For me, I think I started to become really disillusioned when his failure to strengthen properly (in very obviously needed areas) in summer 2007 and again in January 2008 cost us the league that year. But I was still prepared to give him until May 2010 to see if he could turn it around. He failed miserably and I've wanted him gone since.

I still love and respect him for what he did for this club between 1997 and 2006 though.

[Clash]

Our manager seems to be concerned about morale in the squad being seriously affected after recent defeats

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football ... e-too-hard

Where is that mental strength you continue to talk about you senile old c**t ?

I thought Wenger was disgraceful after the Blackburn game. He basically said the only thing he was responsible for was the team selection and that there was nothing wrong with the team he selected. In other words, he was telling us that it wasnt his fault. This coward will protect himself even if it means contradicting what he's been saying for years - which is exactly what he did by citing mental issues as the reason we lost.

I would love to hear a journalist say to him '' Arsene, you have told us this is your best squad ever, you remind us that they are all internationals, that their mental strength is exceptional and you say that they are all desperate to do well ... yet they reguarly fail to perform ... have you ever considered that the problem is you? ''

[Den10kamp]

I would love to hear a journalist say to him '' Arsene, you have told us this is your best squad ever, you remind us that they are all internationals, that their mental strength is exceptional and you say that they are all desperate to do well ... yet they reguarly fail to perform ... have you ever considered that the problem is you? ''

if any journo's are reading this apart from his loyal servant 'John Cross', then on behalf of the fans ... please put this to him exactly as it says....

we never get to question him as such

[Goonerkev]

Steve, If I may chime in a little too - i was an AKB too last year. then after the bad finish last year i was cautious about this year....

i have turned because the wallet and patience has had enough and i'm done with him. and no i don't think i'm short sighted.

and yes, i used that argument against others in 2011 and 2012, which makes me a hypocrite but not wrong.

everyone has a tether to which there is an end - and after nearly 400 games over 35 years i have reached mine.

and i'm tired of the excuses - it is now almost seven years since we moved into the bowl. seven years.

that is almost longer than Georges entire reign at the club.

Not hypocritical at all, mate. As you say we all have a tether to which there is an end. People become disillusioned, or stop believing, at different times. Some are more patient then others, some believe for longer, some just don't see the reality until later, some are Wenger Cultists - there are many reasons. Every single one of us was an AKB and proud of it at some stage. If you look at the threads on here in 2006 and early 2007 it's mostly pro-Wenger stuff. Anyone on here that says they were actively wanting Wenger out before August 2006 is either a liar or an idiot.

For me, I think I started to become really disillusioned when his failure to strengthen properly (in very obviously needed areas) in summer 2007 and again in January 2008 cost us the league that year. But I was still prepared to give him until May 2010 to see if he could turn it around. He failed miserably and I've wanted him gone since.

I still love and respect him for what he did for this club between 1997 and 2006 though.

I am with 100% with you, I gave my ST up after 2 seasons at the Cameldome when you could see the never ending 3 year squad rebuilding programme of Wengers was going nowhere & its got worse since and he still happily receives £7mill+ a season from OUR club. For what When Wenger goes, you will not see any empty seats for games

[highburyJD]

When Wenger goes, you will not see any empty seats for games

hope you're right but how many seats we sell will ultimately be results and entertainment driven

[augie]

When Wenger goes, you will not see any empty seats for games

hope you're right but how many seats we sell will ultimately be results and entertainment driven

I agree re the results point but I'm not so sure about the entertainment aspect - most "football fans" would value commitment and passion for the shirt as being a higher priority than stylish football. I know that as a club we have picked up more than our share of "style over substance" fans over recent years but maybe shedding them from our support wouldnt be the worst thing in the world

[TeeCee]

Agreed, I was quite critical of some of the football under Graham in the latter years of his reign but when people said 'boring Arsenal' you just smiled and thought....yup.....once we're ahead we won't lose and 1-0 to the Arsenal! The majority of fans don't care too much about the football being played, it's beating your rivals and winning trophies because at the end of the day, you can play crap and still win 1-0. Under Wenger, we are gradually seeing poorer football with NO end product.......and still some people defend him!!?? Mind boggling.