The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

[Gunner Rob]

Actually Rob I made my mind up many years before the referendum . I realised what we were getting into around Ted Heath's betrayal of our country. Nice yacht though.

of course you did.
I imagine this is the case for many ageing Brexiteers as well.

a pity you forget that we are now in 2019 and not 1969, which is when you lot would prefer to go back to.
the modern world has changed and is changing significantly.

the globalised world means everything is linked more, the single market being just one example. this has benefited the UK greatly, only you just can't or refuse to see it.

look at the EU/Japanese trade deal struck last week - the largest free trade deal ever.
over time this will mean that all Japanese firms will leave the UK. Why would they stay ? we are no use to them outside of the EU and the single market. as for striking trade deals with them on our own, again why would they, when they can strike a trade deal with a much bigger trade area - the EU ?

[A11M11]

Not surprisingly given the speech was in 2011, Brexit was not even mentioned.


Why would it be ? As you say the speech was given long before Brexit was voted on . But it shows the direction that the EU is heading and what we are dealing with as in September 2016, Verhofstadt was named the European Parliament's representative on matters relating to Brexit.

[nut flush gooner]

Not surprisingly given the speech was in 2011, Brexit was not even mentioned.


Why would it be ? As you say the speech was given long before Brexit was voted on . But it shows the direction that the EU is heading and what we are dealing with as in September 2016, Verhofstadt was named the European Parliament's representative on matters relating to Brexit.

Did you even watch the full speech? One things for sure you certainly didn’t before I put it into the context it should be seen.

This thread is getting embarassing now, if its not Herds conspiracy theories its the complete lack of substance and fact in your debate, you are archetypical of what brexit is all about in the heartlands of this country, nothing short of ignorant. Ive honestly not come across anyone who has presented such a poor debate as you A11M11. When your caught with your trousers down as is the case here, you just try and squirm out of it.

[A11M11]

"The nations of Europe should be guided towards the superstate without their people knowing what is happening. This can be accomplished by successive steps each disguised as having an economic purpose, but which eventually and irreversibly lead to federation."
- Jean Monnet. one of the founding fathers of the European Union.

Lies and deceit since the 1930's and continued by Heath , Wilson , Callaghan , Blair , Thatcher , Major and now May.and that's only our lot;
Over the water the whole of the E.U areas of Brussels and Strasbourg is littered with them . Self serving non elected mandarins hell bent on producing a United States of Europe .
The aim of the European project has always been to create a political union, it was never simply about economic cooperation, over the last 40 years it is completely clear that political union is the real aim of the bloc .
However Europe is fast becoming rather disturbing place as Anti-EU feeling is rising in Italy, France, the Czech Republic and other states are showing signs of discontent with the bloc. Anti-EU parties have either won serious power, or are very popular with the public in Italy and France. Everywhere in Europe there is a growing tide of anger and sense of disenfranchisement being directed at the unelected bureaucrats of Brussels. The electorates of Europe have woken up to the real aims of EU and they don’t like it. The heavy handed treatment of the Catalan's was greeted in Brussels with silence and now Gilet Jaune are on the receiving end of similar treatment to keep the plebs down.
People are seeing through this deception . Brexit has made them think and they are not liking what they see .
We should I say you need to look beyond your pockets and find out what you are sleepwalking into . It is not and will not be all sweetness and light by 2025.

[A11M11]

A few facts for you.
Renault own 44% of Nissan, which is a majority controlling stake.
Emmanuel Macron, the ex-Rothschild banker and French leader changed the law in France recently, so as to enable the French Government, who own 15% of Renault shares achieve a majority 30% vote for their shareholding when deciding on the Company's policies and direction.
So, the EU & Globalists run Macron. Macron runs the French Government. The French Government have majority say and effectively run Renault. Renault have majority say on Nissan.
Even the Guardian in 2015 warned of the risks that this ownership structure posed to British jobs in Sunderland.
Welcome to Globalism, the darling of those who love the EU and why the whole lot stinks to high heaven as they manipulate public opinion from behind the scenes for their own benefit .

[Gunner Rob]

A few facts for you.
Renault own 44% of Nissan, which is a majority controlling stake.
Emmanuel Macron, the ex-Rothschild banker and French leader changed the law in France recently, so as to enable the French Government, who own 15% of Renault shares achieve a majority 30% vote for their shareholding when deciding on the Company's policies and direction.
So, the EU & Globalists run Macron. Macron runs the French Government. The French Government have majority say and effectively run Renault. Renault have majority say on Nissan.
Even the Guardian in 2015 warned of the risks that this ownership structure posed to British jobs in Sunderland.
Welcome to Globalism, the darling of those who love the EU and why the whole lot stinks to high heaven as they manipulate public opinion from behind the scenes for their own benefit .

Rubbish.

the fact is this car would have been made in Sunderland - the factory and the workers are there for it.
the main reason it is not is down to the uncertainty over Brexit and the new EU/Japan trade deal which will allow the car to be made in Japan.

the ONLY reason Japanese firms are in the UK is because we are in the single market, it really is as simple as that.

[Gunner Rob]

"The nations of Europe should be guided towards the superstate without their people knowing what is happening. This can be accomplished by successive steps each disguised as having an economic purpose, but which eventually and irreversibly lead to federation."
- Jean Monnet. one of the founding fathers of the European Union.

Lies and deceit since the 1930's and continued by Heath , Wilson , Callaghan , Blair , Thatcher , Major and now May.and that's only our lot;
Over the water the whole of the E.U areas of Brussels and Strasbourg is littered with them . Self serving non elected mandarins hell bent on producing a United States of Europe .
The aim of the European project has always been to create a political union, it was never simply about economic cooperation, over the last 40 years it is completely clear that political union is the real aim of the bloc .
However Europe is fast becoming rather disturbing place as Anti-EU feeling is rising in Italy, France, the Czech Republic and other states are showing signs of discontent with the bloc. Anti-EU parties have either won serious power, or are very popular with the public in Italy and France. Everywhere in Europe there is a growing tide of anger and sense of disenfranchisement being directed at the unelected bureaucrats of Brussels. The electorates of Europe have woken up to the real aims of EU and they don’t like it. The heavy handed treatment of the Catalan's was greeted in Brussels with silence and now Gilet Jaune are on the receiving end of similar treatment to keep the plebs down.
People are seeing through this deception . Brexit has made them think and they are not liking what they see .
We should I say you need to look beyond your pockets and find out what you are sleepwalking into . It is not and will not be all sweetness and light by 2025.

oh dear wrong again.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-e ... SKCN1IO2SP

I think you could possibly have been correct back in 2016, but these days the other EU countries have seen sense and realised that they are better in the EU than out of it.

[A11M11]

The Eurobarometer survey commissioned by the European Parliament Kind of says it all !

""Britain, which will make good in March on a 2016 referendum vote to leave the EU, was the next least convinced of the benefits of membership. But 53 percent still thought it had been a benefit, outnumbering those thinking that it has been disadvantageous by nearly two to one. ""
53% = 2 to 1 so what does that make 52 to 48 ??

I Wonder who they asked ?

My cynicism holds no bounds.

[nut flush gooner]

A few facts for you.
Renault own 44% of Nissan, which is a majority controlling stake.
Emmanuel Macron, the ex-Rothschild banker and French leader changed the law in France recently, so as to enable the French Government, who own 15% of Renault shares achieve a majority 30% vote for their shareholding when deciding on the Company's policies and direction.
So, the EU & Globalists run Macron. Macron runs the French Government. The French Government have majority say and effectively run Renault. Renault have majority say on Nissan.
Even the Guardian in 2015 warned of the risks that this ownership structure posed to British jobs in Sunderland.
Welcome to Globalism, the darling of those who love the EU and why the whole lot stinks to high heaven as they manipulate public opinion from behind the scenes for their own benefit .

More paraphrasing, its starting to become an obsession with you isnt it, pull some crap off a website cut and paste.

If the French control Nissan, can you explain why the Chairman of Renault is currently in a Japanese prison facing at least ten years behind bars for irregularities in reporting of his personal income. No sign of Macron to the rescue here ehhh?

You probably don’t even know about this case.

[A11M11]

They have never been friends and Nissan have been trying for a long time to gain control back from Renault but as we know the french like to control .

Any way we are back to the old cut and paste jibe . if you don't read differing views how do you get a balanced opinion.?

I accept that not everything about the E.U is bad just the political union and federalism bit . A trading agreemet makes perfect sense. But that's it.

Don't get me wrong I am not happy about the way we run ourselves but allowing someone else to do it for us is not the answer.

[A11M11]

Anyway try reading this series of three articles from the Spectator ( a centre right publication. ) and ask yourself that even if there is a modicum of truth in their conclusions , Why would we sign up to it ?

Unless of course there is an ulterior motive.

[Gunner Rob]

Anyway try reading this series of three articles from the Spectator ( a centre right publication. ) and ask yourself that even if there is a modicum of truth in their conclusions , Why would we sign up to it ?

Unless of course there is an ulterior motive.

I prefer to stick to facts.
By the way please do tell me one thing that you are looking forward to doing in April that you are unable to do now.

[Jock Gooner]

Anyway try reading this series of three articles from the Spectator ( a centre right publication. ) and ask yourself that even if there is a modicum of truth in their conclusions , Why would we sign up to it ?

Unless of course there is an ulterior motive.

I prefer to stick to facts.
By the way please do tell me one thing that you are looking forward to doing in April that you are unable to do now.

Tell you that we are no longer in the EU

[A11M11]

Land the fish on my mates boat without chucking most of them back.

[nut flush gooner]

They have never been friends and Nissan have been trying for a long time to gain control back from Renault but as we know the french like to control .

Any way we are back to the old cut and paste jibe . if you don't read differing views how do you get a balanced opinion.?

I accept that not everything about the E.U is bad just the political union and federalism bit . A trading agreemet makes perfect sense. But that's it.

Don't get me wrong I am not happy about the way we run ourselves but allowing someone else to do it for us is not the answer.

This isn't a traditional car conglomerate though is it, more like an alliance of manufacturers with the French Government holding a large stake in Renault which in turn holds a large stake in Nissan. This isn't about European control, it's as much about Nationalised industry with Government interference versus private enterprise.

A lot of Labour supporters want the utilities and railways re-nationalised in this country, that causes exactly the same conflict of interest that you see with Nissan/Renault. This is nothing to do with the EU, it's as much the socialist principles of one country against the capitalistic principle of another. That's the way I see it, you see the French going on strike all the time over workers rights. When do you ever see this happening in Japan. You just single out Macron, because he is at the heart of the EU.

In terms of UK industry and farming which is deeply relevant to the brexit debate, there are supply chains that ultimately have an impact on how those parts of this economy works. If we start trading with other countries, then we leave ourselves exposed to their less than acceptable standards, chlorinated chicken from the US perhaps for starters.

“I’ve been wondering what that special place in hell looks like, for those who promoted Brexit, without even a sketch of a plan how to carry it out safely.” That's the comment from the president of the European Council Donald Tusk. The Europeans are really up for bowing down to our demands aren't they.

His comments are harsh but fair really, cutting but the truth. Messrs Rees Mogg, Johnson and even Farage continually trying to drive the car from the back seat, but none of them coming out with a concrete solution that is acceptable to all parties. The car crash is about to happen if someone doesn't get their finger out quick.