Fulham's Stockdale Injured - Schwarzer deal definitely off?

[SammyDroppedHisShorts]

Augie

I agree with what you say totally, but the bare faced truth is that at 6:01 pm tomorrow evening we may have Manuel Almunia as the Arsenal number one. Therefore, its imperative we back him because berating him like we have and i mean ALL of us, is not going to be contusive to winning games of football. I dont like this situation anymore than you do, but if as you put it Wenger hasnt saved our season by 6:00pm tomorrow, we really cannot ultimately believe winning the title will be a nonsense because of Almunia.....

I just want what we all want, but we wont get that will we?

So its time to back the guy....even if we dont want to

[QuartzGooner]

Are you really that confident in our situation. After all you yourself have us pegged for fourth. If that's the best we can do what if something goes wrong? I think you - like our Board underestimate the riskiness of their policy and are unprepared for what happens if it fails - like our Board.
You just hope it doesn't - like our Board.

Man, you are working yourself up into a frenzy again.
Rabid accusations of me being a "Board Apologist", in your eyes tantamount to being named Damien and having three sixes on my scalp.

I no more want to finish fifth than any other fan.
I have repeatedly posted saying that we are very much "Cutting it fine" with regard to how many and what quality of players we buy.

I badly want a new goalkeeper, defensive midfielder and now a striker too, (since news of RvP's injury).

I just believe Wenger is responsible for us being non competitive in the title race, as much as the board.

I logically explained why all those players you listed were not sold to save money.

And as for you questioning whether or not I heard something off a player, just remember that I have lived and worked in London all my life, so if I or any other Londoner Forum poster have talked to a player it is far from a "remarkable" event.

I do not believe that one season of fifth place will destroy the club, though it would make it tougher to qualify for the fourth the following season, of course it would.
But reckon with this, that despite most of our fears, and forum posts, and all of our so called knowledge of the club, the fact is that Arsenal have never finished lower than fourth since Wenger took over.

[USMartin]

Are you really that confident in our situation. After all you yourself have us pegged for fourth. If that's the best we can do what if something goes wrong? I think you - like our Board underestimate the riskiness of their policy and are unprepared for what happens if it fails - like our Board.
You just hope it doesn't - like our Board.

Man, you are working yourself up into a frenzy again.
Rabid accusations of me being a "Board Apologist", in your eyes tantamount to being named Damien and having three sixes on my scalp.

I’m in a frenzy now? How about that? Who knew? That’s news to me because I’m actually in a pretty mellow mood. Are you sure you’re not just trying to deliberately mis-cast me and my behavior to discredit my views? After all it wouldn’t be the first time you tried that.

I no more want to finish fifth than any other fan.
I have repeatedly posted saying that we are very much "Cutting it fine" with regard to how many and what quality of players we buy.

I badly want a new goalkeeper, defensive midfielder and now a striker too, (since news of RvP's injury).

I just believe Wenger is responsible for us being non competitive in the title race, as much as the board.

So what exactly could the man do differently under the current budget situation? Seriously what can he do differently? Tell us what he can do differently, because I don’t believe he can do anything differently because he lacks a Board willing to invest in doing differently and I don’t think anyone can honestly deny that. And if they do they certainly can’t prove that is not the case and won’t try because they no they can’t prove otherwise and what that means.

I logically explained why all those players you listed were not sold to save money.

Several of your explanations are unsubstantiated and the only proof you have as your desire to believe tham.

And as for you questioning whether or not I heard something off a player, just remember that I have lived and worked in London all my life, so if I or any other Londoner Forum poster have talked to a player it is far from a "remarkable" event.

I do not believe that one season of fifth place will destroy the club, though it would make it tougher to qualify for the fourth the following season, of course it would.
But reckon with this, that despite most of our fears, and forum posts, and all of our so called knowledge of the club, the fact is that Arsenal have never finished lower than fourth since Wenger took over.

But do you believe for the record that given the circumstances that it would only be one season. And yes answer yes or no. Only because if you believe it would only be one season than you must expect us to break the bank to keep our players or replace them because that’s exactly what we’ll have to do - and even them if we break the bank to replace three or four key players leaving then all we’ve done is break the bank to stop falling further back.

So why do you believe it would only be one season and if you doubt that it would be then why should we not be far more worried about this?

- Oh and stating the obvious once in awhile is hardly proof of anyone's objectivity

[brazilianGOONER]

I am - but I don't listen to him!!! Now that would be stupid!!!

oh, ok

[QuartzGooner]

Are you sure you’re not just trying to deliberately mis-cast me and my behavior to discredit my views? After all it wouldn’t be the first time you tried that.

I have not tried to deliberately discredit your personage, but I and others had questions about your sincerity based on your high frequency of anti-board posting and the intensity of anti-board feeling contained in your posts.
I think you are a genuine poster, but far from a typical poster for reasons stated above.

I just believe Wenger is responsible for us being non competitive in the title race, as much as the board.

So what exactly could the man do differently under the current budget situation? Seriously what can he do differently? Tell us what he can do differently, because I don’t believe he can do anything differently because he lacks a Board willing to invest in doing differently and I don’t think anyone can honestly deny that.

Wenger has made mistakes:

He should have retained Pires.

He could have sold Diaby and Denilson, two sub standard players who command wages out of proportion to their talent.

He should sell Vela, Randall, Traore and Fabianski and invest in a defensive midfielder to help out Song.

He should have bought a better goalkeeper.

He should have played Arshavin versus Chelsea at Wembley (though if Arshavin was carrying a non-disclosed injury it would explain his appearance only as a sub).

He should have brought in a striker on loan in January 2009 when we had an injury crisis, if funds were short the he should have sold Diaby.

I logically explained why all those players you listed were not sold to save money.

Several of your explanations are unsubstantiated and the only proof you have as your desire to believe tham.

I consider my explanations to be better informed and more accurate than yours.
How can you honestly suggest Silvestre was not offered a new contract to save money?
How can you suggest we sold Henry to save money, when he had already been given half his wages up front in a unique (and I would suggest ridiculous) re-signing sweetener in 2006?

I do not believe that one season of fifth place will destroy the club, though it would make it tougher to qualify for the fourth the following season, of course it would.
But reckon with this, that despite most of our fears, and forum posts, and all of our so called knowledge of the club, the fact is that Arsenal have never finished lower than fourth since Wenger took over.

But do you believe for the record that given the circumstances that it would only be one season. And yes answer yes or no.

I think one season of fifth place or below would not mean many seasons out of the Champions League, because the club would spend in order to fight for fourth place the next season.

[USMartin]

Are you sure you’re not just trying to deliberately mis-cast me and my behavior to discredit my views? After all it wouldn’t be the first time you tried that.

I have not tried to deliberately discredit your personage, but I and others had questions about your sincerity based on your high frequency of anti-board posting and the intensity of anti-board feeling contained in your posts.
I think you are a genuine poster, but far from a typical poster for reasons stated above.

I just believe Wenger is responsible for us being non competitive in the title race, as much as the board.

So what exactly could the man do differently under the current budget situation? Seriously what can he do differently? Tell us what he can do differently, because I don’t believe he can do anything differently because he lacks a Board willing to invest in doing differently and I don’t think anyone can honestly deny that.

Wenger has made mistakes:

He should have retained Pires.

He could have sold Diaby and Denilson, two sub standard players who command wages out of proportion to their talent.

He should sell Vela, Randall, Traore and Fabianski and invest in a defensive midfielder to help out Song.

He should have bought a better goalkeeper.

He should have played Arshavin versus Chelsea at Wembley (though if Arshavin was carrying a non-disclosed injury it would explain his appearance only as a sub).

He should have brought in a striker on loan in January 2009 when we had an injury crisis, if funds were short the he should have sold Diaby.

You make some valid points, but they are undermined by one basic reality – the lack of financial support from the Board you both acknowledge and defend.
A more realistic question is could he actually have done anything differently with the financial constraints clearly placed upon him?

And you should answer this question after all earlier today you acknowledged his successor would have to work with the same financial restrictions imposed by the Board as you acknowledge in the foreseeable future.

Which not only raises the question of whether Arsene Wenger actually could have done differently, but whether any new manager could do any differently without a major policy shift by our Board.

Do you deny that you have said that and if not do you genuinely believe any other manager could have done any differently with the resources - or more importantly could any other manger have done more successfully?

[USMartin]

I logically explained why all those players you listed were not sold to save money.

Several of your explanations are unsubstantiated and the only proof you have as your desire to believe tham.

I consider my explanations to be better informed and more accurate than yours.
How can you honestly suggest Silvestre was not offered a new contract to save money?
How can you suggest we sold Henry to save money, when he had already been given half his wages up front in a unique (and I would suggest ridiculous) re-signing sweetener in 2006?

Where have I suggested Silvestre was let go as a money saving measure? That is disingenuous because you knowingly chose Silvestre rather than either Gallas or Campbell who we know at the end of the day were financially driven decisions. The point about Silvestre is that he was one of four central defenders leaving in the same year because again our slavish devotion to cost-cutting made the team’s best interests secondary to our board.


But you know as well as I do that the central defenders in question are in fact Gallas and Campbell yet you mention Silvestre – funny that.

By the way what are your other sources – the bloggers? The same ones you believe know more about what actually happened with Ashley Cole than the Premier League investigation turned up?


I think you base everything on what you want to believe more than actual fact because you rarely if ever present actual varifiable information. So as far as I know most of your explanations are unproven at best.

I may be wrong ultimately and you certainly want to believe I am wrong but I try to at least verify anything that I can. Indeed I have to because no one – myself included – wants to believe what I believe. But I am not willing to present information I know to be untrue or cannot verify is true as fact.

You hold my case to a higher standard of proof. I think your case ought to be as well. You should have to provide evidence to support your claims as well. Since you are so sure of them being true that should be no problem, right?

[USMartin]

I do not believe that one season of fifth place will destroy the club, though it would make it tougher to qualify for the fourth the following season, of course it would.
But reckon with this, that despite most of our fears, and forum posts, and all of our so called knowledge of the club, the fact is that Arsenal have never finished lower than fourth since Wenger took over.

But do you believe for the record that given the circumstances that it would only be one season. And yes answer yes or no.

I think one season of fifth place or below would not mean many seasons out of the Champions League, because the club would spend in order to fight for fourth place the next season.

If they did either they would be risking bankrupting the club as you suggest is the true concern and behind the lack of spending that "we simply have to accept" for the next several years as you once said – or they would have to admit not only were they holding back on spending but had deliberately mis-led the supporters and public to that effect, and could even open themselves up to legal questions about stock manipulation. Whatever the case the Board would lose virtually all of the support it has at this point, or at the very least would never be trusted or admired the same way again.

And given the deal they made with Theirry Henry to avoid losing him ahead of opening their first season at the Emirates Stadium, which clearly would have taken the gloss off the new stadium once and for all, the Board aren't always smart when it comes to trying to protect themselves from criticsm about their policies and their impact on the club. So I'm not sure what they would do in that event because they could face as much criticism for actually spending the money as if they don't and could lose every bit of credibility they do still have.

[USMartin]

I have not tried to deliberately discredit your personage, but I and others had questions about your sincerity based on your high frequency of anti-board posting and the intensity of anti-board feeling contained in your posts.
I think you are a genuine poster, but far from a typical poster for reasons stated above.

I thought I ‘d answer this seperately

I am not anti-Board. I am pro-Arsenal Football Club. I think this comment you made as I have suggested earlier shows you cannot distinguish between the Arsenal Board and Arsenal Football Club even when there is strong evidence suggesting the former may be deliberately acting in their own best interests against the best interests of the latter.

I have stated I would rather have seen the current Board collect dividends provided they do not come at the expense of investment in the football team which should not have to happen, than new ownership take over with no connection to the club or interest in it as other than an investment.

The problem is the current Board has evolved its view and now it appears looks at the club solely as an investment to make maximum profit from with no regard for the consequences to the club. That is what I am against

[Percy Dalton]

Am I the only one who finds it very depressing that the possible signing of Mark Schwarzer is such a talking point?

Although I agree it is needed, I really cannot be fucked either way.

How the mighty have fallen is all I can think.

[Charlie! Charlie!]

Am I the only one who finds it very depressing that the possible signing of Mark Schwarzer is such a talking point?

Although I agree it is needed, I really cannot be fucked either way.

How the mighty have fallen is all I can think.

+1

[digger]

Another +1 here.

In the next 9.5 hours ,I'm hoping to see a slightly bigger name keeper get signed. Schwarzer isn't significantly better than Almunia - in fact, they're both "ok", and rather partial to the occasional clanger.

[MutleyGooner]

Am I the only one who finds it very depressing that the possible signing of Mark Schwarzer is such a talking point?

Although I agree it is needed, I really cannot be fucked either way.

How the mighty have fallen is all I can think.

+1

Very sad state of affairs to see so many believing that MS is a significant improvement on average Al, just shows how low we have set the standard

[QuartzGooner]

Where have I suggested Silvestre was let go as a money saving measure? That is disingenuous because you knowingly chose Silvestre rather than either Gallas or Campbell who we know at the end of the day were financially driven decisions. The point about Silvestre is that he was one of four central defenders leaving in the same year because again our slavish devotion to cost-cutting made the team’s best interests secondary to our board.


But you know as well as I do that the central defenders in question are in fact Gallas and Campbell yet you mention Silvestre – funny that.

I do not have time to go through your points one by one, I am at work.

The above shows that you are insistent on argument for argument's sake.

YOU mention Silvestre in your list of players let go because of financial concerns.

Not me. YOU brought it up.

So all I did was respond to that.
I also took time and trouble to list all those players (including Gallas and Campbell and Senderos), showing why all but two had valid footballing and personal reasons to leave, unconnected with finance.

Quite why you chose to go over already dealt with points on a Forum is beyond me, but it makes any attempt at having a reasoned progressive discussion with you very very hard indeed.

[the playing mantis]

us, how do you know all this, you know the same as everyone else.

its all guess work and circumstantisl evidence