Mikel Arteta, success or failure? - Merged thread.

[Leyton Gooner]

Time for El Fraudio to fuck off and fuck off some more. Two semi finals this season where we never laid a glove on the oppo over 180 minutes. Fucking piss poor

[SteveO 35]

The sort of nonsense coming out of his mouth this season has made him sound like Wenger. If anyone dares question anything they're dismissed with a snarky arrogant comment and he's now saying we'd have won 2 Premier Leagues with our points totals and been the best team in this year's CL. Sadly like Wenger and his 4th placed trophy he just sounds more daft and desperate with each passing week

[Limerick Gooner]

Unfortunately we are in a sweet spot to win fuck all.

Decent enough at times but to win the league or European Cup you have to be the best. We are not even close.

Domestic cups are then the next best and he has no cup pedigree in recent seasons and this side has no killer to win clutch knock out ties.

That leads to the inevitable trophyless season year after year.

I don’t see us winning anything with him, unless we have an unprecedented Summer of recruitment. Which we clearly won’t.

[Bob Bayliss]

He has to go. No "unless he does this" bollocks. He has had all the time he needs.
Atrophy, but not a sniff of a trophy.

[madjens]

Credit for the work he has done, but needs taking down a peg or two with these comments lately. You’d think there would be a bit of humility given another a trophyless season for us and silverware for probably 5 of our rivals.

[IW8Goalmachine]

Ancelotti is free to take over

[augie]

He has to go. No "unless he does this" bollocks. He has had all the time he needs.
Atrophy, but not a sniff of a trophy.

Well said that man This nonsense suggesting that if he doesnt address our weaknesses in the summer he has to go - are we going to wait until September to sack him and then what kind of manager would we get then ? At the very latest I would fire him the morning after the southampton game, but there is an argument for sacking him before the season ends cos it sends out a very clear message to the players that we as a club are here to win and not to be nearly men whinging and blaming everyone else for our failures

[SteveO 35]

Its the owners and directors of a business that set the targets for success, but bizarrely in football these are never openly communicated. CEOs of major companies will state ambitious aims such as "we want to be the market leader in this", "our aim is to be a $x bn company by 2030" etc. At Arsenal we have an ownership structure that has been present for 14 years and has never been open and honest with its aims. They kept Wenger on a salary of £8m+ for years without winning anything major, just as long as the top 4 was nailed on. It was only when it wasn't for 2-3 successive years and they lost all that lovely CL lolly and related deals and became commercially outpaced, that Wenger was finally bulleted.

I say this because I see history repeating itself. Apparently we've made £120m out of this CL run and therefore the owners must be chuffed to bits. Realistically it looks like we'll stumble into the top 5 purely because others around us like Villa, Chavski and Forest (FFS!!) are falling over too.

We, the fans, have the ambition to win stuff. I very much doubt its a shared passion by the owners. Since the Kroenkes took full ownership in 2011 we've only won a smattering of FA Cups, and in 14 years can only list 2 credible PL title challenges, 1 CL semi final, and a couple of close knockings in the Europa League.

I don't disagree with anything anyone is saying about Arteta but I just don't see it happening. The Kroenkes have what they want

[Bob Bayliss]

There is one man who I believe is tailor-made to restore the Arsenal we knew and loved until 2006 or so, uncompromising and built on solid defensive foundations. Diego Simeone. Bearing in mind he has competed against the might and wealth of Barcelona and Real Madrid his record of 2 La Liga titles, 2 Europa League titles and a Copa Del Rey is impressive. GIven that we have recruited Atletico's Director of Football I would imagine there is a chance that we could persuade him to come. I would love to see the man in black prowling the touchline and winding up the opposition fans.

[SteveO 35]

Also to add to my previous post - his deal runs to 2027 so the chance of the Kroenke's paying 2 years of compensation to a guy who earned them £120m from CL football is absolutely zero! Stuck with him - very Wenger like sadly

[Limerick Gooner]

Also to add to my previous post - his deal runs to 2027 so the chance of the Kroenke's paying 2 years of compensation to a guy who earned them £120m from CL football is absolutely zero! Stuck with him - very Wenger like sadly

Have heard Arsenal are going to give him a new deal. Want him to extend to 2030. Seriously.

[Perryashburtongroves]

Also to add to my previous post - his deal runs to 2027 so the chance of the Kroenke's paying 2 years of compensation to a guy who earned them £120m from CL football is absolutely zero! Stuck with him - very Wenger like sadly

Have heard Arsenal are going to give him a new deal. Want him to extend to 2030. Seriously.

Here we go again. Constantly rewarding failure. Other clubs would pull the trigger this summer. We extend contracts and give pay rises to managers who achieve nothing. Watch another generation of managers arrive at other English clubs and win things whilst we go backwards. The fucking culture at thus club and the indulging of failure, is criminal.

[shu]

Again for me it comes back to the clusterfuck of the transfer last summer and winter. Like wtf , all eggs in Sescos basket and the krunt wanted to stay at Leipzig , like wtf. Was there really no other options. Anyone who thought Harvedtz and injury prone Jesus were ok needs looking at ffs. To sell Eddie the feather in possibly the last week of the summer window with no new signature , what happened there too ??

Then a half hearted attempt to buy Watkins, if they wanted him the deal needed to be done at the beginning of the window before they sold Duran. These are the questions a journalist needs to be asking.

Also pretty obvious ESR shouldnt have gone and would have played loads of games this season.

[SteveO 35]

Also to add to my previous post - his deal runs to 2027 so the chance of the Kroenke's paying 2 years of compensation to a guy who earned them £120m from CL football is absolutely zero! Stuck with him - very Wenger like sadly

Have heard Arsenal are going to give him a new deal. Want him to extend to 2030. Seriously.

Here we go again. Constantly rewarding failure. Other clubs would pull the trigger this summer. We extend contracts and give pay rises to managers who achieve nothing. Watch another generation of managers arrive at other English clubs and win things whilst we go backwards. The fucking culture at thus club and the indulging of failure, is criminal.

The common denominator here is the Kroenke ownership. Honestly, this is so Wenger-like now its becoming laughable. We'd frequently scratch our heads as to why we'd give him these 2-3 year contract extensions, but for the most part he kept the CL money rolling in, and wouldn't spend big. In return they'd pay him £8m-£10m a year. Nice cosy relationship. I'm convinced we're on the same path now. The only time they backed any of their managers with big funds was to get the club back in the CL after years of missing out or being in serious danger of missing out. All the while top 5 happens, 8 lovely CL games and virtually guaranteed at least the play offs and more likely round of 16.....its money money money. 60000 tourists paying top prices, 3 new kits a year plus special launches, bags of merch being paid for by those tourists etc. Its a money game and all the while Arteta feeds it, there will be no change. I always used to say Wenger would be here until it hurt them in the pocket, and that's exactly what happened. If he'd kept getting us top 4 or 5, I'm convinced he'd still be here now

[augie]

I argued way back in the cone boy's early day's that his reaction to the scuffle at brighton tell's us a lot about his mindset and will have negative influence on how he shapes the team in the future, and I think it is fair to say that it has panned out exactly like that. Yes the guendouzi incident with maupay was a bit lame tbh, but the cone boy's reaction to it was ott imo and send a (bad) clear message to the players too. In GG's time guendouzi might well have been given a pay rise for standing up for a team-mate like he did. In early wenger teams, TA6 and PV4 would have patted guendouzi on the back and given him advice on how to do what he did but a bit cuter so he wouldnt get caught. The cone boy's reaction was to ostracise guendouzi - he wanted a team of choir boys who play nice, and performances like last week against psg is exactly what you get from choir boys. Constant disappearing performances is what you get from a captain when said captain is a choir boy, and when your captain goes missing in the heat of the battle, how can you expect any different from the players following him ?

We have had years of manager's devaluing captaincy and leadership in general - in england more than any other country I would think, a player needs to be assessed by his courage and backs to the wall response, as much as he does by his technical ability. How many players in our squad can we count on to stand up and be counted in heat of the battle ? Very few I would say. They say that most teams are a mirror image of their manager and it certainly applies here - the cone boy has constantly shown an inability to stand up and drop a shockingly out of form captain, and he is showing the same lack of courage as his players, and sadly it is the same lack of courage that will be on display in the boardroom as they stand loyal to a manager that has spent almost £800m and struggling to get to 70pts