THE WENGER THREAD

[xisstential]

Maybe we should get rid of this thread and have a Wenger Out & a Wenger in thread. WoB's on one, AkB's on the other.....and unless you convert you stck to your side of the fence.

No thanks needed, I'm a problem solver.... now back to getting rid of Wenger

It'll need Three Threads mate - The WOB's the AKB's and the Fence Sitters.

Four...you forgot the flip floppers..they need their own space..cannot have them drifting in & out of the WoB's & AKB pages can we now.

[augie]

Had spuddy digging me out yesterday for "labelling" people AKBs, #fliofloppers etc.
Like all of a sudden terms AKBs and #flipfloppers are offensive?

Today flash you're pulling me up because of apparent "snide remarks" and not directly quoting while it's been going on for ages on this forum without anyone saying anything.

Meanwhile people are getting called the "c" word and all sorts of other names and labels being thrown around every single day. Not a word said.

Seems a bit strange that.

Stop ratting the rest of us out

Look buddy, I got called a racist last week by a vertically challenged, pony riding, thieving Dublin caaant (no names mentioned ), and you can either take offence to it, or you can brush off the slur and move on
For the record I am not a racist, but I do not like pikey dubs and especially those that are claiming to be working, when the reality is that they are stealing a living by sitting around drinking coffee in some government offices all day long

[DB10GOONER]

Look buddy, I got called a racist last week by a vertically challenged, pony riding, thieving Dublin caaant (no names mentioned ), and you can either take offence to it, or you can brush off the slur and move on
For the record I am not a racist, but I do not like pikey dubs and especially those that are claiming to be working, when the reality is that they are stealing a living by sitting around drinking coffee in some government offices all day long

I simply cannot believe your carer has let you at the PC on your own again. Especially after your "escapades" on that Fat Bald Middle-Aged Gay Porn site...

[armchair]

Anyway, got a call from Matt at the Arsenal bout an hour or so ago about season tickets.
As I'm gonna take my boy next season I wanted to ask him about getting one for him beside me.
He asked what block I was interested in and when I said lower tier close as poss to halfway line he laughed and replied..........

"Do you want to sit in the dugout beside Wenger?" (That wouldn't end well. )

When I replied........
"Hopefully he'll be gone by then"

His answer was......
"No comment"

[xisstential]

Anyway, got a call from Matt at the Arsenal bout an hour or so ago about season tickets.
As I'm gonna take my boy next season I wanted to ask him about getting one for him beside me.
He asked what block I was interested in and when I said lower tier close as poss to halfway line he laughed and replied..........

"Do you want to sit in the dugout beside Wenger?" (That wouldn't end well. )

When I replied........
"Hopefully he'll be gone by then"

His answer was......
"No comment"

I couldn't imagine sitting through another season of his football. I cannot see myself watching on TV let alone being there. If he stays,the only time I'll tune in is for his post matches when we lose...That might be fairly often methinks.

My daughter & son in law live in Brighton, nice there, I think I'll spend some time at the Amex stadium until he goes.....

[NickF]

Anyway, got a call from Matt at the Arsenal bout an hour or so ago about season tickets.
As I'm gonna take my boy next season I wanted to ask him about getting one for him beside me.
He asked what block I was interested in and when I said lower tier close as poss to halfway line he laughed and replied..........

"Do you want to sit in the dugout beside Wenger?" (That wouldn't end well. )

When I replied........
"Hopefully he'll be gone by then"

His answer was......
"No comment"

I couldn't imagine sitting through another season of his football. I cannot see myself watching on TV let alone being there. If he stays,the only time I'll tune in is for his post matches when we lose...That might be fairly often methinks.

My daughter & son in law live in Brighton, nice there, I think I'll spend some time at the Amex stadium until he goes.....

I've got a season ticket and I can imagine sitting through any more of this season.
Don't think I could face seeing the players cavorting round the pitch taking selfies if we did get 4th like they did a few years ago.

If he stays, I've got loads of friends who go to Southend United (home town club), so may go there instead.

[supergeorgegraham]

Abramovich would get a nice amount of his cash back if he sold Chelsea? He would be hard pressed in getting anywhere near half of his money back.
The obvious confusion here is that he is a fan as oppose to an investor which is what Kroenke, the Glazers and Ellis Short are. He's loaded his subsidies as interest free loans onto Chelsea's books in typical robbing Peter to pay Paul fashion They remain long term debts and he is far from breaking even.

Wobs have been accused on this thread of revisionism in the sense that Wenger hasnt been given or doesnt get enough credit for his achievements of the past. Personally I don't agree but fair enough.

But my God the re-writing of history is strong regarding the Kroenke debate.

"He's milking the club"


Well if taking a £3mill "consultancy fee" a couple times is milking the club them yes.

"He's bleeding us dry"
No actually we are one of the richest clubs in the world

"He's a club killer"
Again we are a rich club in the capital city with a worldwide fan base and state-of-the-art facilities.
If by "club killer" you mean how we've lost our heart and sole and identity since the move then that was in place before Kroenke took over.

"Wenger has been failing for at least a decade so Kroenke should have sacked him years ago"
This point is valid had Kroenke been anything other than an investor. An absentee landlord.
But again he only fully took over in 2011. That's only 6yrs ago. There's thousands of fans and actual wobs on this board who wouldn't have sacked Wenger in 2011 yet some expect Kroenke, a new owner to come in and do it? Some actual fans have only been WengerOut from this season yet Kronke should have sacked him years ago?
That's just not sensible really

I now see posts saying Abramovich would have sacked him 10 yrs ago. Jesus H Christ!
If your granny had balls she'd be your grandad fs.

Usmanov couldn't get in (and still can't really) yet people are rewriting history to intimate that Abramovich would have sacked him?
Look at the abuse and sneering, holier-than-thou attitude our fans have had towards Chelsea and City about "oil money", "Arab money" and "buying success"etc. Now some wish Abramovich was our owner because they reckon he would have sacked Wenger 10yrs ago.
Hypocritical imo.

Wow you really need to read more carefully before you rant and my lord do you love a rant. Nobody said they want Abramovich as our owner but his record of sacking managers who don't win the League speaks for itself. That oil money bollocks is old hat he turned Chelsea into winners fact. I don't honestly give a shite who owns Arsenal as long as we are successful on the pitch. First yes Wenger must go and to be honest I think he will leave after the FA Cup final.
We will lose Sanchez and Ozil and getting players to sign for any other reason than money will be impossible.
If you think Kroenke is good for Arsenal good on ya but he left Arsenal in the hands of Wenger to have full control so I guess once he is gone we shall see if he has any intentions of actually doing anything at all.

[General]

The argument that getting rid of Kroenke would mean an Abramovich type owner magically steps to fore, fires Wenger and voila we are winning all before us fails to recognise the risk that we could quite easily end up with a parasitic owner who either ends up draining money out of the club or leverages debts against our books. It's a far greater risk than getting rid of Wenger and we are prime candidates for this under the current circumstances. For every Abramovich there are several Hicks and Gillettes.
I've aso mentioned it before that United fans can no longer target the Glazers as they'v invested heavily in the squad. It's also debatable whether they would have sacked Moyes or Van Gaal had they matched Wenger's record for the past 3seasons. The extent to which Kroenke is holding us back can only be fully realised once we get rid of Wenger. With Wenger out of the way, it would be easier to go after him.

Agree with most of that, mate. There certainly are far worse fuckers out there that could own us. Absolutely. And as I've said before (though some of our less intelligent posters choose to misread it) the ONLY area where Kroenke has really failed is in not sacking Wenger. If we are lucky enough to get a self motivated winner as our next manager then Kroenke ain't gonna be a problem. If we get someone that slips into minimum delivery mode then we are back to square one. And yeah I know it's a very hypothetical possibility that the next manager goes into that mode but even the possibility of years more of this Modern Arsenal Business Model shite scares the bejaysus outa me.

To be fair DB, any potential complications with a new manager would be easier to contend than the knots we could find ourselves in if Stan decides to up sticks and flog his shares to the highest bidder. Look at Scouse and the cyclic mess they are caught up in. No league title in what 22years now despite going through several managerial changes? Yes I know we have the attraction of being in a major city but they were once the biggest club in England. As far as Kroenke goes, I think we made our bed when our former custodians conveniently sold up and we must lie in it. Who is going to spend over £1bn on a club and then spend about a third more on a squad that needs major surgery. It would be great if he was a fan too. Our best bet is probably Usmanov but I’m not sure he’d pump in his own cash without loading it onto our books like Abramovich did.

[xisstential]

If we ever ended up in the Championship under Wenger we would never get promoted..but we would make the playoffs...EVERY year, and Wenger after 5 times of doing that would sell that as the achievement. That would be his proud legacy...Look for 20 years now I have led this team to 3rd, 4th , 5th or 6th, (never 1st or 2nd of course, the REAL prize) ..and that is a very proud record, blah,blah... And nobody would ask him about promotion..because of course getting to the playoffs would be sold as the major accomplishment. That is exactly what he does now, none of his disciples even dream about winning the PL..hell none of us do. But 4th..that dream LIVES.

[sk-gtfo]

To be fair DB, any potential complications with a new manager would be easier to contend than the knots we could find ourselves in if Stan decides to up sticks and flog his shares to the highest bidder. Look at Scouse and the cyclic mess they are caught up in. No league title in what 22years now despite going through several managerial changes? Yes I know we have the attraction of being in a major city but they were once the biggest club in England. As far as Kroenke goes, I think we made our bed when our former custodians conveniently sold up and we must lie in it. Who is going to spend over £1bn on a club and then spend about a third more on a squad that needs major surgery. It would be great if he was a fan too. Our best bet is probably Usmanov but I’m not sure he’d pump in his own cash without loading it onto our books like Abramovich did.

37 years since Liverpool won it, surely you mean the board made their bed?, fans had no choice and sure there were a few idiots with the hate Usmanov banners out sucked in by the FFP bs and self sustaining propaganda put out by the board but I think on the whole, given the choice, most would side with the oligarch.

I really don't like the way clubs are owned in England on the whole, it is a total lottery really, either you get an Abramovich/Mansour, otherwise you generally either get a decent owner (Southampton/Everton?) or if out of luck you get an American or someone a bid dodgy from Asia (usually), I think it is becoming increasingly difficult to feel connected to a club, in a local sense, especially when the owner/majority shareholder doesn't really care.

I do wonder whether the bubble will burst at some point in the near future, clubs are pressing ahead with new stadiums or expansion projects, however I can't help feeling this is at odds with the way some feel about football now, perhaps it is just me?.

You are right though in that it is hard to see who could afford to buy us out, Kroenke's shares are worth £750-800M I believe, there was a rumour Aliko Dangote (Africa's richest man) was interested, perhaps a dual buy out with Usmanov (one can dream..), on the whole though it feels pretty much feels like we are f*cked as stubborn Stan will probably hang around like a bad smell, just like Wenger has.

[mcdowell42]

Sorry to be picky but I think it's 27 years since the bindippers won it.





Carry on.

[mcdowell42]

Sorry to be picky but I think it's 27 years since the bindippers won it.





Carry on.

PS I'm not a Liverpool fan.

[armchair]

At last the Kroenke out brigade have decided to mobilise.

Pity they chose to confront the anti-Wenger rally at the roundabout though. Can't they just do their own thing and leave us alone? At least this time they didn't get violent like they have in the past.

Love that they have recruited "flag man" to dance about in front of the guys and wave his flags around. Great job flag man.

Also love "You're wrong with the Wenger [out] blud!

Wonder if it's anyone from off here.

phpBB [video]

[NickF]

At last the Kroenke out brigade have decided to mobilise.

Pity they chose to confront the anti-Wenger rally at the roundabout though. Can't they just do their own thing and leave us alone? At least this time they didn't get violent like they have in the past.

Love that they have recruited "flag man" to dance about in front of the guys and wave his flags around. Great job flag man.

Also love "You're wrong with the Wenger [out] blud!

Wonder if it's anyone from off here.

phpBB [video]

He was anti Kroenke? I thought he was an AKB.

[General]

To be fair DB, any potential complications with a new manager would be easier to contend than the knots we could find ourselves in if Stan decides to up sticks and flog his shares to the highest bidder. Look at Scouse and the cyclic mess they are caught up in. No league title in what 22years now despite going through several managerial changes? Yes I know we have the attraction of being in a major city but they were once the biggest club in England. As far as Kroenke goes, I think we made our bed when our former custodians conveniently sold up and we must lie in it. Who is going to spend over £1bn on a club and then spend about a third more on a squad that needs major surgery. It would be great if he was a fan too. Our best bet is probably Usmanov but I’m not sure he’d pump in his own cash without loading it onto our books like Abramovich did.

37 years since Liverpool won it, surely you mean the board made their bed?, fans had no choice and sure there were a few idiots with the hate Usmanov banners out sucked in by the FFP bs and self sustaining propaganda put out by the board but I think on the whole, given the choice, most would side with the oligarch.

I really don't like the way clubs are owned in England on the whole, it is a total lottery really, either you get an Abramovich/Mansour, otherwise you generally either get a decent owner (Southampton/Everton?) or if out of luck you get an American or someone a bid dodgy from Asia (usually), I think it is becoming increasingly difficult to feel connected to a club, in a local sense, especially when the owner/majority shareholder doesn't really care.

I do wonder whether the bubble will burst at some point in the near future, clubs are pressing ahead with new stadiums or expansion projects, however I can't help feeling this is at odds with the way some feel about football now, perhaps it is just me?.

You are right though in that it is hard to see who could afford to buy us out, Kroenke's shares are worth £750-800M I believe, there was a rumour Aliko Dangote (Africa's richest man) was interested, perhaps a dual buy out with Usmanov (one can dream..), on the whole though it feels pretty much feels like we are f*cked as stubborn Stan will probably hang around like a bad smell, just like Wenger has.

Perhaps most would side with the Usmanov now but this wasn't the case back in 2008 or even when Kreonke became the majority shareholder in 2011. The point about Liverpool, whether it's 27years or 37years, is how the change in ownership hasn't improved their fortunes. I've said it on here before that the days of sugar daddies throwing their own cash at clubs are long gone. Tony Fernandez and Bernie Ecclestone didn't do it with QPR and Ellis Short has just overseen Sunderland's relegation even though it's his only sporting interest. Abramovich has steadily reduced his personal investment to nil over the past 5years and we have a higher net spend than Chelsea in this period. Whether it's an oligarch or a Yank, most clubs are now moving towards the self sustaining model.

When people say they want to see the back of Kroenke, assuming they are willing to protest about it, they need to think carefully about who they want because the chances of us going the direction of Scouse are very high. He has a lot of money tied in his shares and at some point he'd want to release the funds possibly through dividends or worst case scenario offload them to the highest bidder. We are an untapped goldmine and the wolves will fancy their chances, including those who would want to use the club to further their public image. My personal view at this moment is that the devil you know is better than the angel you don't know. Those angered by his history with US sports franchises might want to consider the fact that operating a franchise is the complete antithesis of operating a football club. I'd be worried if the PL had no relegation or top 4 and a collective salary cap which creates a financial level playing field. The reality is we've spent a lot of money and the football has got worse. Wenger can no longer hide behind the financial argument.