The Gooner Forum

safcftm wrote:

DB10GOONER wrote:

safcftm wrote:

Irish Gooner wrote:
Bla bla bla

You could say the same for Unionists in NI. Why dont they "go home" etc?

Fact is there homes are where they are now, Glasgow or NI or otherwise.

You must have missed the good friday agreement whereby the people of Northern Ireland have the right to call themselves either Irish or British, hence they can be unionists and still call NI home. Supporting a terrorist organisation is, however, a crime, and isnt allowed in Britain. So actually you're wrong, you couldnt say the same for unionists in NI. And I didnt tell them to go "home" anyway, I merely said they shouldnt attend matches in Britain if they dont want to see British soldiers in British football grounds- we'll ban Celtic fans before we ban our own soldiers

Er... excuse me - I'm no Celtic lover (hate the club) but that is incorrect. Have you not heard of the UVF and the UDA? The Shankill Butchers?
Would agree though that the British people have the right to parade their own soldiers wherever in Britain they like. Accepted, it is silly and inflamatory to do it in front of beered up Cletic fans, but that does not change the fact that it is their right to do so.

This whole old firm argument pops up on here every few months and to be honest it's just the same old rhetoric and uninformed generalisations being posted each time.

The fact is both sets of fans have their fair share of cuntbag brainless sectarian scum, just as both sets of fans include decent non-bigotted people too.

What part is incorrect? It is an offence under British law to support a terrorist organisation

From: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2000/11

Support. A person commits an offence if—
(a)he invites support for a proscribed organisation, and
(b)the support is not, or is not restricted to, the provision of money or other property (within the meaning of section 15).

It goes on to state:

3 Proscription.(1)For the purposes of this Act an organisation is proscribed if—
(a)it is listed in Schedule 2, or
(b)it operates under the same name as an organisation listed in that Schedule.

And then schedule 2 gives a list of the "proscribed organisations", and guess which one is the very top of the list? Yep, you guessed it "The Irish Republican Army."

I would say that chanting about them is inviting support, which is an offence.

Ok, now take a deep breath and turn your patronising-reply dial down a tad.

To answer your question;

You wrote; "Supporting a terrorist organisation is, however, a crime, and isnt allowed in Britain. So actually you're wrong, you couldnt say the same for unionists in NI"

You are implying that unionists do not support terrorist organisations. That is incorrect. Many (not all, obviously, but many) unionists do and have supported terrorist organisations; the UVF, the UDA and Shankill Butchers are/were terrorist organisations.

I'm hoping you were being a tad disingenuous (“deviousâ€

[quote="DB10GOONER"]
Ok, now take a deep breath and turn your patronising-reply dial down a tad.

To answer your question;

You wrote; "Supporting a terrorist organisation is, however, a crime, and isnt allowed in Britain. So actually you're wrong, you couldnt say the same for unionists in NI"

You are implying that unionists do not support terrorist organisations. That is incorrect. Many (not all, obviously, but many) unionists do and have supported terrorist organisations; the UVF, the UDA and Shankill Butchers are/were terrorist organisations.

I'm hoping you were being a tad disingenuous (“deviousâ€

[quote="safcftm"][quote="DB10GOONER"]
Ok, now take a deep breath and turn your patronising-reply dial down a tad.

To answer your question;

You wrote; "Supporting a terrorist organisation is, however, a crime, and isnt allowed in Britain. So actually you're wrong, you couldnt say the same for unionists in NI"

You are implying that unionists do not support terrorist organisations. That is incorrect. Many (not all, obviously, but many) unionists do and have supported terrorist organisations; the UVF, the UDA and Shankill Butchers are/were terrorist organisations.

I'm hoping you were being a tad disingenuous (“deviousâ€

DB10GOONER wrote: Very well put, mate.

I always allude to my grandfather in relation to this issue. He was "Old" IRA (the organisation that fought for independence) and he despised the newer IRA of the 70's and 80's that bombed England and killed so many innocent people. He preached actively against the modern IRA to anyone that would listen. He felt that modern Republicanism and Unionism were both built too much around hatred and exclusion, rather than respect and tolerance.

He always told us that he didn't hate the British. Didn't even hate the British soldiers he fought against, as he viewed them as much like him; poor working class kids that mostly joined the army to provide a future for themselves and their families and in the majority of cases did not want to be in Ireland fighting other poor working class kids. He said he hated the governments and the politicians that couldn't work out a peaceful resolution. But even his hatred for them was tempered as he felt to spend his life hating would be a waste of a life.

And he was spot on. People are entitled to their beliefs, but they're not entitled to force their beliefs on others through violence or the threat of violence (or they shouldnt be). The only way to resolve the conflict is through peaceful negotiation. For me, there should be referendums held every 5 or 10 years in NI, and when/ if a majority of the population want to join the rest of Ireland, they should be allowed to. When that happens, those who consider themselves British should have assurances that they wont be persecuted/ discriminated against because of it, and our government should give them the option to move back to the mainland if they would prefer (obviously this would take a lot of organising as you couldnt have them coming back to no job, no house etc, but they are British and so if they want, they shouldnt be forced to live in what would become a completely "foreign" land, we would need to find a way to look after them)

For me, this is the only sensible way to proceed. None of this going around killing and intimidating, both countries are advanced, we're in the 21st century, and we should be capable of coming to a sensible, workable, peaceful resolution that takes into account the wishes of the majority and that doesn't leave any minority group vulnerable. I would hope that sensible politics would play a greater role in the future, rather than fanatic religion.

[quote="DB10GOONER"]

I'm hoping you were being a tad disingenuous (“deviousâ€

[quote="LDB"][quote="DB10GOONER"]

I'm hoping you were being a tad disingenuous (“deviousâ€