Mikel Arteta, success or failure? - Merged thread.

[OneBardGooner]

Just waking up and seeing him in that Salt Bae video trending on social media.

He deserves the immediate sack for that alone!

Link??

[wilson2.0]

taken from le grove on January 9th

"Sack Arteta? You are a deeply unserious person if that’s your view"

"it’s no shame to lose to a Liverpool side we battered with 18 shots. No team has done that to Liverpool this season. We haven’t been able to do that against Liverpool in 10 years. The result didn’t go our way, but over the long term, those sorts of games where we are clearly the better team will give us strength. We’re no longer the inferior team of boys that hides. The fear of two seasons ago against big teams has gone. That is progress"



there you go you ungrateful bastards - you cant be serious if you want Arteta out, and despite still losing the big matches we no longer fear them.
We are making PROGRESS!

Sacking Arteta means you have a viable replacement, and who could you replace him with and have high confidence there will be improvement.

Antonio Conte is available right now, wouldn't people really want him? Pep, Klopp, Ancelotti, Simione. None are available. Who do you replace Arteta with. Dont say De Zerbi or Thomas Frank. One bad appointment and we could slide down to 6th and be 15-20 points adrift of top, rather than 5. I understand the criticism of Arteta, perhaps you feel he isnt the one to take the extra step from 2nd to 1st. However, if you want to sack him, then you had better be sure his replacement is an improvement who can make that step.

I desperately wanted Wenger out, it happened and it was the correct decision. However under Emery we were not much better. 'Sack Arteta and win the league" becomes sack Arteta and finish 6th, & face an exodus due to no CL football.

If we did sack Arteta, he would end up on the shortlist to be the next Chelsea, Newcastle, Man United manager, and it wouldn't surprise me if he took one of those clubs above us. I actually do think he can get us over the line if given time. Although 'patience' is a dirty word among fans these days. 'Oh but he has had 4 years' you cry; so what. What it does it matter how long he has. All that matters is which manager can win the next one.

[wilson2.0]

I don't know.... its almost like appointing a novice as manager of a huge club is a bad idea....

Well we are in a much better place today, than the day he took over. No point pretending otherwise

[Stuart L (2)]

For me, it’s looking at the half way point in the season and we are still waiting for it all to click on the pitch

Last season we were so good to watch, in most games, attack minded, fluid, quick passing, which has been deliberately replaced with slow, possession oriented, controlled football.

We may well dominate possession in the midfield ( inverted fullback to provide an overload) but the cost is our game is slowed right down and we are nowhere near the attacking force we were.

As manager Arteta takes responsibility for the change - was it necessary?

Saka gets double, sometimes triple marked, but that means we have men free in other areas of the pitch if we move the ball quickly …..but we don’t (now)

Our best chance v Liverpool in the cup was a direct kick from Ramsdale to Nelson on the run, which if he had controlled it, should have resulted in a goal - no 50 passes across and back the pitch 5 times.

It doesn’t hurt to mix it up occasionally, we have players with speed, but hardly ever look for a ball that tests the defence from deep,

I genuinely thought the additions of Rice and Timber would push us further on, Rice has been great bar the last 3 matches, Timber as we know has been unable to contribute so far.

Havertz, may, according to stats, win more than his share of challenges but it’s what he does ( or doesn’t ) do with the ball afterwards that is telling - no incisive passes, no assists, that I can recall, he just looks like he is in the way of his own players a lot of the time.


Are we better than when Arteta took over ? Yes, we are back in the Champions League and should qualify again.
Are we better than last season ? No,

you can point to other teams improving- Villa, Liverpool, etc, then if they can do so, why can’t we ?
How have their managers managed to do so ?

[BFG4]

I don't know.... its almost like appointing a novice as manager of a huge club is a bad idea....

Well we are in a much better place today, than the day he took over. No point pretending otherwise

We finished 8th twice under Arteta, blew a top 4 place two seasons ago and as good as last season was, we still collapsed in the run in. The 'better place' we supposedly are in is one in which we have grand canyon style holes in our squad, all while the manager pissed away 700 million. The previous post suggesting the other clubs who would take Arteta is laughable. In four years his entire style revolves around a complete over reliance on Saka and Martinelli. Teams have completely sniffed this out and this footballing savant has zero plan B.

[Redarmy]

For me, it’s looking at the half way point in the season and we are still waiting for it all to click on the pitch

Last season we were so good to watch, in most games, attack minded, fluid, quick passing, which has been deliberately replaced with slow, possession oriented, controlled football.

We may well dominate possession in the midfield ( inverted fullback to provide an overload) but the cost is our game is slowed right down and we are nowhere near the attacking force we were.

As manager Arteta takes responsibility for the change - was it necessary?

Saka gets double, sometimes triple marked, but that means we have men free in other areas of the pitch if we move the ball quickly …..but we don’t (now)

Our best chance v Liverpool in the cup was a direct kick from Ramsdale to Nelson on the run, which if he had controlled it, should have resulted in a goal - no 50 passes across and back the pitch 5 times.

It doesn’t hurt to mix it up occasionally, we have players with speed, but hardly ever look for a ball that tests the defence from deep,

I genuinely thought the additions of Rice and Timber would push us further on, Rice has been great bar the last 3 matches, Timber as we know has been unable to contribute so far.

Havertz, may, according to stats, win more than his share of challenges but it’s what he does ( or doesn’t ) do with the ball afterwards that is telling - no incisive passes, no assists, that I can recall, he just looks like he is in the way of his own players a lot of the time.


Are we better than when Arteta took over ? Yes, we are back in the Champions League and should qualify again.
Are we better than last season ? No,

you can point to other teams improving- Villa, Liverpool, etc, then if they can do so, why can’t we ?
How have their managers managed to do so ?

Good post Stuart.....

Also think the change in team tactics has contributed to Saka and Martinelli loosing any potency...(also teams are giving Saka in particular rough treatment) teams are all lined up just waiting to deny the wingers any space to run into

Maybe City can implement this team tactic but they have players like De Bryne and Haarland who can unlock any defence at will almost

Think honestly we just needed tweaking from last season....they played great first half of season...then lost Saliba who was imperious at the back.....think Arteta is too much of the thinker trying to prove himself...copying Pep maybe?

[OneBardGooner]

Sadly, it has become all too clear that Last Season was a 'One Off', as many have already said all the other teams (who usually challenge for the title) had an off-season, each for varying reasons. WE had a 'Good One' and (imo) had it not been for 2 things: Saliba's absence for the last third of the season through injury AND that DotardCunt Clive - His idiocy at Anfield was the start of our downward spiral.

I believe we would have won the title.

Having said that Arteta has demonstrated by his outlandish and foolhardy choices and decisions he is most definitely NOT the man to take us to success; the Prem Title and other possible Trophies.

Sadly we are stuck with him, unless Wiggy & Son Wake The Fuck Up. And even if they did who the fuck can we bring in? The pain of TOF is back with us Big Time.

[augie]

taken from le grove on January 9th

"Sack Arteta? You are a deeply unserious person if that’s your view"

"it’s no shame to lose to a Liverpool side we battered with 18 shots. No team has done that to Liverpool this season. We haven’t been able to do that against Liverpool in 10 years. The result didn’t go our way, but over the long term, those sorts of games where we are clearly the better team will give us strength. We’re no longer the inferior team of boys that hides. The fear of two seasons ago against big teams has gone. That is progress"



there you go you ungrateful bastards - you cant be serious if you want Arteta out, and despite still losing the big matches we no longer fear them.
We are making PROGRESS!

Sacking Arteta means you have a viable replacement, and who could you replace him with and have high confidence there will be improvement.

Antonio Conte is available right now, wouldn't people really want him? Pep, Klopp, Ancelotti, Simione. None are available. Who do you replace Arteta with. Dont say De Zerbi or Thomas Frank. One bad appointment and we could slide down to 6th and be 15-20 points adrift of top, rather than 5. I understand the criticism of Arteta, perhaps you feel he isnt the one to take the extra step from 2nd to 1st. However, if you want to sack him, then you had better be sure his replacement is an improvement who can make that step.

I desperately wanted Wenger out, it happened and it was the correct decision. However under Emery we were not much better. 'Sack Arteta and win the league" becomes sack Arteta and finish 6th, & face an exodus due to no CL football.

If we did sack Arteta, he would end up on the shortlist to be the next Chelsea, Newcastle, Man United manager, and it wouldn't surprise me if he took one of those clubs above us. I actually do think he can get us over the line if given time. Although 'patience' is a dirty word among fans these days. 'Oh but he has had 4 years' you cry; so what. What it does it matter how long he has. All that matters is which manager can win the next one.

Given time ?? And how much more money would you give him to piss away given that he has spent almost £700m to date, and you can put up a strong argument that he has spent too much on all those players that he bought (with exception of injured Timber and Trossard) ? He is imo pissing away one of the best talents to come through our academy in years (smith-rowe), he is failing to develop saka in a big way, and the team in general has severely declined this season after spending over 200m last summer ? The arrogant cock thinks he can re-invent the wheel and refuses to acknowledge and correct the mistakes he is making - what is the point in giving more time to a manager to continue making same mistakes week after week ? Comments like yours suggesting patience is needed pisses me off cos you try to shame fans into backing down as if we are being unreasonable - as others have pointed out, prior to last season we had stunk the place for two seasons under diet pep, and I'll ask you straight out, how much of last seasons "success" was down to our rivals all being shit at the one time ? You say that our progress under emery was marginal, but unlike diet pep emery wasnt given massive money to spend and wasnt allowed bin expensive trouble makers like el basque was allowed to do - you give most managers £700m to spend and you would expect to see improvements, but I would suggest to you that the improvements do not justify/equal the outlay

[Gunner Rob]

I don't know.... its almost like appointing a novice as manager of a huge club is a bad idea....

Well we are in a much better place today, than the day he took over. No point pretending otherwise

Are we?

The one off season (22/23) was based mainly on a run of form from August through to the World Cup.
We struggled, had a bit of luck from then on and then collapsed in April. I would argue we got steadily worse during all of last year, and the failure to buy a top class striker meant we were unable to build on last season.

Ok we have been in and around the top again and cruised through the Champions League group but I still think we will struggle to finish in the top 4 and yet again we have exited the domestic cups early.
There doesn’t seem to be a plan B, but Arteta better find one soon because plan A is clearly not working. And I won’t be suddenly Arteta in even if we do beat Palace 5-0 on Saturday

[wilson2.0]

Its easy to call for the sacking of a manager. Much harder to name a replacement who you could say with a high degree of confidence could win us the league or CL. If there is a suitable replacement, then of course. However, if your argument is 'give someone else a turn', then thats dangerous. If we sacked Arteta for Graham Potter, then WTF. Im not even sold on De Zerbi who always gets a mention, for me he is massively overrated and like Potter, it made to look good due to Brighton set up.

As annoying as last season was, and as annoying as this season has been. The tally is still Liverpool 45, Man City 43, Arsenal 40. The idea this position is a sackable offence is ridiculous.

Although the argument going up against Pep and Klopp is too early for Arteta. We need our own Pep or Klopp - and which manager is this? The only manager who could be viable and available in the short term, would be Hansi Flick.

Although I dont understand the intense desire to see Arteta sacked without a plan. People need to start naming potential and viable replacements. When you actually ave to come up with a name, suddenly sacking Arteta looks very rash and short sighted.

[augie]

Its easy to call for the sacking of a manager. Much harder to name a replacement who you could say with a high degree of confidence could win us the league or CL. If there is a suitable replacement, then of course. However, if your argument is 'give someone else a turn', then thats dangerous. If we sacked Arteta for Graham Potter, then WTF. Im not even sold on De Zerbi who always gets a mention, for me he is massively overrated and like Potter, it made to look good due to Brighton set up.

As annoying as last season was, and as annoying as this season has been. The tally is still Liverpool 45, Man City 43, Arsenal 40. The idea this position is a sackable offence is ridiculous.

Although the argument going up against Pep and Klopp is too early for Arteta. We need our own Pep or Klopp - and which manager is this? The only manager who could be viable and available in the short term, would be Hansi Flick.

Although I dont understand the intense desire to see Arteta sacked without a plan. People need to start naming potential and viable replacements. When you actually ave to come up with a name, suddenly sacking Arteta looks very rash and short sighted.

I understand your arguments about the need to have an upgrade lined up to validate sacking him, but let me ask you another question - would you continue to bankroll el basque in the transfer windows given his (and edu's) track record ? See I think it is easy to say that he should be given more time, but far harder to make an argument for giving him more money to spend - if you dont back a manager with funds then what is the point in keeping him, but if you keep giving him money to piss away then how badly are you running your business if you allow him throw away more money ? As a business (and kroenke critics keep saying they are all about business and money), it is financial suicide to keep gambling money on a guy that (a) cant seem to see where he is failing (b) is overseeing a state of regression both in the team as a whole and in individual players. Again if I am a businessman owner like kroenke, I am looking at my "assets" like saka and martinelli losing value and not being worth anywhere near what they were 12 months ago, and I would be thinking that the guy is taking the team, the club AND the players backwards and that is not sustainable

[Midz]

A
Striker
2 Full backs
DM to play alongside Rice

Realistically that's about £200m and that should make us a very good team. If the money was spent on quality for those positions then what we already have should work very well together.

We might get away with only 1 quality FB which saves a bit of cash but we still need substantial investment if we wish to compete at the top level.

[OneBardGooner]

Arteta & Edu :






Courtesy of Nik Nak

[Nick Nack]

Arteta & Edu :






Courtesy of Nik Nak

[Nick Nack]

Mourinho is available.. again

#just saying