Mikel Arteta, success or failure? - Merged thread.

[goonersid]

I said after the run of 3 defeats, that no subsequent results would change my opinion on Arteta and despite beating utd and the chavs, last nite showed that view to be 100% correct.
That will be confirmed in the next 2 games, even if we did beat the barcodes (we won't)
then I still wouldn't trust him to get a result against Everton.
The only thing that will get us top 4 now, is sperz doing something sperzy in their last 2 games.
That I think is doubtful with Conte in charge, I didn't think there was any way he could turn them around, but he has and that shows what a quality, experienced manager can do.
Matters not one Jot we're stuck with Arteta for the foreseeable future!

[Gunner Rob]

For the contract extension to be signed now confirms everything that I feared - that the ambition of the club is not to get into the top 4 and meaningfully compete even higher. No it is merely to compete for a top 4 place and if we miss out on it then so what, it is not as if there will be any investment in the team should we get there.

It is why I can no longer go to the Emirates because whilst Kroenke owns this club there is ZERO ambition to get any better.
That’s the brutal reality of where we are at.

Can you not see how him signing now if anything provides a psychological fillip to the team with every game now being a cup final for us?

And with regards to ambition, Kroenke has allowed net spending to the tune of £330m over the last five years. You can criticise him all you like, but as billionaires go he has the dosh and is starting to open the clip.

Giving Arteta a new contract provides stability, if he fucks up there always is PV4 in the wings as long as he doesn't go to City.

BTW I see football as social occasions, as much as going to the games these days. Fancy saying to your mates, I don't fancy a beer with you because I am boycotting the club. Unless you are a Norman no mates of course .

I didn't think this would age well

[DB10GOONER]

Brilliant article. I think all those that slag him day in day out should have a long hard read of this.

Of course, some people are too proud to change their stance.

There is nothing in that article that would change my mind at the moment.

So he's a nice guy, he works hard , he's a genuine person, he likes trees. That's great mate. But that's not the problem. The problem is he is a novice. He is too inexperienced and too intransigent in his ego to be Arsenal manager. That's the only problem I have with him.

Also I struggle to see anyone "slag him day in day out". What i do see is some people rightly concerned at his inexperience, his often poor in-game management, and his persistent playing of the liability, Clive.

For me he still has a lot to do before I would rate him as a good manager. I like him as a person, I liked him as a player, but he should never have been given the Arsenal job at this stage in his career. If he suddenly becomes a top manager then I have no problem admitting I was wrong about him but can you honestly see him suddenly becoming a top manager?

He should be learning his trade at a smaller club.

Or become a gardener

[nut flush gooner]

For the contract extension to be signed now confirms everything that I feared - that the ambition of the club is not to get into the top 4 and meaningfully compete even higher. No it is merely to compete for a top 4 place and if we miss out on it then so what, it is not as if there will be any investment in the team should we get there.

It is why I can no longer go to the Emirates because whilst Kroenke owns this club there is ZERO ambition to get any better.
That’s the brutal reality of where we are at.

Can you not see how him signing now if anything provides a psychological fillip to the team with every game now being a cup final for us?

And with regards to ambition, Kroenke has allowed net spending to the tune of £330m over the last five years. You can criticise him all you like, but as billionaires go he has the dosh and is starting to open the clip.

Giving Arteta a new contract provides stability, if he fucks up there always is PV4 in the wings as long as he doesn't go to City.

BTW I see football as social occasions, as much as going to the games these days. Fancy saying to your mates, I don't fancy a beer with you because I am boycotting the club. Unless you are a Norman no mates of course .

I didn't think this would age well

I'm glad you find it funny Rob. I don't. My point about you not going to games is though .

[BFG4]

I've heard constantly that we are in the middle of a project under Arteta, even the twats on Sky referenced it last night that we are supposedly a year ahead of where we should be in the project. Ask anyone what the project involves and they won't have an answer, maybe the plan is to strip away the squad to nothing so that any miniscule achievement like EL football will be celebrated like a league title to some. There is also this presumption that we will be challenging for top 4 again next season, I'd be shocked if we do. Should those pricks finish ahead of us then with Conte having money to spend will improve them and I can see United throwing as much money as it takes to get them in the top 4. Even if we do get CL football this season, is anyone trusting our novice manager to make the right signings. Looking at the striker situation, we are set to only have Balogun on the books when the season ends. Arteta is still clinging onto hope that Nketiah will sign a new deal, that in itself is mind boggling.

[Retro Gunner]

Disastrous and embarrassing last night, but who among us can be genuinely surprised? I thought we'd get beaten, but was hoping we'd put up more of a fight than that piss poor show. Too many sub standard and/or weak minded players and worst of all, a rookie manager that should never have been appointed, let alone have had his contract extended. It tells you all you need to know about the ambitions of the owners.

What we're seeing this season could be any season since about 2006, when it started to fall apart under Wenger. The same limp-wristed, inconsistent and gutless approach, both on and off the pitch and worst of all, a total lack of accountability. We have a squad that's short of the quality required to compete at the top level, but with enough quality for a decent manager to be able to mould an effective unit that performs more consistently well than this lot are doing under Arteta. We are no further on than the last few years under Wenger and under Emery's short reign. Nothing will change under Captain Black, he's totally out of his depth and its a sign of where we are as a club that we are happy for a novice to cut his managerial teeth with us. Shameful. I wanted us to pick up Conte when he was available earlier in the season and obviously before spurs signed him. He's a quality manager, proven at the highest level and its clear that he has moulded that lot into a much better unit than he inherited after only 6 months. Our clown has got nowhere after 2 1/2 years.

I said from day one, that any manager that thinks Xhaka is the answer to anything, is not fit to be in the job and it was all I needed to know about how good Arteta would turn out to be. Similarly, he's made Odegaard his golden boy and benched ESR, who in my opinion is a better player and happened to be our top scorer when he was dropped...work that one out. I'm underwhelmed by Odegaard, who is a clone of the midfielders we had during Wenger's last 10 years...neat, tidy, technically good and impressive against lesser teams, but missing some vital ingredients and disappearing when the going gets tough against the big boys.

Too many seem to think that Arteta's "process" is working and that given some useful additions in the summer, we'll compete for bigger prizes. Well, this is already very much his team and the club has spent a lot of money in recent years building it, but haven't moved forward at all. In my opinion, there's far more chance of us losing ESR, Martinelli, Saka and Gabriel than seeing this squad develop. We've still got Xhaka and Elneny in centre mid, with a bang average (at best) Partey injured and yet we've let Torreira and Guendouzi slip away, seemingly because Arteta has favourites and those two weren't in his good books. That's weak, Wenger style management right there.

We won't get 4th. Can't see us winning our final two games, but the scum will. Arteta was in poll position and blew it and there's no excuses. Frankly, as others have said, I don't really give a damn about getting in the CL, as it would be a total embarrassment, but the scum are in a financial mess and are deperate to keep hold of Kane, Son and Conte, so CL qualification is vital for them. Looks like Arteta and his team of lightweights have just laid the path for them. Fucking disgrace.

Rant over...for now.

[Rian1]

Agree with Retro's comments. Issue is, they don't think Xhaka is the answer but who would you have in that midfield; Mo has been okay but shown his weakness yesterday. Lokonga isn't ready for top 4 PL football and we only have Xhaka who is semi-decent. Partey is injured 30 Game Weeks out of a possible 38. One that reminds me of a certain player we had in our ranks that would be constantly injured.

Odegaard is fine but IMO ESR should've started the Derby. He played brilliant at home and scored. I am trying to like Martin but it just pisses me off that he needs at least 4 touches on the ball before releasing it. Has no urgency and over-reliant on his left foot when the n10 is to be played at high pace, constantly scanning the field of play and quick release the ball into areas. Every single time I see him, nonchalant play, 5 touches on the ball and it ends up then being a sideway pass to the winger when 5 men are behind the ball already. Very poor shooting from outside the box as well, slipped twice and scuffed the ball twice yesterday. Hit the fucking target at least.

Should've lost that game 1-0 but we were outplayed from 28' until Son went off so there is nowhere to look but inside our tactics.

[arrgee]

Agree with Retro's comments. Issue is, they don't think Xhaka is the answer but who would you have in that midfield; Mo has been okay but shown his weakness yesterday. Lokonga isn't ready for top 4 PL football and we only have Xhaka who is semi-decent. Partey is injured 30 Game Weeks out of a possible 38. One that reminds me of a certain player we had in our ranks that would be constantly injured.

Odegaard is fine but IMO ESR should've started the Derby. He played brilliant at home and scored. I am trying to like Martin but it just pisses me off that he needs at least 4 touches on the ball before releasing it. Has no urgency and over-reliant on his left foot when the n10 is to be played at high pace, constantly scanning the field of play and quick release the ball into areas. Every single time I see him, nonchalant play, 5 touches on the ball and it ends up then being a sideway pass to the winger when 5 men are behind the ball already. Very poor shooting from outside the box as well, slipped twice and scuffed the ball twice yesterday. Hit the fucking target at least.

Should've lost that game 1-0 but we were outplayed from 28' until Son went off so there is nowhere to look but inside our tactics.

As it stands Xhakash!t has a free pass as none of the other midfielders that have had opportunities in the last couple of years have staked their claim. However Captain Black should have signed a replacement for Xhakash!t rather than convincing him to stay.

Smith Rowe should start every game. Along with Saka and Martinelli. The three of them provide a goal threat that others don’t. The system needs to accommodate the best players, cos we don’t have enough to leave our top scorer (excluding penalties) on the bench. If Odegaard plays it is at the expense of Xhakash!t. I would even be tempted to try the false nine and not play Nketiah or Lacazette to accommodate Smith Rowe.

I think the penalty was soft, likewise Holding’s second yellow and whilst I understand why they were given, I doubt they would have if they were against Spurs. Up until the Holding sending off I thought Arsenal had the better of things and could have got back into the game. However once the second goal went it, Captain Black rightly decided to not chase a lost cause.

[goonersid]

Disastrous and embarrassing last night, but who among us can be genuinely surprised? I thought we'd get beaten, but was hoping we'd put up more of a fight than that piss poor show. Too many sub standard and/or weak minded players and worst of all, a rookie manager that should never have been appointed, let alone have had his contract extended. It tells you all you need to know about the ambitions of the owners.

What we're seeing this season could be any season since about 2006, when it started to fall apart under Wenger. The same limp-wristed, inconsistent and gutless approach, both on and off the pitch and worst of all, a total lack of accountability. We have a squad that's short of the quality required to compete at the top level, but with enough quality for a decent manager to be able to mould an effective unit that performs more consistently well than this lot are doing under Arteta. We are no further on than the last few years under Wenger and under Emery's short reign. Nothing will change under Captain Black, he's totally out of his depth and its a sign of where we are as a club that we are happy for a novice to cut his managerial teeth with us. Shameful. I wanted us to pick up Conte when he was available earlier in the season and obviously before spurs signed him. He's a quality manager, proven at the highest level and its clear that he has moulded that lot into a much better unit than he inherited after only 6 months. Our clown has got nowhere after 2 1/2 years.

I said from day one, that any manager that thinks Xhaka is the answer to anything, is not fit to be in the job and it was all I needed to know about how good Arteta would turn out to be. Similarly, he's made Odegaard his golden boy and benched ESR, who in my opinion is a better player and happened to be our top scorer when he was dropped...work that one out. I'm underwhelmed by Odegaard, who is a clone of the midfielders we had during Wenger's last 10 years...neat, tidy, technically good and impressive against lesser teams, but missing some vital ingredients and disappearing when the going gets tough against the big boys.

Too many seem to think that Arteta's "process" is working and that given some useful additions in the summer, we'll compete for bigger prizes. Well, this is already very much his team and the club has spent a lot of money in recent years building it, but haven't moved forward at all. In my opinion, there's far more chance of us losing ESR, Martinelli, Saka and Gabriel than seeing this squad develop. We've still got Xhaka and Elneny in centre mid, with a bang average (at best) Partey injured and yet we've let Torreira and Guendouzi slip away, seemingly because Arteta has favourites and those two weren't in his good books. That's weak, Wenger style management right there.

We won't get 4th. Can't see us winning our final two games, but the scum will. Arteta was in poll position and blew it and there's no excuses. Frankly, as others have said, I don't really give a damn about getting in the CL, as it would be a total embarrassment, but the scum are in a financial mess and are deperate to keep hold of Kane, Son and Conte, so CL qualification is vital for them. Looks like Arteta and his team of lightweights have just laid the path for them. Fucking disgrace.

Rant over...for now.

Agree with most of that, but FFS, why are people still going on about Torreira and Guendopey!
For the last time Guendopey was a spoilt brat and one of the most ineffectual players I have ever seen, he was fucking useless!
Torreira had a handful of good games when he first came into the team! Then after six months he wanted out and told anybody that would listen, also his performances on the pitch were anonymous!
So neither were allowed to slip away!

[OneBardGooner]

Agree with Retro's comments. Issue is, they don't think Xhaka is the answer but who would you have in that midfield; Mo has been okay but shown his weakness yesterday. Lokonga isn't ready for top 4 PL football and we only have Xhaka who is semi-decent. Partey is injured 30 Game Weeks out of a possible 38. One that reminds me of a certain player we had in our ranks that would be constantly injured.

Odegaard is fine but IMO ESR should've started the Derby. He played brilliant at home and scored. I am trying to like Martin but it just pisses me off that he needs at least 4 touches on the ball before releasing it. Has no urgency and over-reliant on his left foot when the n10 is to be played at high pace, constantly scanning the field of play and quick release the ball into areas. Every single time I see him, nonchalant play, 5 touches on the ball and it ends up then being a sideway pass to the winger when 5 men are behind the ball already. Very poor shooting from outside the box as well, slipped twice and scuffed the ball twice yesterday. Hit the fucking target at least.

Should've lost that game 1-0 but we were outplayed from 28' until Son went off so there is nowhere to look but inside our tactics.

As it stands Xhakash!t has a free pass as none of the other midfielders that have had opportunities in the last couple of years have staked their claim. However Captain Black should have signed a replacement for Xhakash!t rather than convincing him to stay.

Smith Rowe should start every game. Along with Saka and Martinelli. The three of them provide a goal threat that others don’t. The system needs to accommodate the best players, cos we don’t have enough to leave our top scorer (excluding penalties) on the bench. If Odegaard plays it is at the expense of Xhakash!t. I would even be tempted to try the false nine and not play Nketiah or Lacazette to accommodate Smith Rowe.

I think the penalty was soft, likewise Holding’s second yellow and whilst I understand why they were given, I doubt they would have if they were against Spurs. Up until the Holding sending off I thought Arsenal had the better of things and could have got back into the game. However once the second goal went it, Captain Black rightly decided to not chase a lost cause.

^^^ This 1,000% ^^^

It demonstrated and continues to show a Glaring Ineptitude on unfathomable levels of naivety and Utter Incompetence - So FUCK-OFF FARTETA!

[Retro Gunner]

Disastrous and embarrassing last night, but who among us can be genuinely surprised? I thought we'd get beaten, but was hoping we'd put up more of a fight than that piss poor show. Too many sub standard and/or weak minded players and worst of all, a rookie manager that should never have been appointed, let alone have had his contract extended. It tells you all you need to know about the ambitions of the owners.

What we're seeing this season could be any season since about 2006, when it started to fall apart under Wenger. The same limp-wristed, inconsistent and gutless approach, both on and off the pitch and worst of all, a total lack of accountability. We have a squad that's short of the quality required to compete at the top level, but with enough quality for a decent manager to be able to mould an effective unit that performs more consistently well than this lot are doing under Arteta. We are no further on than the last few years under Wenger and under Emery's short reign. Nothing will change under Captain Black, he's totally out of his depth and its a sign of where we are as a club that we are happy for a novice to cut his managerial teeth with us. Shameful. I wanted us to pick up Conte when he was available earlier in the season and obviously before spurs signed him. He's a quality manager, proven at the highest level and its clear that he has moulded that lot into a much better unit than he inherited after only 6 months. Our clown has got nowhere after 2 1/2 years.

I said from day one, that any manager that thinks Xhaka is the answer to anything, is not fit to be in the job and it was all I needed to know about how good Arteta would turn out to be. Similarly, he's made Odegaard his golden boy and benched ESR, who in my opinion is a better player and happened to be our top scorer when he was dropped...work that one out. I'm underwhelmed by Odegaard, who is a clone of the midfielders we had during Wenger's last 10 years...neat, tidy, technically good and impressive against lesser teams, but missing some vital ingredients and disappearing when the going gets tough against the big boys.

Too many seem to think that Arteta's "process" is working and that given some useful additions in the summer, we'll compete for bigger prizes. Well, this is already very much his team and the club has spent a lot of money in recent years building it, but haven't moved forward at all. In my opinion, there's far more chance of us losing ESR, Martinelli, Saka and Gabriel than seeing this squad develop. We've still got Xhaka and Elneny in centre mid, with a bang average (at best) Partey injured and yet we've let Torreira and Guendouzi slip away, seemingly because Arteta has favourites and those two weren't in his good books. That's weak, Wenger style management right there.

We won't get 4th. Can't see us winning our final two games, but the scum will. Arteta was in poll position and blew it and there's no excuses. Frankly, as others have said, I don't really give a damn about getting in the CL, as it would be a total embarrassment, but the scum are in a financial mess and are deperate to keep hold of Kane, Son and Conte, so CL qualification is vital for them. Looks like Arteta and his team of lightweights have just laid the path for them. Fucking disgrace.

Rant over...for now.

Agree with most of that, but FFS, why are people still going on about Torreira and Guendopey!
For the last time Guendopey was a spoilt brat and one of the most ineffectual players I have ever seen, he was fucking useless!
Torreira had a handful of good games when he first came into the team! Then after six months he wanted out and told anybody that would listen, also his performances on the pitch were anonymous!
So neither were allowed to slip away!

Well Sid, I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree about how good or bad Guendouzi was and what went wrong with Torreira. No one is suggesting that they were the new Vieira or Fabregas, but you'll probably find that I and others go on about them, because we're having to watch Xhaka (especially), Partey and Elneny week in week out. Xhaka is enough to make someone go on about Ian Selley and David Hillier!!

[DB10GOONER]

Disastrous and embarrassing last night, but who among us can be genuinely surprised? I thought we'd get beaten, but was hoping we'd put up more of a fight than that piss poor show. Too many sub standard and/or weak minded players and worst of all, a rookie manager that should never have been appointed, let alone have had his contract extended. It tells you all you need to know about the ambitions of the owners.

What we're seeing this season could be any season since about 2006, when it started to fall apart under Wenger. The same limp-wristed, inconsistent and gutless approach, both on and off the pitch and worst of all, a total lack of accountability. We have a squad that's short of the quality required to compete at the top level, but with enough quality for a decent manager to be able to mould an effective unit that performs more consistently well than this lot are doing under Arteta. We are no further on than the last few years under Wenger and under Emery's short reign. Nothing will change under Captain Black, he's totally out of his depth and its a sign of where we are as a club that we are happy for a novice to cut his managerial teeth with us. Shameful. I wanted us to pick up Conte when he was available earlier in the season and obviously before spurs signed him. He's a quality manager, proven at the highest level and its clear that he has moulded that lot into a much better unit than he inherited after only 6 months. Our clown has got nowhere after 2 1/2 years.

I said from day one, that any manager that thinks Xhaka is the answer to anything, is not fit to be in the job and it was all I needed to know about how good Arteta would turn out to be. Similarly, he's made Odegaard his golden boy and benched ESR, who in my opinion is a better player and happened to be our top scorer when he was dropped...work that one out. I'm underwhelmed by Odegaard, who is a clone of the midfielders we had during Wenger's last 10 years...neat, tidy, technically good and impressive against lesser teams, but missing some vital ingredients and disappearing when the going gets tough against the big boys.

Too many seem to think that Arteta's "process" is working and that given some useful additions in the summer, we'll compete for bigger prizes. Well, this is already very much his team and the club has spent a lot of money in recent years building it, but haven't moved forward at all. In my opinion, there's far more chance of us losing ESR, Martinelli, Saka and Gabriel than seeing this squad develop. We've still got Xhaka and Elneny in centre mid, with a bang average (at best) Partey injured and yet we've let Torreira and Guendouzi slip away, seemingly because Arteta has favourites and those two weren't in his good books. That's weak, Wenger style management right there.

We won't get 4th. Can't see us winning our final two games, but the scum will. Arteta was in poll position and blew it and there's no excuses. Frankly, as others have said, I don't really give a damn about getting in the CL, as it would be a total embarrassment, but the scum are in a financial mess and are deperate to keep hold of Kane, Son and Conte, so CL qualification is vital for them. Looks like Arteta and his team of lightweights have just laid the path for them. Fucking disgrace.

Rant over...for now.

Agree with most of that, but FFS, why are people still going on about Torreira and Guendopey!
For the last time Guendopey was a spoilt brat and one of the most ineffectual players I have ever seen, he was fucking useless!
Torreira had a handful of good games when he first came into the team! Then after six months he wanted out and told anybody that would listen, also his performances on the pitch were anonymous!
So neither were allowed to slip away!

Well Sid, I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree about how good or bad Guendouzi was and what went wrong with Torreira. No one is suggesting that they were the new Vieira or Fabregas, but you'll probably find that I and others go on about them, because we're having to watch Xhaka (especially), Partey and Elneny week in week out. Xhaka is enough to make someone go on about Ian Selley and David Hillier!!

Exactly. I'd have both Guendouzi and Torreira on their worst day ahead of walking lobotomy Clive on his best day.

I still fully expect us to get within a cûnt hair of 4th and Clive to do a Clive and lose it for us through an unnecessary act of complete stupidity. He is that fucking thick and that much of a liability.

His latest thing is to disappear in games. He's like the fucking Invisible Man out there. So that's his two speeds. Utter shit or Invisible and hiding like the coward he is.

[SteveO 35]

Yeah it really does feel like time for Clive Fucktard to have one of his amazing brain fart moments. Our "senior pro" was at it against the vermin, having snidey little digs and shoves here and there when we were down to 10.

He's a truly embarrassing c.unt but sadly as long as Carpet Head sticks around, we are lumbered with the gormless tool

I too can see the c.unt either getting sent off tomorrow or giving away a goal or penalty.

[mcdowell42]

◎ 36 games
◉ 14 clean sheets

William Saliba has been named Ligue 1 Young player of the year.

#TrophéesUNFP https://t.co/um52UKNRSG

[SteveO 35]

◎ 36 games
◉ 14 clean sheets

William Saliba has been named Ligue 1 Young player of the year.

#TrophéesUNFP https://t.co/um52UKNRSG

Not good enough for Carpet Head though mate!