Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

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Who Was The Greatest Arsenal Manager?

1.Herbert Chapman
24
41%
2.George Graham
17
29%
3.Arsene Wenger
18
31%
 
Total votes: 59

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I Hate Hleb
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Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by I Hate Hleb »

I've been thinking about this subject for a few weeks now but am much too lazy to write a deeply analytical article about it, so instead have decided to pose the question on here (and maybe someone might be more motivated to do a proper piece on it).

The modern day consensus seems to be that Arsene Wenger is the greatest manager that the club have ever had. A lot of that is due to his early success and of course the incredible 'Invincibles' season. However, there are some gooners - including myself - that still find it difficult to accept this, especially given all the weakness that we think the frenchman has shown in his managerial make-up. So, trying to think about this dispassionately, what should be the criteria for fairly judging who has indeed been the best manager in Arsenal's history?

There are the obvious ones like trophies won/achievements; successful signings; tactical acumen, etc, but are there other things that should also be taken into consideration like:

improvement in the club's position relative to when they took over;
the trophies won in relation to the time period in charge;
Players brought through;
relationship with the fans;
style of football;
fulfillment of task given the tools/finances at the manager's disposal and in terms of what they could/should have achieved given the prevailing conditions;
their lasting Legacy and maybe the state they left the team/club in when they finished?

Having come up with the above rough list of 10 things on which to judge the custodial merits of Chapman, Graham and Wenger (sorry Bertie!! :( ) , and using a point scoring system of 'marks out of ten' for each category, I had Chapman and Graham as joint winners on 89 points each, with Wenger trailing way behind!! It would be interesting to know how you guys scored it using the same method as I did.

Now although I consider myself to be a reasonable and rational person (most of the time, anyway), perhaps I've subconsciously let personal feelings get in the way of some of my marks and maybe also the criterion used. So any other suggestions of other things that should be taken into consideration that I've omitted?

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olgitgooner
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Re: Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by olgitgooner »

Has to be Herbert.

He's the one who made Arsenal one of the best clubs in the world.

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frankbutcher
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by frankbutcher »

According to your criteria, I'd make it Wenger. On the whole, he probably is.

- 2 Doubles
- Invincible season
- New stadium
- New training ground
- Worldwide support
- Reputation for attractive football

As much as I think he has massively under-achieved in the last 7 years, he probably is still our greatest manager.

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augie
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Re: Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by augie »

GG by a country mile for me 8) he knew the Arsenal way, and he sure as hell instilled that into his players. Each and every last one of them were constantly reminded about how we as a club had a touch of class about us that others could only envy.
He took over a club in a state of coma and going nowhere fast and within a few short years he ended a domination that the scousers had enjoyed for almost a decade. He did it whilst spending f**k all cash and in contrast to manure who had been spending big for years but unable to break that monopoly. He built a back 4 the like of which will never be seen again and who will forever be viewed as legends

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flash gunner
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by flash gunner »

frankbutcher wrote:According to your criteria, I'd make it Wenger. On the whole, he probably is.

- 2 Doubles
- Invincible season
- New stadium
- New training ground
- Worldwide support
- Reputation for attractive football

As much as I think he has massively under-achieved in the last 7 years, he probably is still our greatest manager.
Have to agree with frank here. As much as its time for a change (and has been for 3 years at least) Wenger IMO is still the greatest ever Arsenal manager

officepest
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by officepest »

One can make good cases for George & Arsene but for me it has to be Chapman.

His work laid the foundations for the modern club and it's arguable if we'd be where we are now without his revolutionary influences. Well, that and having loads of coin to spend frugally on quality players, a lot of whom signed simply becasue it meant working for Chapman. Oh, and kicking the Spuds out of the league, plus renaming Gillespie Road may have helped too. :wink:

The Bank of England Club indeed


Edit: ''I'd like to Knock Liverpool of their fucking perch'' a quote attributed to Fergie, well tough, George Graham did that for you mate.

northbankbren
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by northbankbren »

frankbutcher wrote:According to your criteria, I'd make it Wenger. On the whole, he probably is.

- 2 Doubles
- Invincible season
- New stadium
- New training ground
- Worldwide support
- Reputation for attractive football

As much as I think he has massively under-achieved in the last 7 years, he probably is still our greatest manager.
....so, that banner then :hmmthink: ,why oh why wasnt show. Maybe...see above? :lol:

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QuartzGooner
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by QuartzGooner »

Herbert Chapman.

We had not won a trophy before he arrived.
Under his leadership we became the most famous and biggest club in the world, until the war derailed us.

He was as much an innovator as Wenger, perhaps more so.

Introduced higher fitness levels.
Introduced physios and masseurs.
Tactical soundness, by taking the emerging WM formation and refining it.
Open to ideas from his players, famously the team meeting where Charlie Buchan suggested the WM formation.
Designed turnstiles, and the clock.
Decided on red and white top.
As far as I know, made us first UK club to have floodlights.
Advocated white footballs and numbered shirts for easier identification.
Got Gillespie Road underground station name changed to Arsenal.
Died in the name of the club, by insisting on seeing a third team game when he had a cold, which turned to pneumonia.

Wenger has done a lot of great things for the club, his legacy being the trophies, style of play, stadium and two training grounds, but Chapman and his innovations took us from a non descript club to the most famous in the world.

officepest
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by officepest »

Further to Quartz's post;

Eddie Hapgood's autobiography covers the reasons why Chapman gets my vote.

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diggerdan
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by diggerdan »

Arsene Wenger 1998- 2005 is Arsenals greatest manager... but Arsene Wenger 2005 -2011 is also the worst

what will Arsene Wenger 2012 bring ..hopefully he will buy some quality players and address the teams inabilty to defend.

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denhaaggooner
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by denhaaggooner »

Can anybody tell me if Wenger has won a trophy with a 11 of his own players or did the last trophy we won still have some remnants of the GG years i am not too sure but i dont think he has !! My vote goes to GG as he is by far the best Arsenal manager in my lifetime .

supergeorgegraham
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by supergeorgegraham »

Yes it has to be Herbert Chapman as he was a revolution to the World of Football.
Next up would be Graham because he took Arsenal to a major final or success in every season he was here apart from 90 and 92
1987 Littlewoods Cup winners
1988 Littlewoods Cup runners up
1989 League 1 winners
1990
1991 League 1 winners
1992
1993 FA Cup winners, League cup winners
1994 Cup winners cup winners
1995 Cup winners cup runners up

Sadly for Wenger you cant place him higher because he has won nothing for 7 years. Football is all about winning

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Henry Norris 1913
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by Henry Norris 1913 »

Chapman surely , he radically improved the club forever.

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donaldo
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by donaldo »

supergeorgegraham wrote:Yes it has to be Herbert Chapman as he was a revolution to the World of Football.
Next up would be Graham because he took Arsenal to a major final or success in every season he was here apart from 90 and 92
1987 Littlewoods Cup winners
1988 Littlewoods Cup runners up
1989 League 1 winners
1990
1991 League 1 winners
1992
1993 FA Cup winners, League cup winners
1994 Cup winners cup winners
1995 Cup winners cup runners up

Sadly for Wenger you cant place him higher because he has won nothing for 7 years. Football is all about winning
In 90 and 92 we finished 4th.Which Wenger and the AKB's tell us is the same as winning a trophy

GG never went 2 years without a trophy

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goonersid
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Re: Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

Post by goonersid »

GG for me, he didn't inherit anywhere near the quality Wenger did. I still say a Wenger team no matter how good it was, would never have got a result at Anfield on that great night. As for chapman, we are talking a completely different era so it would be impossible for me to judge.

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