As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
g88ner wrote:You soon learn which posters are worth reading, and which aren't.
I good example is Augie, who has pretty extreme negative views, but I respect his view because its not knee jerk (he's been miserable since I joined 18months back! ) and is in fact pretty reasonable and not always easy to disagree with, to be honest.
At the other extreme is ****, who is a great chap but his opinions on Arsenal should be taken with a HUGE pinch of salt, as his stance changes as often as he changes his underwear (according to Flash )
There's many other very good posters, but you'll have to work that out for yourself!
(I'll give you a clue, though... I'm a good poster )
Yes, I'm sure you're right, it's the same in any forum, it just takes a bit of time to distinguish who is arguing from a position of knowledge and understanding and who is not.
But it just seems to me as a newcomer that there's a lot more venting on this forum after the defeat, trying to draw overall conclusions from a single painful situation, rather than trying to asses it soberly for what it is, in the overall conext of our long term future.
I Hate Hleb wrote:Depends what you mean by 'like this' tasha7?
Filled with kneejerk "the sky is falling" diatribes.
Just skimming through this forum and the Arsenal Facebook group, it just seems to me that there's more intelligent, rational post match analysis and discussion on the Facebook group and I never thought I'd ever hear myself use the words Facebook and "intelligent discussion" in the same sentence.
So what you're saying is that Facebook is full of rose-tinters!!
I Hate Hleb wrote:
So what you're saying is that Facebook is full of rose-tinters!!
Not at all, there's an even split of the posters whom I consider worth reading between a very few who think Wenger is untouchable, a very few who would sack him tomorrow and the vast majority who can see both sides of the argument. They understand that our self-imposed restraints have been forced on us in order to secure the long term future of the club over the next 50-60 years and that in the meantime, we're doing pretty well on the football pitch under the circumstances.
tasha7 wrote:
So what you're saying is that Facebook is full of rose-tinters!!
Not at all, there's an even split of the posters whom I consider worth reading between a very few who think Wenger is untouchable, a very few who would sack him tomorrow and the vast majority who can see both sides of the argument. They understand that our self-imposed restraints have been forced on us in order to secure the long term future of the club over the next 50-60 years and that in the meantime, we're doing pretty well on the football pitch under the circumstances.
Perhaps, but all I've noticed here today has been, "sack the board!", "sack Wenger!", "shoot Almunia!", none of which seems particularly appropriate or useful after a defeat in one of our most difficult away games of the season.
Perhaps, but all I've noticed here today has been, "sack the board!", "sack Wenger!", "shoot Almunia!", none of which seems particularly appropriate or useful after a defeat in one of our most difficult away games of the season.
Oi!! What about my 'look on the bright side' thread?
I Hate Hleb wrote:
Oi!! What about my 'look on the bright side' thread?
Sorry, I missed it amongst all the doommongering!
But, forgive me for saying so, but even your thread seems a bit of a reaction against the overreaction of the naysayers. Maybe I've just missed it, but I'd like to see some discussion about WHY things are going the way they are. You mention the defending in your thread and the fact we've conceded 6 goals in 2 games in Manchester, despite the addition of a CB who looks like a proper player and a change in formation designed to help the whole team defend from the front through midfield.
At least five of these goals can be attributed to stupid individual errors so we have to ask, did we just have a couple of bad days at the office or is there something else going on, something that can be quickly and easily rectified?
For example, I've read on another forum that Almunia recently suffered a bereavement and if this is true, it's no wonder his form is suffering and it's obviously a huge handicap for the team in these very tight matches against top opposition where the margins between victory and defeat are tiny.
You'll have to forgive me tasha but I haven't got the time at the moment to give a comprehensive answer to your last post as I have stuff to do, and it deserves one. However, if no-one else posts with stuff answering your question that I would have written, then I promise I'll give you one (ooh, err mrs!) tomorrow.
i dont think anybody outside the club can factually say whether its the board or arsene who are taking us backwards. if its arsene then he should go BUT if its the board and we get rid of our most successful manager of all time and replace him with whoever, what happens when the board restrict him from what he wants to do. if its the board then in my opinion losing wenger would be the worst thing possible because if the rumours are true that we hardly have any money then what he is doing is pretty good and if there is around £15mil transfer budget a season im not sure another manager would do better maybe even as god as wenger, but thats just if its the boards fault
Frankly I have been a fairly long term Wenger out person. I've always said I hope he proves me wrong but I don't expect him too.
He has continued over recent years to make strange decisions such as his refusal to offer the likes of bergkamp and pires anything more than 12 month contracts and then signs sylvestre on a 2 year contract.
I've yet to meet anyone who doesn't think we need some players with big game experience and some better defensive options. At the end of last season Wenger correctly highlighted the main difference between us and our rivals was the number of goals conceded. Does anyone think Wenger has solved that problem?
If he can see the problem and doesn't solve it then there is a serious problem. The man is too loyal to his current players. Almunia is another case it point. Personally I don't have as much of an issue with Almunia as a lot of other people, but there is no doubt we could do better. Last season Given became available at a price we could almost certainly afford. To my knowledge we never tried to sign him despite the fact he would have undoubtedly have improved our team.
For me, we are no longer going forward under Wenger and the notion that because he doesn't spend money he is protecting the long term future doesn't stand up either. If we fail to make champions league, then we are stuffed anyway. Our best players leave, revenue will decrease and attendances will drop.
I'm absolutely gutted about how it has worked out with Wenger, he will still be remembered as a great Arsenal manager but the longer he stays on the more he will tarnish his reputation amongst a decent proportion of the clubs fan base (unless he does turn it around of course!).
azz91 wrote:i dont think anybody outside the club can factually say whether its the board or arsene who are taking us backwards. if its arsene then he should go BUT if its the board and we get rid of our most successful manager of all time and replace him with whoever, what happens when the board restrict him from what he wants to do. if its the board then in my opinion losing wenger would be the worst thing possible because if the rumours are true that we hardly have any money then what he is doing is pretty good and if there is around £15mil transfer budget a season im not sure another manager would do better maybe even as god as wenger, but thats just if its the boards fault
But arent they all linked by a conspiracy against the fans by throwing bullshit after bullshit in our direction ?? To me the case against wenger goes further than just his refusal to spend - tactically he is at league 2 level and is far too loyal to sub-standard players who constantly under perform When is he going to look at diaby and actually realise that he is shit ?? When is he going to look at song and realise that he is nowhere near good enough or physical enough to play DM at this level ? When is he going to look at average al and realise that he is just average ? When is he going to look at ramsey and vela and give them a chance in the team cos they cant be any worse than diaby, denilson, bedtner on the wing etc etc ?? Finally when is he going to gid rid of this bullshit 4-5-1 formation that he likes to call 4-3-3 ? It clearly does not work and is killing rvp and arshavin especially
) and is in fact pretty reasonable and not always easy to disagree with, to be honest.
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