Mr Wenger at todays press conference

As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
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Boomer
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Post by Boomer »

Usm. I cant post much as im on my phone. The problem is no one knows whats going on, not you or i. Peoples issues with you is that you have your theory, but thats all it is a theory. You then force this theory onto the forum which rubs most of us. However its common knowledge in football circles that Wenger has bid for players. Even the board has publically told us theres money their for Arsene. A bid for Reina around £20m, the famous bid for Alonso which was short by 500k (?) also not wanting to buy Chamakh early, reportedly £8m but Aw only bid £3m! In the short few years we have bought and large amounts. Nasri was a £12m fee, not forgetting aa23s £15m+ saga. Even tv5 and Kos did not come cheap. So on that evidence there was and is money. So how do you explain that if the board are not supposed to be giving money? Also what evidence do you have that Aw's being denied the funds?

k.lertpisitkul
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Post by k.lertpisitkul »

I really do not give a shit if Arsene wengers have the funds or not . Its all down to his mentality from : "Would you swap winning the FA Cup for playing in the Champions League? " . And that has affected the players because they now know that securing fourth spot in the premier league is as good a success as winning any trophies . To conclude , we will not win anything as long as wenger is at helm . No winners will want to join this club so we can all forget about Trophy signings as heard on the podcast to lift the players and the supporters and the club , because it ain't ever gonna come.


Whether Wenger is still a tactician or not is debatable but i also do not give a shit about that debate because no matter how good he got his tactics right , His attitude and the players attittute is too laughable to even execute anything . The longer this goes on , the closer we are to being the Ajax of english football .

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perry groves was a legend
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Post by perry groves was a legend »

Arseblog was absolutely spot on about this situation today in his blog.

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FrenchGun
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Post by FrenchGun »

I don't read neither listen to Arsene interviews anymore. I used to do it but as it is happenning here, most of his comments makes you want to slap him!

I'll let the players do the talking on the pitch tomorrow... If ever they can that is!

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Henry Norris 1913
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Post by Henry Norris 1913 »

perry groves was a legend wrote:Arseblog was absolutely spot on about this situation today in his blog.
blogs :augie:

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dvbrisgooner1
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Post by dvbrisgooner1 »

Henry Norris 1913 wrote:
perry groves was a legend wrote:Arseblog was absolutely spot on about this situation today in his blog.
blogs :augie:

What's wrong with a blog? It's only someone giving their opinion on things - just like people do on a forum.

:roll:

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Henry Norris 1913
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Post by Henry Norris 1913 »

dvbrisgooner1 wrote:
Henry Norris 1913 wrote:
perry groves was a legend wrote:Arseblog was absolutely spot on about this situation today in his blog.
blogs :augie:

What's wrong with a blog? It's only someone giving their opinion on things - just like people do on a forum.

:roll:
:lol: agreed. ask flash :wink:

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augie
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Post by augie »

Should we be more embarassed for wenger at these comments or more embarassed for us Gooners ? :oops: :oops: :oops:

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LeGinge (Northern Branch)
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Post by LeGinge (Northern Branch) »

Rugby Gooner wrote:
USMartin wrote:
mcdowell42 wrote:Nobody likes you marty you are longwinded boring repetitive sad deluded man.
Many don't like me - maybe even most.
I like you Martin. I might not always agree with you,but I like you,because you care about our club enough to raise issues and concerns that sometimes take a while to read,but need to be read. :barscarf:
What he says, Marty.

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USMartin
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Post by USMartin »

Boomer wrote:Usm. I cant post much as im on my phone. The problem is no one knows whats going on, not you or i. Peoples issues with you is that you have your theory, but thats all it is a theory. You then force this theory onto the forum which rubs most of us. However its common knowledge in football circles that Wenger has bid for players. Even the board has publically told us theres money their for Arsene. A bid for Reina around £20m, the famous bid for Alonso which was short by 500k (?) also not wanting to buy Chamakh early, reportedly £8m but Aw only bid £3m! In the short few years we have bought and large amounts. Nasri was a £12m fee, not forgetting aa23s £15m+ saga. Even tv5 and Kos did not come cheap. So on that evidence there was and is money. So how do you explain that if the board are not supposed to be giving money? Also what evidence do you have that Aw's being denied the funds?
It's funny how you say we don't know what's going on then act excatly the opposite way.

As the Board saying money is available - if it is not spent but they back that non-spending 100% can you actually believe that? We know there is money but do we know that its actually available. There is the whole matter of the wage structure which the Premier League's report on Ashley Cole shows rests with the Arsenal Board, and that precludes attempting to sign bigger players more often than not Arsene Wenger confirmed as much noting that the higher fees you pay the higher the wages, something Ivan Gazidis has pointed out in stating the club is more concerned with limiting the wage bill than anything else, though he doesn't explain how overpaying underexperiemnced underperformers which he acknowledges we are doing now keeps the wage bill down.

That's because it doesn't it just eliminates not signing more expensive transfers. The fact is if Denilson is on 30K a week instead of 50K and Cesc Fabregas on 100K instead of 80K that is still spending 130K for those two but makes signing new players for 80-100K a week more likely and that means spending more on transfer fees, and creates greater pressure to actually do that both inside and outside the club.

So underpaying your top players and overpaying your lesser players avoids the issue. Better players will bypass Arsenal automatically so you can say we are willing to spend big knowing you will never have to prove it, then a few leaked and unsubstantiated stories (notice how there is not one instance of the Board pressing the manager to actually sppend anything more, and how today even Peter Hill-Wood is declaring war on the supporters to portect this manager) back up that you have money but there is no evidence of it actually being available to spend or any desire to see it spent.

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USMartin
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Post by USMartin »

LeGinge (Northern Branch) wrote:
Rugby Gooner wrote:
USMartin wrote:
mcdowell42 wrote:Nobody likes you marty you are longwinded boring repetitive sad deluded man.
Many don't like me - maybe even most.
I like you Martin. I might not always agree with you,but I like you,because you care about our club enough to raise issues and concerns that sometimes take a while to read,but need to be read. :barscarf:
What he says, Marty.
Cheers LeGinge :barscarf:

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Herd
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CHOKEY ALERT

Post by Herd »

mikeyb772001 wrote:please stop with the fucking board talk

You hijak every thread mate.
Here comes chokey telling other people what to do what to say and how to think .
Its hardly a wonder that people want to slap him when they see him in real life ,and not just because of the shit he writes about Wenger being to blame for his bed wetting is it.
You and Henry should get on well, sanctimonious smuggies the pair.

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Henry Norris 1913
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Re: CHOKEY ALERT

Post by Henry Norris 1913 »

Herd wrote:
mikeyb772001 wrote:please stop with the fucking board talk

You hijak every thread mate.
Here comes chokey telling other people what to do what to say and how to think .
Its hardly a wonder that people want to slap him when they see him in real life ,and not just because of the shit he writes about Wenger being to blame for his bed wetting is it.
You and Henry should get on well, sanctimonious smuggies the pair.
I never call people out on their opinions but how they're expressed. Martin has posted 2000 times about the same thing so forgive us for crying when he mentions the "b word" as it causes lots of tedious illogical arguments .
If you want to take part in an adult discussion stop throwing around petty insults 8) :wink: :barscarf:

kgw129
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Post by kgw129 »

USMartin wrote:Fair enough I welcome an honestly posed challenge, KGW

I think the problem here to those who suppose this is solely down to the manager's failings and that these failing didn't just appear after 2006 - they were there as far back as 1997 for all to see. The reason they didn't matter so much is because the quality of the team was vastly superior throughout that period. The subsitutions were every bit as predictable - even more so than now in certain seasons, the lack of tactical variety and flexibility was every bit as visible and obvious, the lack of a plan B every bit as costly, the poor set-piece play(albeit at the offensive end then) was clear to any Gooner.

Again the difference between Arsene Wenger then and now was the talent he first inherited then built on and ultimately re-bulit himself between 1998-2005 was vastlty superior in terms of proven talent and experience, and this was because of greater ambition showen by the Club the Manager and the Board, both in terms of transfer spending and in terms of the wage structure.

From 1998-2005 with the more ambitious spending we won the Premier League Three Times and never finished below second, won the FA Cup four times , and we reached the Final five times and the Semi-Final seven times. Oh and we won the Double twice

HOWEVER,

From since 2006 - now with less ambitious transfer spending and a flatter less intelligent wage structure.
we have not won the Premier League at all, and have yet to finish better than third and have not won the FA Cup and only reached one Semi-Final.[/b]


So there is a clear connection here supported by history between the level of spending and the level of achievement of Arsene Wenger's teams at Arsenal. Does that mean it is the only problem or even the main problem? Not necessarily. But that alone is more evidence really than anyone here has offered really to his point that it may be a critcial factor to consider from here.
Agreed the failings were there as far back as 1997 and they did not just appear overnight. However in my opinion, as you also allude to, his early success had an awful lot to do with what he inherited in terms of the back four from the George Graham team, with their excellent defensive organisation, which is precisely the element of a successful team that Wenger is unable to put together himself regardless of how much he has to spend. I would argue that although the attacking players of Wenger's early years were obviously exceptional, the attacking players at his disposal now, with the likes of Van Persie, Arshavin, Nasri certainly have the potential at least to be not far behind (if only Wenger could motivate Arshavin). It is the defence where the main difference lies and it is the main difference between the success of the early years, when he inherited a great defence and the lack of success now, when he has to put together a defence himself, rather than how much Wenger does or does not spend in my opinion.

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USMartin
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Re: CHOKEY ALERT

Post by USMartin »

Henry Norris 1913 wrote:
Herd wrote:
mikeyb772001 wrote:please stop with the fucking board talk

You hijak every thread mate.
Here comes chokey telling other people what to do what to say and how to think .
Its hardly a wonder that people want to slap him when they see him in real life ,and not just because of the shit he writes about Wenger being to blame for his bed wetting is it.
You and Henry should get on well, sanctimonious smuggies the pair.
I never call people out on their opinions but how they're expressed. Martin has posted 2000 times about the same thing so forgive us for crying when he mentions the "b word" as it causes lots of tedious illogical arguments .
If you want to take part in an adult discussion stop throwing around petty insults 8) :wink: :barscarf:
It may be tedious or boring 1913 but that doesn't mean that it isn't deadly important.

There is nothing to be gained from defining success as whatever you declare it to be. In fact many supporters who want to believe there are simple answers to these complicated questions and easy solutions to every serious problems are guilty of the very same thing.

Just because we want to believe that there is an an easy answer that we can see just like that, doesn't mean we have the right answer no matter how badly our desire to believe that is the case may be.

And that matters because if push for the wrong thing the consequences could be devastating - or worse even - for years to come.

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