It's all a load of Cannonballs in here! This is the virtual Arsenal pub where you can chat about anything except football. Be warned though, like any pub, the content may not always be suitable for everyone.
A11M11 wrote:Brexit supporters may well have to take to the streets especially if the remains get to overturn the decision. I doubt that there is enough support for leaving in parliament and all attempts are being made to prevaricate and delay until they can water it down. You are right the country is split but I still believe that leaving in the long run will be the best route to take .After all out of the 170 or so countries we could trade with only 27 are in the EU.
We will leave the EU no doubts. But they won't offer us any sort of trade deal unless we submit to free movement of people. Kind of defeats the objective of the referendum to be honest. And it will take years to come to any sort of agreement.
We should get on and sort a trade deal with the yanks ASAP, but we are not in a position of power because they would want to use the UK to passport into Europe, and that isn't possible anymore.
Farage and Johnson lied more than any of the remainers, and they have now admonished themselves of any responsibility by stepping down from their post/going for PM. Gross hypocrisy at work.
We will leave the EU no doubts. But they won't offer us any sort of trade deal unless we submit to free movement of people. Kind of defeats the objective of the referendum to be honest. And it will take years to come to any sort of agreement. If Theresa May is elected leader there will be No Brexit ,she will drag it out . Even if she does ,I agree we may still have free movement of labour within EU BUT the difference is we wont be obliged to give them welfare or housing or free medical which is what is crippling us right now l
We should get on and sort a trade deal with the yanks ASAP, but we are not in a position of power because they would want to use the UK to passport into Europe, and that isn't possible anymore. Fuck ttip its further economic colonisation of nations worse than the appalling ceta
Farage and Johnson lied more than any of the remainers, and they have now admonished themselves of any responsibility by stepping down from their post/going for PM. Gross hypocrisy at work. They are Politicians they lie , same as remain lied , who lied more ??? who cares , a lot of people me included Voted leave despite Boris and Farage not because of it
We will leave the EU no doubts. But they won't offer us any sort of trade deal unless we submit to free movement of people. Kind of defeats the objective of the referendum to be honest. And it will take years to come to any sort of agreement. If Theresa May is elected leader there will be No Brexit ,she will drag it out . Even if she does ,I agree we may still have free movement of labour within EU BUT the difference is we wont be obliged to give them welfare or housing or free medical which is what is crippling us right now l
We should get on and sort a trade deal with the yanks ASAP, but we are not in a position of power because they would want to use the UK to passport into Europe, and that isn't possible anymore. Fuck ttip its further economic colonisation of nations worse than the appalling ceta
Farage and Johnson lied more than any of the remainers, and they have now admonished themselves of any responsibility by stepping down from their post/going for PM. Gross hypocrisy at work. They are Politicians they lie , same as remain lied , who lied more ??? who cares , a lot of people me included Voted leave despite Boris and Farage not because of it
Of course there will be a Brexit, if Theresa May doesn't execute article 50 well before the next general election then both her and the Conservatives will be toast. Labour may well have got their act together by then.
No one knows whether free movement of people will exclude benefits, housing and free healthcare. The only comparisons can be with the likes of Norway, for whom I am not sure how the trade agreement applies.
TTIP isn't an issue anymore, that is an agreement between the US and EU, we can start from scratch. There will be large swathes of Parliament that will oppose any TTIP style agreement especially if it threatens the stability of the NHS as a free state healthcare system.
With regards to Farage and Johnson, I am quite sure they made the difference especially Johnson who is a bit of a cult hero amongst voters. 1.8m may seem like a lot but it only would have taken a swing of a few percent to put leave ahead.
DB10GOONER wrote:I'm finding it hilarious that Adolf Farage is trying to claim Bexit as his greatest achievement and a "suitable high" to leave politics on!!
He really is one hilariously mad little bastard isn't he?
The Leave campaign was a success in spite of you, not because of you, ya fucking spazzer!
Don't agree with that mate. Johnson's charisma arguably made the difference but what people didn't expect was working class heartlands like South Wales firmly voting to leave. Farage hit a nerve with people's concerns about immigration and exploited that - people in those areas are far more likely to vote leave because of Farage than toffs like Boris or Gove. No coincidence that UKIp's vote share had been drastically rising in these areas recently.
Although Farage's rhetoric on immigration is completely incendiary to say the least and things like that poster was utterly appalling, I agree with a lot of what he says about the EU as a political institution.
We wouldn't have had a referendum if it wasn't for Farage and the rise of UKIP.
DB10GOONER wrote:I'm finding it hilarious that Adolf Farage is trying to claim Bexit as his greatest achievement and a "suitable high" to leave politics on!!
He really is one hilariously mad little bastard isn't he?
The Leave campaign was a success in spite of you, not because of you, ya fucking spazzer!
Don't agree with that mate. Johnson's charisma arguably made the difference but what people didn't expect was working class heartlands like South Wales firmly voting to leave. Farage hit a nerve with people's concerns about immigration and exploited that - people in those areas are far more likely to vote leave because of Farage than toffs like Boris or Gove. No coincidence that UKIp's vote share had been drastically rising in these areas recently.
Although Farage's rhetoric on immigration is completely incendiary to say the least and things like that poster was utterly appalling, I agree with a lot of what he says about the EU as a political institution.
We wouldn't have had a referendum if it wasn't for Farage and the rise of UKIP.
We'll never agree on that one. Farage is presenting himself as the sole reason the vote carried. And while I'm sure a good few brain-dead mongs voted leave because they agree with his racist agenda, a lot of intelligent people also voted leave not because of him but in spite of him. His bus advert embarrassed a lot of Leave campaigners.
You give UKIP too much credit. You Brits have never been happy handing your sovereignty to Europeans. You'd have had a referendum sooner or later either way, with or without UKIP. I'm sure UKIP influenced a good few of the reactionary voters but the Tory back benchers set this in motion and even Cameron supporters like Hammond, Fallon and Javid are well known Eurosceptics. Many of those back benchers were influenced by self-preservation too as they know who their voters are; the Conservative grassroots that have historically been predominantly supportive of leaving the EU. The referendum on membership of the EU was even in the 2015 Conservative party manifesto. Cameron fucked up by calling their bluff and it backfired spectacularly for him.
You're right that the UK has always been fairly Eurosceptic, as have elements of the Conservative party.
But in my opinion the manifesto commitment would never have been made were it not for the considerable political pressure that huge UKIP electoral gains and a few high-profile defections had put on the Tories. And the reality is that UKIP has basically been a personality cult of Farage.
I agree that he wouldn't have been the primary reason for many intelligent people voting leave, but equally the droves of working class people from Labour heartlands who unexpectedly rocked up and voted leave are just as likely to have listened to him as they are to Boris Johnson or Michael Gove.
He might be perceived as despicable to most but the reality is that a lot of people like Farage. Let's not forget that UKIP won the last EP elections with over a quarter of the vote despite the fact that only a tiny percentage of those people could name anybody else associated with the party.
He has been a kind of Robin Hood figure to a lot of the population that feel left behind and ignored by politics in general. Someone that they can get get behind as he airs the feelings that they feel that they can no longer feel or say. His comments on immigration are extreme but his speeches in the EU parliament before the vote were very much to the point that he was trying to get over. Despite the booing and catcalling from the federalists which infest the place he always had facts and figures to hand. He probably knows that his tenure as a party leader is at an end because whilst he is there he is a stick to beat the party with. If Labour don't get their act together and May gets in and does not trigger the article , Ukip under a more moderate leader could become a force to be reckoned with.
why is being concerned about immigration levels racist?
ooo look the markets and CCY is down again, lets go quiet all the days it rose and jump on it when its dropped again. its what happens its not an inherently bad thing regarding the ex rate as it will boost exports, its artifical speculating causing this and big investors attempting to make killings as due to the media and chattering clases and london bubble some investors are being spooked.
there was always going to short term pain, once the media get bored things will get back to normal...
whats wrong with house prices going down? it will help young people get on the ladder and hopefully burst the ridiculous price bubble that exists. the losers will be people who have entiely invested in property, but more fool them im afraid. eggs and baskets spring to mind
if there is no brexit then there will be riots. the brexit majority would have been even bigger imo were it not for the tragic shooting of that mp (whats happened there btw, all gone very quiet on the guy who did it?)
i think may was a closet brexiter as she was anonymous in the remian campaign which is odd for such a senior minister.
this thread should be locked like the transfer thread as its done as is wenger
the playing mantis wrote:why is being concerned about immigration levels racist?
On the face of it of course it's not racist. But there is a perception in your media (and the Euro media too) that most of the Leave voters were uneducated racists. For me there is nothing wrong with being concerned about unrestricted mass immigration. It's normal to be concerned about the rights and needs of your own people - up to a certain point.
The problem I have though is with the type of people that just basically don't want "foreigners" in their country. People like that disgust me. And tbh that isn't necessarily racism, but rather xenophobia.
I am a multiculturalist. I love experiencing other cultures and mixing with people of all colours, creeds and religions. I judge the person, not the colour of their skin or their accent. But I too would not be keen on unrestricted mass migration into Oireland. On the other hand I also believe if you are willing to obey the laws, respect the culture, work hard and pay taxes, then you should be able to go work and live in any country.
He said not sure.
