As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
I Hate Hleb wrote:When you want to bold or change the size of some text just make sure you highlight the words you need to alter and not the symbols that begin before or come after them.
Right! Like this!?
Wow! It'slikeIhaveopenedmyeyesforthefirst time. The possibilities are endless . . .
alanalansunderland wrote:Just to clarify a point seemingly made about the AST and putting the blame on Gazidis.
This is not AST's view, it is the view of one particular member who e-mailed the trust recently. The AST has no policy of requesting a vote of no confidence in Gazidis.
Within the trust there are varying views which i think were summed up in the end of season survey. For instance when asked whether Arsene has taken the club as far as he can if we do not win a trophy this season, 42% said yes, but 40% said no!
The comment about the share price is wrong as well. it clearly states with the prospectus for the sharesave that it should not really be seen as a vehicle to make profit on. The commitment is to hold the shares long term and build a credible supporter representation within the club.
With 2000 members and £1,000,000 invested within the year I think the trust is progressing well. Just think what we could do if we got 10,000 people contributing?
The minimum you can put in is a tenner a month, that equates to 30p a day. I think most if not all can afford 30p a day.
Problem is that there are no shares out there for the Fan Share scheme to buy, as the AST admitted themselves, because Kroenke and Usmanov have snapped them all up. Given that this is unlikely to change for a while, or if it does, it will probably only be via one of the major shareholders selling out to the other, how will 'Fan Share' ever get into a position where they can truly have an influence on the club?
Having put so much time and effort into the scheme the board of the AST will not let it fade away without a struggle.
AST are currently negotiating with the club over the way forward for the scheme. This could involve a 'placement' of shares for the AST to purchase over time.
The other way would be for the major two shareholders to sell shares to the scheme. Usmanov has said he is willing to do this as long as Kroenke matches him share for share. Therefore their positions although slightly diluted in percentage terms will be diluted at the same rate. The AST will be talking with Mr Kroenke on this point over the coming weeks.
alanalansunderland wrote:Just to clarify a point seemingly made about the AST and putting the blame on Gazidis.
This is not AST's view, it is the view of one particular member who e-mailed the trust recently. The AST has no policy of requesting a vote of no confidence in Gazidis.
Within the trust there are varying views which i think were summed up in the end of season survey. For instance when asked whether Arsene has taken the club as far as he can if we do not win a trophy this season, 42% said yes, but 40% said no!
The comment about the share price is wrong as well. it clearly states with the prospectus for the sharesave that it should not really be seen as a vehicle to make profit on. The commitment is to hold the shares long term and build a credible supporter representation within the club.
With 2000 members and £1,000,000 invested within the year I think the trust is progressing well. Just think what we could do if we got 10,000 people contributing?
The minimum you can put in is a tenner a month, that equates to 30p a day. I think most if not all can afford 30p a day.
Problem is that there are no shares out there for the Fan Share scheme to buy, as the AST admitted themselves, because Kroenke and Usmanov have snapped them all up. Given that this is unlikely to change for a while, or if it does, it will probably only be via one of the major shareholders selling out to the other, how will 'Fan Share' ever get into a position where they can truly have an influence on the club?
Having put so much time and effort into the scheme the board of the AST will not let it fade away without a struggle.
AST are currently negotiating with the club over the way forward for the scheme. This could involve a 'placement' of shares for the AST to purchase over time.
The other way would be for the major two shareholders to sell shares to the scheme. Usmanov has said he is willing to do this as long as Kroenke matches him share for share. Therefore their positions although slightly diluted in percentage terms will be diluted at the same rate. The AST will be talking with Mr Kroenke on this point over the coming weeks.
Keep up the good work!
Although I am a little confused as I am currently paying £2 per month and above you mention that the minimum is £10 per month
alanalansunderland wrote:Just to clarify a point seemingly made about the AST and putting the blame on Gazidis.
This is not AST's view, it is the view of one particular member who e-mailed the trust recently. The AST has no policy of requesting a vote of no confidence in Gazidis.
Within the trust there are varying views which i think were summed up in the end of season survey. For instance when asked whether Arsene has taken the club as far as he can if we do not win a trophy this season, 42% said yes, but 40% said no!
The comment about the share price is wrong as well. it clearly states with the prospectus for the sharesave that it should not really be seen as a vehicle to make profit on. The commitment is to hold the shares long term and build a credible supporter representation within the club.
With 2000 members and £1,000,000 invested within the year I think the trust is progressing well. Just think what we could do if we got 10,000 people contributing?
The minimum you can put in is a tenner a month, that equates to 30p a day. I think most if not all can afford 30p a day.
Good post. With that in mind while I am certain there is not unamimity on this I'm sure or any specific issue, does the Trust as a group endorse Tim Payton's comments written the Independent Article of two weeks back linked below
Well I wish them good luck with that alanalansunderland, sincerely I do. However I'm sure a lot of people are holding back from possibly investing because the desired outcome looks ultimately unachievable while these two billionaires hold most if not all of the cards. And things don't look like changing much soon, even if they do allocate a few more shares to the AST.
Last edited by I Hate Hleb on Tue Sep 13, 2011 1:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I Hate Hleb wrote:Well I wish them good luck with that alanalansunderland, sincerely I do. However I'm sure a lot of people are holding back from possibly investing because the desired outcome looks ultimately unachievable while these two billionaires hold most if not all of the cards. And things don't look like changing much soon, even if they do allocate a few more shares to the AST.
Then we are just well and truly fucked, eh? If we don't do something whether its to join an effort like this or to form some sort of protest movement what will change then?
I understand where you are coming from but doing nothing is doing nothing. It's like choosing not to vote or wasting your vote on an extremist or protest candidate you know cannot win then complaining the guy who is elected doesn't care what you think? What do you expect? I mean if you won't vote what right have you to complain about how government governs society?
Same thing here. If we choose not to do anything because well we decide we can't do anything then how can we complain about anything? And what does just complainign to ourselves and each other achieve. If we could just use the fact that there is large number of us to simply try and organize somehow to pursue making the positive changes we canm or may able to make at least we've tried and maybe even succeeded when it's said and done. We'll never know for sure unless we try.
We will know for sure if we don't that much is certain.
The point I would like to expand is is the one that hlebby questioned how much influence AST can have if there are no shares available to purchase thus ensuring that their share will always be small..........how much influence does usmanov have despite his large shareholding ? If we are realistic the board and kroenke are happy to go along with the charade of allowing the fans input into how our club is run but the reality is that in any serious issue their opinions will be dismissed in much the same way redaction are (although again it is questionable whether redaction can see that either ).
These fan groups cannot see the irony in their situations.......the only hope fans have of having any real effect is if they unite together and holding a really strong protest (with thousands in attendance not hundreds) but these people are afraid to go down that road for fear of losing that negligible influence that they have In the meantime they meet with club officials, gain small victories, air their concerns to the club who in turn promise to consider these issue's whilst continuing the policy of under investment and asset striping plus increasing ticket prices into the bargain.......you can certainly see the benefit of these meetings cant you ?
As I have said before, I do not intend my criticisms to appear personal against anybody in these groups (especially alanalan who always posts on here and answers our criticism's and concerns ) but the reality is most concerning for me and reminds of of a scene from braveheart where mel gibson tells robert bruce that he has a real chance to be a leader of his country if he would only step up to the mark........these people have a real opportunity to be a real voice of the fans if they could only stand up to the board and show them that they will no longer be pawned off - do that and you may well earn the respect and support of fans like me who have zero faith in your projects
Alansunderland good work on the AST stuff and keep up the good work.
I'll admit that Tim Payton winds me the fuck up. He never goes far enough in my opinion and is too guarded in his criticism. He seems to direct his ire at Gazidis a bit too often. Still...
augie wrote:The point I would like to expand is is the one that hlebby questioned how much influence AST can have if there are no shares available to purchase thus ensuring that their share will always be small..........how much influence does usmanov have despite his large shareholding ? If we are realistic the board and kroenke are happy to go along with the charade of allowing the fans input into how our club is run but the reality is that in any serious issue their opinions will be dismissed in much the same way redaction are (although again it is questionable whether redaction can see that either ).
These fan groups cannot see the irony in their situations.......the only hope fans have of having any real effect is if they unite together and holding a really strong protest (with thousands in attendance not hundreds) but these people are afraid to go down that road for fear of losing that negligible influence that they have In the meantime they meet with club officials, gain small victories, air their concerns to the club who in turn promise to consider these issue's whilst continuing the policy of under investment and asset striping plus increasing ticket prices into the bargain.......you can certainly see the benefit of these meetings cant you ?
As I have said before, I do not intend my criticisms to appear personal against anybody in these groups (especially alanalan who always posts on here and answers our criticism's and concerns ) but the reality is most concerning for me and reminds of of a scene from braveheart where mel gibson tells robert bruce that he has a real chance to be a leader of his country if he would only step up to the mark........these people have a real opportunity to be a real voice of the fans if they could only stand up to the board and show them that they will no longer be pawned off - do that and you may well earn the respect and support of fans like me who have zero faith in your projects
I logged on to read a thread about peoples' views on the AST (of which I'm a life member) but what do I have to wade through ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Several obsessive and semi-literate rants by USMartin.
And getting back to the original thread - even though I'm a life member of the AST, I despise the Arsenal Board of Directors. I'm a Managing Director of a Limited Company and if I ran mine like they run Arsenal, I'd be bankrupt because I'd have no customers left.
The only reason they get away with it is because too many people love Arsenal so much that it hurts even to think about protesting against the Club. But until enough of us do that - nothing's gonna change!! Sadly, we need to protest people . . . . . . .
You mods really know your shit don't you! Good to see we're in safe hands!
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