Rosicky "out for a while"

[augie]

It isnt about who is the better type of fan or anything like it - what he is saying though is that it makes no sense offering a bumper contract to any player who has missed a large chunk of every season since he has joined the club and to be fair he has a point. We all know that van persie's injury on this occasion wasnt something you could relate to his injury record but this discussion is about all our injury prone players history in general. What is wrong with putting an injury prone player on a pay as you play contract anyway ? The problem with brazilian sometimes is that he speaks as if everything is all rosy in the club in every aspect but the only thing realists and rosetinters are totally in agreement over is the financial situation in the club and offering pay as you play contracts are made for financial reasons first and foremost

[Rob]

No I would have taken a 'chance' with Van Persie as there is enough quality to justify his contract and it's just bad luck that he/we are stuffed in this instance.

Walcott on the other hand was an entirely different proposition and Wenger needs his brains testing handing him a five year deal at the rate he did, given the manifest absence of anything that comes close to justifying the sum involved.

It was said - before Ronaldo left - that our total wage bill was within 5% of Man Utd - a simply astonishing allegation given their obvious quality with proven players who win titles - Giggs, Scholes, Vidic, Ferdiand, Berbatov etc and our mob.

Given that we've also lost two high earners in Kolo and Addy, that presumably still holds. It indicates - if it's true - that we are paying title winning wages to players who haven't and still don't look like they ever will.

Given the fact that we charge the highest ticket prices in the Prem and the Prem is the dearest league in the world, I can well understand hard pressed Season Ticket Holders - of whom I am one - looking askance at the above figures.

[brazilianGOONER]

And Owen at Man Utd.If you dont play you dont get paid.

good idea, i'm sure rvp will accept that. and i'm sure there won't be other clubs knocking at the door offering him a full lenght normal contract to have the quality of rvp in their teams.

you do offer pay-as-you-play contracts to brilliant players like saha and owen, though, who nobody else wants in their teams

So you are happy that we pay a player £80k a week who will only play 50% of the season?.Its about time these over paid big time charlies earnt there money.And if another club in willing to pay them £4m a year good luck to them

yes i'm happy with his contract. i'm not happy with his injuries though, and i think the last one is not due to the fact that he is injury prone. i'm sure any player would've hurt his ankle in that tackle.

FFS you dont need to be Sherlock Fucking Holmes to know RVP is injury prone its not a secrect .Maybe BG if you were paying £1200 a year for a season ticket you would change your mind

unfortunetaly i can't have a season ticket, donaldo, i live too far away. i do play sky R$ 1.560 a year to watch our games live on television though, and that's almost a month wages for me. is £1200 a month of your hard work? if so, we are in the same situation. if you earn more than 1200 a month, well, i spend more to watch the arsenal than you do.

i don't think that the love for the club should be measured with how much we spend with it, though.

rvp is injury prone, but his last injury has nothing to do with it.

i don't mind giving rvp a big normal contract, and never will. he, along with fabregas, is our best player, and if i could i'd give him a 10 year contract on 100 thousand pounds a week.

[brazilianGOONER]

on a second note: if you guys think our wage bill is too big, and it probably is, i think we should actually dump the likes of diaby, almunia and eboué, who contribute little football-wise. not change the contracts of our players capable of magic.

[augie]

Rob I too would have taken a chance of sorts with rvp but, and there is no getting away from this, we are offering big new contracts to players who have a history of getting a high amount of injuries and where and when do you draw the line ? I am a huge fan of rosicky as a player but as an Arsenal fan I would be well pissed off if the club offered him a new contract of 2 years or more if it doesnt include some sort of pay as you play clause As you rightly pointed out it is an absolute disgrace that our wage bill is so high considering that we have a team who, with the exception of cesc and gallas (with the chavs), have won nothing for the club since arriving and many havent even done enough to justify still being at the club Personally I would much prefer holding off on giving improved contracts to players who have it all to prove and instead using that money to go towards bringing in proven quality players

[RNTGOONER]

i dont mind rvp being on good wages then getting injured as the class he has when fit is often match winning, but i think you can only have a couple of "gambles" like that in the squad

we now have rosicky, diaby, walcott, nasri, eduardo and rvp who seem unable to play many back to back games and thats without the opposition kicking them.


we seem to have a team worth of attacking players out all the time, no mention of clichy and B52 as they are normally not to bad with injury utill this season

[Rob]

Personally I would much prefer holding off on giving improved contracts to players who have it all to prove and instead using that money to go towards bringing in proven quality players

I agree. But the Club is dominated by an individual who spends 25% of the time in the real world and 75% of his time in his own little bubble, of denial and delusion. And having convinced himself that so many of these players have what it takes to win things, he can't/won't bring himself to see the contrary.

Still, having come this far, I will persevere. As I said before I'll hold off a final judgment until May 2010. That only seems fair and he'll have had 5 years - half a footballing lifetime - to prove his point.

If he has proved his case - I'll happily acknowledge it.

But if he hasn't.............then I won't hold back out of sympathy.

[MM99]

It isnt about who is the better type of fan or anything like it - what he is saying though is that it makes no sense offering a bumper contract to any player who has missed a large chunk of every season since he has joined the club and to be fair he has a point. We all know that van persie's injury on this occasion wasnt something you could relate to his injury record but this discussion is about all our injury prone players history in general. What is wrong with putting an injury prone player on a pay as you play contract anyway ? The problem with brazilian sometimes is that he speaks as if everything is all rosy in the club in every aspect but the only thing realists and rosetinters are totally in agreement over is the financial situation in the club and offering pay as you play contracts are made for financial reasons first and foremost

of course he has a point, i understand the frustration at our top earners being injured, but there is no need for the 'i pay this much for a season ticket and therefore understand the situation better than you'.

secondly, i expected more of you augie on the pay as you play part. surely you do realise that top players who are playing for a top four side would not agree to such terms. take a second to think properly about this, are you honestly telling me that if we were to release v.persie (for arguments sake) that no other club would come in with a contract as good as what we give him now? do you really believe that no other club will give him more or less the same contract he has now? i personally dont believe that and so in the real world a pay as you play contract wouldnt work for people like v.persie. i know you can use michael owen as an example, but if you think about it he was in a completely different situation, his club was getting relegated, he was faced with the prospect of playing in the championship, he had been flaunting himself and no club was interested, and he HAD to make do with what was offered. i dont think v.persie comes in the same category as that.

[donaldo]

Never once did i say because you buy a season ticket you have more right to have a say about the club as someone who doesnt.In fact i gave up my season ticket 2 years ago because of the cost.I wish i had one but cant afford it.But to turn around and say the decision to give RVP and Walcott long term contracts with their injury records wasnt madness is just being as blinkered as Wenger.
Last year our wage bill was just a million less than Man Utd a staggering figure when you think about the relative success of both teams in recent years.We are giving long term contract to players with the hope that those players play 50% of the games.

[g88ner]

But to turn around and say the decision to give RVP and Walcott long term contracts with their injury records wasnt madness is just being as blinkered as Wenger.

I know Van Persie is clearly injury prone, but I can totally understand why he was given a new contract over the summer, so I won't criticise Wenger for that!

However, I wrote a post at the start of last season (which Wenger clearly didn't read! ) that NEVER AGAIN should injuries to Van Persie, Rosicky and Eduardo be allowed to derail our season, because it's so fucking obvious that these lot will get injuries that we should build a squad ASSUMING all 3 (+ Theo & Diaby) will miss large chunks of the season, as that seems to be what they do best

I'm amazed that Wenger has said we're short in attack, because really we're only missing Van Persie, as Bendtner & Eduardo will be back in a week or 2, and we have Vela, too. Now, I think we DO need a striker, but surely if Wenger felt that only Van Persie was good enough to lead the line for us, then why the fuck did he not think of this over the summer when he sold Adebayor and chose not to replace him??? bizarre.

It's these gambles that Wenger takes in relying so heavily on injury prone players that seems to keep biting us on the ass every season, and it's becoming all too predictable now.

[marcengels]

But to turn around and say the decision to give RVP and Walcott long term contracts with their injury records wasnt madness is just being as blinkered as Wenger.

I know Van Persie is clearly injury prone, but I can totally understand why he was given a new contract over the summer, so I won't criticise Wenger for that!

However, I wrote a post at the start of last season (which Wenger clearly didn't read! ) that NEVER AGAIN should injuries to Van Persie, Rosicky and Eduardo be allowed to derail our season, because it's so fucking obvious that these lot will get injuries that we should build a squad ASSUMING all 3 (+ Theo & Diaby) will miss large chunks of the season, as that seems to be what they do best

I'm amazed that Wenger has said we're short in attack, because really we're only missing Van Persie, as Bendtner & Eduardo will be back in a week or 2, and we have Vela, too. Now, I think we DO need a striker, but surely if Wenger felt that only Van Persie was good enough to lead the line for us, then why the fuck did he not think of this over the summer when he sold Adebayor and chose not to replace him??? bizarre.

It's these gambles that Wenger takes in relying so heavily on injury prone players that seems to keep biting us on the ass every season, and it's becoming all too predictable now.

How many people were saying that over the summer? To rely on a set of strikers injury-prone, unproved, untested, etc...was just nuts. Wenger has to shoulder the responsibility, given that as you say he had the funds and all he could do was make half-hearted attempts to get that guy from Bordeaux for £6.99.

[augie]

It isnt about who is the better type of fan or anything like it - what he is saying though is that it makes no sense offering a bumper contract to any player who has missed a large chunk of every season since he has joined the club and to be fair he has a point. We all know that van persie's injury on this occasion wasnt something you could relate to his injury record but this discussion is about all our injury prone players history in general. What is wrong with putting an injury prone player on a pay as you play contract anyway ? The problem with brazilian sometimes is that he speaks as if everything is all rosy in the club in every aspect but the only thing realists and rosetinters are totally in agreement over is the financial situation in the club and offering pay as you play contracts are made for financial reasons first and foremost

of course he has a point, i understand the frustration at our top earners being injured, but there is no need for the 'i pay this much for a season ticket and therefore understand the situation better than you'.

secondly, i expected more of you augie on the pay as you play part. surely you do realise that top players who are playing for a top four side would not agree to such terms. take a second to think properly about this, are you honestly telling me that if we were to release v.persie (for arguments sake) that no other club would come in with a contract as good as what we give him now? do you really believe that no other club will give him more or less the same contract he has now? i personally dont believe that and so in the real world a pay as you play contract wouldnt work for people like v.persie. i know you can use michael owen as an example, but if you think about it he was in a completely different situation, his club was getting relegated, he was faced with the prospect of playing in the championship, he had been flaunting himself and no club was interested, and he HAD to make do with what was offered. i dont think v.persie comes in the same category as that.

MM99 if I am honest this whole players wages thing leaves me often in no mans land Unlike most I dont have a real problem with the massive wages players take him nowadays but I do have a problem with the way it is structured and this has been my feeling for years now. I believe that players should get a reasonable (for a pro footballer of course) basic wage at the top clubs of say 20k-30k per week but then it could be topped up significantly by win bonuses, goal bonuses, clean sheets etc. This theory/plan would of course tie in nicely with a pay as you play contract and players who are continually injured should be def considered for such contracts. Of course this would never happen cos it would have to entail universal implementation and of course we know that there are far too many supposed corrupt people in the game worldwide (moggi, twitch ) to play by any rules

In the ordinary working man's world if you are continually absent from work then you are far more likely to get your p45 than a massive wage increase dont you think ? Yes players can get struck down with injuries from tackles like rvp has done but what I am talking about is these continued muscular problems (hamstring, groin etc) that dont seem to be clearing up and maybe they never will All the while we are paying wages to players who are contributing nothing and we may as well be pissing the money away Given wenger's supposed expertise in economics I would have thought that he of all people should see the negative effect this can have on any business