As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
Clash wrote:I agree about there being no abuse in this protest .... but would also hope there is no sentiment or show of gratitude either.
So lets drop the ''thanks for the memories'' thing for this. He's had enough praise for the good years and besides, I have a few too many memories I do not wish to thank him for.
The ''thanks for the memories'' banner was fine when it came out in 2011 but a lot has happened since then. Lets just try and get this man out of our club and make sure he knows we want him out this summer. Thank him for the memories after he's out if necessary.
Obviously there is a line that shouldn't be crossed, but at the same time I don't agree with this total "non abusive" protest - football is a game where passions run high frequently, and this newer sanitized stadiums are a lot of what is wrong with football nowadays, so having another "vanilla protest" only serves to portray us as latte drinking nice boys Our frustrations run deep, so why shouldn't the protest be as intensive as can be ? As you rightly said, the day has gone for nice protests, so maybe cranking it up a few notches would be a better way to go ?
I know what you mean, and I alluded to this earlier in this thread... but I think any protest's potential to grow is very reliant upon bringing on-board the very large number of fans that no longer think Wenger is right for the job but still respect him, and are reluctant to protest at the moment. I believe this is the fastest growing group in our fanbase. And they need to be brought onside. The minute the protest loses the "respectful" vibe is the minute we will lose all of those fans I think...
It's very difficult trying to organise as broad as possible a consensus to join this protest with a message and tone which everyone can sign up to. Those on the moderate wing have slowly and reluctantly come round to agreeing about the need for a change of manager but still can't bring themselves to disrespect Wenger because of his contribution to the club up to 2006, or for some even more recently. At the other extreme, there are a sizeable number who have zero respect for Wenger now, give him limited credit for the success that came our way in the early part of his reign and now actually despise him for his selfishness and contempt for supporters. We need everyone on board, which aint easy. We need to be coherent and united in what we do and how we do it, otherwise we are in danger of splintering into the Judean People's Front v The People's Front of Judea from Monty Python's Life of Brian. It also reminds me of the EU Referendum, when I was part of a fragile coalition which only succeeded because the more measured "official" Vote Leave campaign and the more aggressive "take no prisoners" Leave EU group fronted by Nigel Farage managed to engage enough people between them to carry the day. Discipline is everything here.
For me, it is about pragmatism first and foremost. On the one hand, we have to be cute. Wenger's friends in the media and AKBs will waste no opportunity to highlight any examples of extreme abuse, so those who hate Wenger's guts just need to rein it in. On the other hand, we can't afford to pull our punches. The message has to be more specific than "Time For Change" - it is about a change of manager - and given that he is not inclined to go gracefully it has to be stronger than ""Thanks for all those fantastic memories, perhaps it is time to give someone else a go"....Not an easy line to tread, but that's our challenge.
Last edited by Bob Bayliss on Tue Feb 28, 2017 7:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Bob Bayliss wrote:It's very difficult trying to organise as broad as possible a consensus to join this protest, and promote a coherent message which everyone can sign up to. Those on the moderate wing have slowly and reluctantly come round to agreeing about the need for a change of manager but still can't bring themselves to disrespect Wenger because of his contribution to the club up to 2006, or for some even more recently. At the other extreme, there are a sizeable number who have zero respect for Wenger now, give him limited credit for the success that came our way in the early part of his reign and now actually despise him for his selfishness and contempt for supporters. We need everyone on board, which aint easy. We need to be coherent and united in what we do and how we do it, otherwise we are in danger of splintering into the Judean People's Front v The People's Front of Judea from Monty Python's Life of Brian. It also reminds me of the EU Referendum, when I was part of a fragile coalition which only succeeded because the more moderate "official" Vote Leave campaign and the more aggressive "take no prisoners" Leave EU group fronted by Nigel Farage managed to inspire enough people between them to carry the day. Discipline is everything here.
For me, it is about pragmatism first and foremost. On the one hand, we have to be cute. Wenger's friends in the media and AKBs will waste no opportunity to highlight any examples of extreme abuse, so those who hate Wenger's guts just need to reign it in. On the other hand, we can't afford to pull our punches. The message has to be more specific than "Time For Change" - it is about a change of manager - and given that he is not inclined to go gracefully it has to be stronger than ""Thanks for all those fantastic memories, perhaps it is time to give someone else a go"....Not an easy line to tread, but that's our challenge.
Good post. I think it will have to be up to the extreme end of the protest spectrum, the ones that hate the man, to suck it in a bit and soften their stance slightly to bring on board the more moderate people. It might hurt like hell for some but it could be short term pain for (hopefully) long term gain. The right balance in the message is vital and I agree the "thanks for the memories" is now too soft an approach - it kind of gives the impression that we are "a bit miffed because he doesn't win the big trophies anymore and we'd kind of like him to step aside, but you know hey it ain't the end of the world if he don't..."
Siobhan was fit as mate, I owe you a beer and a bacon sandwich for that one!
She is a complete fruit of the loon and not always in a nice way , had a very dark side and was prone to self harming !
Ended up with Dave Stewart and they lived on Highbury Terrace in one of those HUGE houses for a few years ,he was a very nice man !
Bob Bayliss wrote:It's very difficult trying to organise as broad as possible a consensus to join this protest, and promote a coherent message which everyone can sign up to. Those on the moderate wing have slowly and reluctantly come round to agreeing about the need for a change of manager but still can't bring themselves to disrespect Wenger because of his contribution to the club up to 2006, or for some even more recently. At the other extreme, there are a sizeable number who have zero respect for Wenger now, give him limited credit for the success that came our way in the early part of his reign and now actually despise him for his selfishness and contempt for supporters. We need everyone on board, which aint easy. We need to be coherent and united in what we do and how we do it, otherwise we are in danger of splintering into the Judean People's Front v The People's Front of Judea from Monty Python's Life of Brian. It also reminds me of the EU Referendum, when I was part of a fragile coalition which only succeeded because the more moderate "official" Vote Leave campaign and the more aggressive "take no prisoners" Leave EU group fronted by Nigel Farage managed to inspire enough people between them to carry the day. Discipline is everything here.
For me, it is about pragmatism first and foremost. On the one hand, we have to be cute. Wenger's friends in the media and AKBs will waste no opportunity to highlight any examples of extreme abuse, so those who hate Wenger's guts just need to reign it in. On the other hand, we can't afford to pull our punches. The message has to be more specific than "Time For Change" - it is about a change of manager - and given that he is not inclined to go gracefully it has to be stronger than ""Thanks for all those fantastic memories, perhaps it is time to give someone else a go"....Not an easy line to tread, but that's our challenge.
Good post. I think it will have to be up to the extreme end of the protest spectrum, the ones that hate the man, to suck it in a bit and soften their stance slightly to bring on board the more moderate people. It might hurt like hell for some but it could be short term pain for (hopefully) long term gain. The right balance in the message is vital and I agree the "thanks for the memories" is now too soft an approach - it kind of gives the impression that we are "a bit miffed because he doesn't win the big trophies anymore and we'd kind of like him to step aside, but you know hey it ain't the end of the world if he don't..."
He needs to go, not one more season, not if he does or doesn't do this that or the other, this is the end of the line. That's the message...I had the No New Contract banner made because it's blunt, without being rude,disrespectful or going down memory lane. OUT that's the unswerving message. Tbh after the dismissive, disdainful way he treats us, he is getting a lot better than what he deserves.
It wouldnt be difficult to carry a FUCK OFF banner
Bob Bayliss wrote:It's very difficult trying to organise as broad as possible a consensus to join this protest, and promote a coherent message which everyone can sign up to. Those on the moderate wing have slowly and reluctantly come round to agreeing about the need for a change of manager but still can't bring themselves to disrespect Wenger because of his contribution to the club up to 2006, or for some even more recently. At the other extreme, there are a sizeable number who have zero respect for Wenger now, give him limited credit for the success that came our way in the early part of his reign and now actually despise him for his selfishness and contempt for supporters. We need everyone on board, which aint easy. We need to be coherent and united in what we do and how we do it, otherwise we are in danger of splintering into the Judean People's Front v The People's Front of Judea from Monty Python's Life of Brian. It also reminds me of the EU Referendum, when I was part of a fragile coalition which only succeeded because the more moderate "official" Vote Leave campaign and the more aggressive "take no prisoners" Leave EU group fronted by Nigel Farage managed to inspire enough people between them to carry the day. Discipline is everything here.
For me, it is about pragmatism first and foremost. On the one hand, we have to be cute. Wenger's friends in the media and AKBs will waste no opportunity to highlight any examples of extreme abuse, so those who hate Wenger's guts just need to reign it in. On the other hand, we can't afford to pull our punches. The message has to be more specific than "Time For Change" - it is about a change of manager - and given that he is not inclined to go gracefully it has to be stronger than ""Thanks for all those fantastic memories, perhaps it is time to give someone else a go"....Not an easy line to tread, but that's our challenge.
Good post. I think it will have to be up to the extreme end of the protest spectrum, the ones that hate the man, to suck it in a bit and soften their stance slightly to bring on board the more moderate people. It might hurt like hell for some but it could be short term pain for (hopefully) long term gain. The right balance in the message is vital and I agree the "thanks for the memories" is now too soft an approach - it kind of gives the impression that we are "a bit miffed because he doesn't win the big trophies anymore and we'd kind of like him to step aside, but you know hey it ain't the end of the world if he don't..."
He needs to go, not one more season, not if he does or doesn't do this that or the other, this is the end of the line. That's the message...I had the No New Contract banner made because it's blunt, without being rude,disrespectful or going down memory lane. OUT that's the unswerving message. Tbh after the dismissive, disdainful way he treats us, he is getting a lot better than what he deserves.
It wouldnt be difficult to carry a FUCK OFF banner
I like the "No New Contract" banner idea. Blunt and to the point but not abusive - and equally not sentimental or diluted.
Can you post a pic, mate? Don't worry if you'd rather not.
Bob Bayliss wrote:It's very difficult trying to organise as broad as possible a consensus to join this protest, and promote a coherent message which everyone can sign up to. Those on the moderate wing have slowly and reluctantly come round to agreeing about the need for a change of manager but still can't bring themselves to disrespect Wenger because of his contribution to the club up to 2006, or for some even more recently. At the other extreme, there are a sizeable number who have zero respect for Wenger now, give him limited credit for the success that came our way in the early part of his reign and now actually despise him for his selfishness and contempt for supporters. We need everyone on board, which aint easy. We need to be coherent and united in what we do and how we do it, otherwise we are in danger of splintering into the Judean People's Front v The People's Front of Judea from Monty Python's Life of Brian. It also reminds me of the EU Referendum, when I was part of a fragile coalition which only succeeded because the more moderate "official" Vote Leave campaign and the more aggressive "take no prisoners" Leave EU group fronted by Nigel Farage managed to inspire enough people between them to carry the day. Discipline is everything here.
For me, it is about pragmatism first and foremost. On the one hand, we have to be cute. Wenger's friends in the media and AKBs will waste no opportunity to highlight any examples of extreme abuse, so those who hate Wenger's guts just need to reign it in. On the other hand, we can't afford to pull our punches. The message has to be more specific than "Time For Change" - it is about a change of manager - and given that he is not inclined to go gracefully it has to be stronger than ""Thanks for all those fantastic memories, perhaps it is time to give someone else a go"....Not an easy line to tread, but that's our challenge.
Good post. I think it will have to be up to the extreme end of the protest spectrum, the ones that hate the man, to suck it in a bit and soften their stance slightly to bring on board the more moderate people. It might hurt like hell for some but it could be short term pain for (hopefully) long term gain. The right balance in the message is vital and I agree the "thanks for the memories" is now too soft an approach - it kind of gives the impression that we are "a bit miffed because he doesn't win the big trophies anymore and we'd kind of like him to step aside, but you know hey it ain't the end of the world if he don't..."
He needs to go, not one more season, not if he does or doesn't do this that or the other, this is the end of the line. That's the message...I had the No New Contract banner made because it's blunt, without being rude,disrespectful or going down memory lane. OUT that's the unswerving message. Tbh after the dismissive, disdainful way he treats us, he is getting a lot better than what he deserves.
It wouldnt be difficult to carry a FUCK OFF banner
I like the "No New Contract" banner idea. Blunt and to the point but not abusive - and equally not sentimental or diluted.
Can you post a pic, mate? Don't worry if you'd rather not.
No problem...I am still waiting for it..hopefully Friday.
Lads, a guy I know will do us some PVC banners, about a metre long and 40cm high. They're not great for getting in to the ground, but that'snot what we need them for this time. They'll be about a tenner, probably a few quid less. If you want one, can you PM me what message you want on it so I can get it ordered by tomorrow AM.
Only on our forum could you find us debating how polite a demonstration to remove the French Prick should be
He is vermin and needs to be removed, there should be no other thought, Arsenal class can be taken too far you know
If i didn't know better i'd almost expect some of you lot to tell tales of Herd and his friends inviting the other 'chaps' over for 'tiffen' and 'fisticuffs' after the match the way some people bang on about our 'class'
You will not remove Wenger by anything other than a balls out continuous high profile effort that garners mass attention and harms the 'brand' in a significant way.
There is no other reason for him to leave and only by harming the brand image can i see him being asked to leave, he WILL NOT leave of his own accord, but if you want to be all polite and 'gentile' about it lads just in case it might harm our image, crack on, but be prepared for at least another 4 years after all he is so egotistical he WILL want to beat SAFs longevity record even if he can't beat his footballing accomplishments
GoonerMuzz wrote:Only on our forum could you find us debating how polite a demonstration to remove the French Prick should be
He is vermin and needs to be removed, there should be no other thought, Arsenal class can be taken too far you know
If i didn't know better i'd almost expect some of you lot to tell tales of Herd and his friends inviting the other 'chaps' over for 'tiffen' and 'fisticuffs' after the match the way some people bang on about our 'class'
You will not remove Wenger by anything other than a balls out continuous high profile effort that garners mass attention and harms the 'brand' in a significant way.
There is no other reason for him to leave and only by harming the brand image can i see him being asked to leave, he WILL NOT leave of his own accord, but if you want to be all polite and 'gentile' about it lads just in case it might harm our image, crack on, but be prepared for at least another 4 years after all he is so egotistical he WILL want to beat SAFs longevity record even if he can't beat his footballing accomplishments
It can be sustained and show balls, and sticking to the central 'no new contract' message will certainly drive this home, but if we start being overtly abusive , it will rally the waverers against us, and willl strengthen his hand. However individuals feel, if we starting calling him 'vermin' in public it will be dismissed ,
As someone said earlier it's a fine line. To pitch
Our frustrations run deep, so why shouldn't the protest be as intensive as can be ? As you rightly said, the day has gone for nice protests, so maybe cranking it up a few notches would be a better way to go ?
