WALCOTT - which position is best etc?

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flash gunner
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by flash gunner »

LDB wrote:
the moog wrote:
Cockerill's chin wrote:Dismissing the assist stat as irrelevant is just as naive as over relying on it. Of course it has some relevance in judging a player's value.Walcott's pace has unlocked quite a few defences in his time at Arsenal and he has contributed some important goals. Everybody is fully aware he can be frustrating but I think he wil be a quality player for Arsenal or somebody else. I hope he stays but feel conflicted about £100k per week. We don't pay those wages and when we do it is for proven and consistent talent. Then again, young English talent commands a premium and the Arseanl will make money from a marketable player like Theo. Also, there will be other clubs willing to pay it and we often complain the Arsenal don't compete at the current inflated market level. This isn't the same as over-paying Average Al or B52. There will be Champions League level takers for Theo.

Hope he stays, and the Gazidis inspired accountant in me hopes it will be for the 75k offered. :barscarf:
so are corners assists? are throw-ins assists do they go to judging a players value. should we also count deliveries from from free kicks as well? is a defense spliting pass not worth more than a five yard square ball (as this would be the assist). its a joke stat.

the second bit always makes me laugh, so now were expected to pay more for a birth certificate than actual talent.
Radford, out of curiosity why have you changed your name? Is it so you could drop all the third person stuff?
:D

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DB10GOONER
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by DB10GOONER »

LDB wrote:
the moog wrote:
Cockerill's chin wrote:Dismissing the assist stat as irrelevant is just as naive as over relying on it. Of course it has some relevance in judging a player's value.Walcott's pace has unlocked quite a few defences in his time at Arsenal and he has contributed some important goals. Everybody is fully aware he can be frustrating but I think he wil be a quality player for Arsenal or somebody else. I hope he stays but feel conflicted about £100k per week. We don't pay those wages and when we do it is for proven and consistent talent. Then again, young English talent commands a premium and the Arseanl will make money from a marketable player like Theo. Also, there will be other clubs willing to pay it and we often complain the Arsenal don't compete at the current inflated market level. This isn't the same as over-paying Average Al or B52. There will be Champions League level takers for Theo.

Hope he stays, and the Gazidis inspired accountant in me hopes it will be for the 75k offered. :barscarf:
so are corners assists? are throw-ins assists do they go to judging a players value. should we also count deliveries from from free kicks as well? is a defense spliting pass not worth more than a five yard square ball (as this would be the assist). its a joke stat.

the second bit always makes me laugh, so now were expected to pay more for a birth certificate than actual talent.
Radford, out of curiosity why have you changed your name? Is it so you could drop all the third person stuff?
:popcorn:

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Cockerill's chin
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by Cockerill's chin »

Radford wrote:
so are corners assists Radford asks? are throw-ins assists do they go to judging a players value. should Radford also count deliveries from from free kicks as well? is a defense spliting pass not worth more than a five yard square ball Radford demands
Why should this be grounds for dismissing a stat? Should a goal that comes off the shoulder be the same as a spectacular volley from thirty yards? Should a Cleverley type misdirerted cross be the same as Cazorla's arrow? A goal is a goal and an assist that leads to a goal is an assist. Quality may differ but hey ho. You should be more pragmatic. I'm sure AW wants the picture perfect goal every time after a cutting through ball but Geaorge Graham would take the five yard square ball coming off Wrighty's arse if it ended up in the back of the net. How many assists did Marwood get from corners in 89? We now present as much danger from corners as a spaced out IHH armed with a hobnob. What would you give to have that threat back. Assists and goals are valid irrespective.
will we make money by giving him a fabulous contract? will we sell him for more than we paid for him? as others have said should he be on more money than the other current first team players? you say other CL teams will take him who eaxctly?
Will we make money by giving him a fabulous contract, of course not. Will that contract make Theo unmovable from the Arsenal books, no. City, Liverpool and Chelsea have an interest in Theo (Citeeh delayed their Sinclair signing when the contract wrangling flared up before the end of the window). He is an asset to many teams. I think he will be a quality player. As mentioned before, however, I would be much happier if he signed for 75k per week as 100k should be for consistent talent. Then again, why am I thinking like that? That money won't be re-invested if it is saved on Theo and if it is there is a danger it will be misspent on players we can't move from the wage books.

You might not like the premium for a birth certificate but that doesn't mean you should deny it exists.

northbank 123
Imagine we gave Walcott £100k/w, what do you think the likes of Arteta who took a pay cut from Everton and has been our most consistent performer since joining would think? Do you think Feo deserves to be more our less our highest paid player? If we gave him that Wenger would rightly have a queue of players demanding huge wage increases.
I agree that this will be a problem but aren't we inevitably headed for such a dilemma? AW's socialist experiment in the dressing room has failed and I hope he doesn't repeat it. As the drains on resources move on (B52, Camel, Denilson, Squillaci etc) hopefully the same mistakes won't happen and we can start paying the higher end wages again. The likes of Arteta will come knocking sooner or later if we don't repeat those mistakes and pay squad players too much. I put that last sentence in on purpose because that is where I think we can't agree. Theo is much more than a squad player in my opinion.

rigsby
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by rigsby »

o are corners assists? are throw-ins assists do they go to judging a players value. should we also count deliveries from from free kicks as well?
Of course they count, as they have led directly to a goal. I honestly can't see what you're arguing against. You're wrong.

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QuartzGooner
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by QuartzGooner »

Couple of stories "Planted" by Arsenal to put pressure on Walcott's agent?

Wenger in for striker in January?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/footba ... indow.html

Wenger in for Palace's Zaha?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footba ... USIVE.html

the moog
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by the moog »

Cockerill's chin wrote:
Radford wrote:
so are corners assists Radford asks? are throw-ins assists do they go to judging a players value. should Radford also count deliveries from from free kicks as well? is a defense spliting pass not worth more than a five yard square ball Radford demands
Why should this be grounds for dismissing a stat? Should a goal that comes off the shoulder be the same as a spectacular volley from thirty yards? Should a Cleverley type misdirerted cross be the same as Cazorla's arrow? A goal is a goal and an assist that leads to a goal is an assist. Quality may differ but hey ho. You should be more pragmatic. I'm sure AW wants the picture perfect goal every time after a cutting through ball but Geaorge Graham would take the five yard square ball coming off Wrighty's arse if it ended up in the back of the net. How many assists did Marwood get from corners in 89? We now present as much danger from corners as a spaced out IHH armed with a hobnob. What would you give to have that threat back. Assists and goals are valid irrespective.
will we make money by giving him a fabulous contract? will we sell him for more than we paid for him? as others have said should he be on more money than the other current first team players? you say other CL teams will take him who eaxctly?
Will we make money by giving him a fabulous contract, of course not. Will that contract make Theo unmovable from the Arsenal books, no. City, Liverpool and Chelsea have an interest in Theo (Citeeh delayed their Sinclair signing when the contract wrangling flared up before the end of the window). He is an asset to many teams. I think he will be a quality player. As mentioned before, however, I would be much happier if he signed for 75k per week as 100k should be for consistent talent. Then again, why am I thinking like that? That money won't be re-invested if it is saved on Theo and if it is there is a danger it will be misspent on players we can't move from the wage books.

You might not like the premium for a birth certificate but that doesn't mean you should deny it exists.

northbank 123
Imagine we gave Walcott £100k/w, what do you think the likes of Arteta who took a pay cut from Everton and has been our most consistent performer since joining would think? Do you think Feo deserves to be more our less our highest paid player? If we gave him that Wenger would rightly have a queue of players demanding huge wage increases.
I agree that this will be a problem but aren't we inevitably headed for such a dilemma? AW's socialist experiment in the dressing room has failed and I hope he doesn't repeat it. As the drains on resources move on (B52, Camel, Denilson, Squillaci etc) hopefully the same mistakes won't happen and we can start paying the higher end wages again. The likes of Arteta will come knocking sooner or later if we don't repeat those mistakes and pay squad players too much. I put that last sentence in on purpose because that is where I think we can't agree. Theo is much more than a squad player in my opinion.

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QuartzGooner
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by QuartzGooner »

Expected to be out for three weeks with bruised lung.
Painful injury, wish him better.

Injured list now up to seven players:

Szczesny
Diaby
Rosicky
Walcott

with Sagna, Wilshere and Frimpong on the mend.

arseofacrow
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by arseofacrow »

QuartzGooner wrote:Expected to be out for three weeks with bruised lung.
Painful injury, wish him better.

Injured list now up to seven players:

Szczesny
Diaby
Rosicky
Walcott

with Sagna, Wilshere and Frimpong on the mend.
Sagna and Wilshire coming back :barscarf: :barscarf:

diaby, rosicky and walcott out :barscarf: :barscarf: :barscarf:

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QuartzGooner
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by QuartzGooner »

Why be happy that our players are out?

Diaby, Rosicky and Walcott have all proved they can be of use when fit.

Even if personally I think Diaby should be sold, I can still see what use he is when fit.

arseofacrow
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by arseofacrow »

Lighten up Quartz

:barscarf: :wink:

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QuartzGooner
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by QuartzGooner »

arseofacrow wrote:Lighten up Quartz

:barscarf: :wink:
Nah.

Too many injuries over the years.

1989
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by 1989 »

Will Feo sign da ting? :D

nut flush gooner
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by nut flush gooner »

Was a shocking challenge by San Marino's GK, he should have been sent off no doubt. Whilst walcott hasn't lived up to his potential I do feel sorry for him. The management must have told him knuckle down and justify your pay demands and he did seem more committed in recent weeks, all beit off the subs bench.

I think walcott deserves a chance up front, if he doesn't then deliver the goods ie a hatful of goals, then he has no right to hold us to ransom. In fairness to him I suspect he is a much better human being than the likes of ade, nasri etc. The press always make him out to be the villain.

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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by Number 5 »

Walcott might deserve a chance up front. But it would have to be in an entirely different formation.

He hasn't got the touch to be a lone striker, he won't be able to hold the ball up long enough for the rest of the attack to develop around him.

I like him as a striker more than a wide forward/winger. But it could only ever happen in a something-something-2.

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augie
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Re: Walcott - contract talks/which position is best etc?

Post by augie »

Number 5 wrote:Walcott might deserve a chance up front. But it would have to be in an entirely different formation.

He hasn't got the touch to be a lone striker, he won't be able to hold the ball up long enough for the rest of the attack to develop around him.

I like him as a striker more than a wide forward/winger. But it could only ever happen in a something-something-2.


Was just about to make the same point - I dont know if people are watching or can actually see what is happening on a pitch when they call for walnut to be given a chance up front :roll: If they believe the wenger bullshit that we play 4-3-3 then they would concede that he is being played as one of those three up front (albeit on the wing) but surely regardless of whether they believe we play 4-3-3 or 4-5-1, they can see that walnut has none of the qualities required to play the central striker on his own. Maybe these deluded individuals believe that we should change our formation to 4-4-2 just to suit an overhyped media boy who believes that he is worth more than he is despite the fact that it would be nothing more than a shot in the dark cos they have no idea if he can play the position - in other words we should experiment with our formation just for him :roll: Makes you wonder how much he comprehends the current formation if he believes that he can fulfill the rvp/giroud roll doesnt it ? :roll: :oops: :oops:

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