Dein - The Raven at Arsenal’s Tower of London? (1/8)

[gooner.ed]

http://www.onlinegooner.com/exclusive/index.php?id=373

usual thread starter – well, we simply don’t know if Stan Kroenke would saddle the club with further debt, so there are some assumptions being made in the article that we can’t know are true. However, as for David Dein, there are good and bad aspects to his tenure as an Arsenal director. There is no doubting of his passion for the Gunners, but let’s face it, if he cared more for the club than himself, he would have already urged his great pal Arsene to sign on for one further stint at the club. As is stands it appears he may be using Le Boss as part of his plans for a return to the club in league with Silent Stan.

[Cus Geezer]

Thank you Stuart Dyer.

It's about time we heared a voice on David Dein from someone on this site that wasn't in the manner of a porn slut reacting to the site of a 12incher.

[Cus Geezer]

The much vaunted (at the time) new North Stand had too few seats

The original idea was to link it up with the East and West stands wasn't it?

[U.F.G Anfield '89]

many fans wanted to see a takeover before it was suggested by dein, others also wanted to see a move to wembley. Just because he's wrong doesn't mean he isn't a fan.

porn slut reacting to the site of a 12incher.

Cus; Great line, kudos!

[stevenzgorac]

Hats off to the author.

A brilliantly constructed piece. And having been truncheoned on two occasions in my time during those peaceful demonstrations, it brought back a bunch of memories.

Dein might have brought us great football but at a serious price - he helped to create those ridiculous ticket prices, ungrateful players who really lack loyalty and the most pathetic atmospheres imaginable.

At last someone has been able to put this in writing. Many thanks.

[stats]

Yes i have the old yearbook of the plans but as we know it never happend thus the ammount of seats that were useless in the North Bnak & Clock End

[LB]

What is this about not knowing that Kroenke would add debt? Obviously he would. The only people who take money out of their pockets and do not need banks are people with dirty money from the East such as Thaksin and Abrmamovic. Americans do not do that because they do not use their own money, they use bank debt. The reasoning is simple, buying the club is a financial transaction for good retrusn, not for fun like the Russians. Therefore, the investment must pay off over time, which means getting a return of 20% plus on your money. Why is this difficult to grasp fro so many, including journalists? You would think they woud go ask someone at the banks how it works.

I like the article because it raises a question I have had for some time: What are Dein's motives really? Why did he oppose the move to Emirates? Why does he want the shareholders to sell? On both counts he is deadly wrong. And I say deadly because he could destroy the club with the wrong decision on both counts. He knows the club generates enough funds, and will generate even more in future without takeover debt risk, doesn't he? If he doesn't then he is more stupid than we all thought. If he does know then why is he doing this? For me, good riddance and I hope he rots wherever he is. Even Wenger does not agree with him, on both counts!!!!

[Sammy Mooner]

Anyone know a major shareholder of any football club who is not willing to make a few bob? Most of our current 'guardians' of the AFC shares are happy to claim to be fans - but are any of them? Hill-Wood sold his shares to Dein because in his words 'there was no money to be made in football'. Dein sold his to Fiszman when his day job went crock and Fiszman (our biggest shareholderr - so surely our biggest fan) will be playing with cow-bells up the Alps this season rather than watching 'his' team. They are all as bad as each other in this respect. That said would you want Fiszman or Hill-Wood or Edelman or Lady Nina to be in overall control of picking a new manager if Le Boss decides to jack it in?

I think that's why Dein is missed, that and the fact that he is the only one of them you'd ever see watching an Arsenal under 15's match in the pissing rain. He may not have come from the North Bank but he does have at least a vague clue about what's going on in the world of footie

[I Hate Hleb]

NOW I'M NOT A MEMBER OF THE 'DAVID DEIN IS GOD' CAMPAIGN GROUP, BUT THE WAY I SEE IT, THE WRITER OF THE ARTICLE'S ONLY VALID CRITICISM OF DEIN WAS THAT HE DIDN'T THINK THE 'ARSENAL BOND SCHEME' WAS NECESSARY.

YET, NO-ONE WAS BEING FORCED TO BUY ONE!! AND BY ALL ACCOUNTS, THOSE THAT DID - WHICH EXCLUDES ME I HASTEN TO ADD - HAVE MADE A GOOD RETURN ON THEIR INITIAL INVESTMENT IN TERMS OF CHEAPER SEAT PRICES (SOMEONE PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG ABOUT THAT).

THE AUTHOR ADMITS THAT ALL-SEATER STADIUMS WAS A 'FAIT ACCOMPLIE' AFTER THE TAYLOR REPORT, THEN COMPLAINS THAT DEIN DIDN'T DO ENOUGH TO STOP/DELAY IT!!

I AGREE, A LOT OF THE TRADITIONAL FANS NO LONGER CAN AFFORD TO COME AS REGULARLY AS BEFORE, IF AT ALL. AND THE ATMOSPHERE HAS DEFINATELY SUFFERED AS A RESULT. BUT IS THAT SOLEY DEIN'S FAULT? AND I THINK THE WRITER IS WEARING ROSE-TINTED GLASSES WITH REGARDS TO HOW THINGS 'USE TO BE LIKE' IN TERMS OF ATMOSPHERE AND ENJOYMENT OF THE MATCH DAY EXPERIENCE!

DAVID DEIN DEFINATELY HAS MADE MISTAKES - BEING AGAINST THE BUILDING OF THE NEW STADIUM AND THE KROENKE 'AMBUSH' AMONGST THEM - BUT TO SUGGEST THAT THE ONLY GOOD HE HAS DONE WAS BRING WENGER TO THE CLUB IS SHOWING IGNORANCE AND A LACK OF UNDERSTANDING AS TO ARSENAL'S POSITION IN ENGLISH FOOTBALL BEFORE HIS ARRIVAL.

LET ME REMIND THE AUTHOR THAT ARSENAL HAD SUFFERED OVER A DECADE OF MEDIOCRITY BEFORE DEIN JOINED, WITH ONLY ONE FA CUP WON AND EUROPEAN FOOTBALL ONLY ON THE ODD OCCASION. THE BOARD AT THE TIME HAD NO AMBITION AND NO INCLINATION TO MAKE US BETTER AND WERE HAPPY TO LIVE OFF ARSENAL'S FORMER GLORIES!

DAVID DEIN SOON CHANGED THAT MENTALITY BECAUSE HE WAS A FAN AND KNEW ARSENAL FOOTBALL CLUB DESERVED BETTER. HE BROUGHT GEORGE GRAHAM TO THE CLUB AND THAT WASN'T SUCH A BAD MOVE WAS IT? THEN HE SET ABOUT TAKING ARSENAL OUT OF THE 20TH CENTURY AND INTO THE 21ST IN TERMS OF FACILITIES.

YES, THERE WERE COCK-UPS WITH REGARDS THE DESIGN OF BOTH THE NEW NORTH BANK AND CLOCK-END. BUT AGAIN, WAS THAT ALL DOWN TO D.D.? WHAT ABOUT THE OTHER BOARD MEMBERS?

AND THEN, OF COURSE, WE HAVE ARSENE!! IT'S ALRIGHT QUICKLY BRUSHING OVER THAT ACHIEVEMENT BUT DOES ANYONE REALLY BELIEVE THAT THE ARSENAL BOARD WOULD HAVE COUNTERNANCED WENGER AS MANAGER HAD IT NOT BEEN AT THE BEHEST OF DEIN?

CAN YOU IMAGINE PETER HILL WOOD: 'WHAT - A BLOODY FOREIGNER THAT NO-ONE HAD HEARD OF AND CURRENTLY WORKING IN JAPAN? ARE YOU MAD, OLD BOY?'

THE AUTHOR OF THE ARTICLE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO COMPLAIN THAT SOME FANS ARE GOING OVERBOARD IN THEIR PRAISE OF DEIN, BUT
TO QUESTION HIS SUPPORT AND LOYALTY TO THE CLUB IS NAIVE AT BEST AND VINDICTIVE AT WORST.

OH YEAH, THE WRITER'S OTHER COMPLAINT WAS THAT THE CAMERAS WEREN'T ALLOWED TO FILM THE 'LAST STAND' OF THE OLD NORTH BANK REGULARS!!

IF THAT IS ALL THE BAD THAT DEIN HAS DONE, THEN I THINK THE BALANCE SHEET IS FIRMLY IN PROFIT AS FAR AS DAVID DEIN'S WORTH TO ARSENAL FOOTBALL CLUB IS CONCERNED.

I THINK MOST OF US WOULD AGREE THAT ARSENAL HAVE BEEN RATHER FORTUNATE TO HAVE HIM IN CHARGE, IN COMPARISON TO WHAT'S BEEN HAPPENING WITH DIRECTORS AT MOST OTHER FOOTBALL CLUBS.

[I Hate Hleb]

Thank you Stuart Dyer.

It's about time we heared a voice on David Dein from someone on this site that wasn't in the manner of a porn slut reacting to the site of a 12incher.

I RESENT THAT!! AN 8INCHER WILL DO ME FINE!!

[Cus Geezer]

NOW I'M NOT A MEMBER OF THE 'DAVID DEIN IS GOD' CAMPAIGN GROUP, BUT THE WAY I SEE IT, THE WRITER OF THE ARTICLE'S ONLY VALID CRITICISM OF DEIN WAS THAT HE DIDN'T THINK THE 'ARSENAL BOND SCHEME' WAS NECESSARY.

YET, NO-ONE WAS BEING FORCED TO BUY ONE!! AND BY ALL ACCOUNTS, THOSE THAT DID - WHICH EXCLUDES ME I HASTEN TO ADD - HAVE MADE A GOOD RETURN ON THEIR INITIAL INVESTMENT IN TERMS OF CHEAPER SEAT PRICES (SOMEONE PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG ABOUT THAT).

Well bully for them!

I'd like to remind you that when it was introduced Britain was undergoing its worst recession since the 30s, so guess who could and could not stump up the £1500 for a bond in 1991?

[I Hate Hleb]

WELL, I COULDN'T STUMP UP THE MONEY FOR A BOND BUT IT NEVER STOPPED ME FROM GOING!!

AND AGAIN, YOU HAD A CHOICE WHETHER TO BUY - AND WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT, THOSE PEOPLE HELPED THE CLUB PAY FOR THE NEW STAND

[Cus Geezer]

HE BROUGHT GEORGE GRAHAM TO THE CLUB AND THAT WASN'T SUCH A BAD MOVE WAS IT?

was he? I've not heard of any conclusive evidence to back this up.

In fact Don Howe was pushed out in a very un-Arsenal manner, as Arsenal were chasing a the very non-Arsenal Terry Venables, a Euro jet-setter that would have probably mixed in the same circles as DD.

Instead Arsenal chose old-boy GG, not a break with tradition there, as six of the previous seven managers were from within Arsenal circles.

GG also complained that certain directors were hanging out with players in nightclubs and undermining his authority, that's not likely to be Hill Wood and Ken Friar now is it?

[U.F.G Anfield '89]

Thank you Stuart Dyer.

It's about time we heared a voice on David Dein from someone on this site that wasn't in the manner of a porn slut reacting to the site of a 12incher.

I RESENT THAT!! AN 8INCHER WILL DO ME FINE!!

I've heard those rumors IHH.

[I Hate Hleb]

WELL U.F.G, ANYTHING MORE IS A WASTE!!