Flamini
Re: Flamini
Gawd almighty, give it a rest fellas!
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arseofacrow
- Posts: 6173
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:06 pm
- Location: Cologne
Re: Flamini
You've been warned, fellas!Chippy wrote:Gawd almighty, give it a rest fellas!
Re: Flamini
Chippy wrote:Gawd almighty, give it a rest fellas!
Long since gave up on this thread - flamoney is jesus Christ reincarnate, his character is impeccable and we should all forget about his tendancies to walk out on every club he ever played for
Re: Flamini
Walk out? - jesus wept mate, it wasn't a marriage and he ain't your loveraugie wrote:Long since gave up on this thread - flamoney is jesus Christ reincarnate, his character is impeccable and we should all forget about his tendancies to walk out on every club he ever played forChippy wrote:Gawd almighty, give it a rest fellas!
He was an employee who honored his contract and made a personal decision to change employer at the end of that contract (it's actually quite reasonable when you think about it).All this bullshit about money, ambition, greed, blah, blah, fucking blah is boring and irrelevant. Having fully honored his contract, he was well within his rights to move wherever he and family wished - and that's exactly how it should be.
The usual reasons people take issue with this reasonable course of action are largely selfish - they either:
(a) want to live out their own dreams through other people (or worse, see themselves as an agent or career planner
) and therefore take offence that they didn't choose the "correct" employer, or (b) are behaving like jilted lovers who are just upset he chose to leave Arsenal
Or there's those people who are simply incapable of accepting that a person has every right to choose his own career path as long as he honors his existing contract (perish the thought a human being should have free will when not under contract, eh
)Augie, Flamini is NOT "jesus christ reincarnate" and neither is he that bad either. He's just an employee. People need to stop thinking they own a piece of them and just accept that footballers have a say in their own career path.
Re: Flamini
That's it in a nutshell g88ner.
And I haven't noticed any "wildly exaggerated" praise of Flamini or claims that he's "Jesus Christ"
What I have noticed is that the more enlightened amongst us have recognised that - very simply, he's a good addition to us, giving us a type of player we just didn't have and absolutely needed.
The suggestion that Flaminis praise has been "wildly exaggerated" is frankly, a wild exaggeration.
And I haven't noticed any "wildly exaggerated" praise of Flamini or claims that he's "Jesus Christ"
What I have noticed is that the more enlightened amongst us
have recognised that - very simply, he's a good addition to us, giving us a type of player we just didn't have and absolutely needed.The suggestion that Flaminis praise has been "wildly exaggerated" is frankly, a wild exaggeration.
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northbank123
- Posts: 12436
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Re: Flamini
And I wouldn't really disagree with that - as I said before the fact that I have some personal dislike for him doesn't mean I don't think he's looking like a good addition and I hope as much as anyone he can become a huge player for us. His worth to the team and his character/likeability are two distinct issues, I don't understand why everyone seems so insistent on clubbing them together.armchair supporter wrote:That's it in a nutshell g88ner.
And I haven't noticed any "wildly exaggerated" praise of Flamini or claims that he's "Jesus Christ"
What I have noticed is that the more enlightened amongst us
The suggestion that Flaminis praise has been "wildly exaggerated" is frankly, a wild exaggeration.
As for his form, he has played well since coming back and slotted in nicely but literally every single game without fail there's been at least one person coming on here saying he was absolutely superb, or immense, or some other superlative. And I just don't think he's been head and shoulders above more or less everyone else in every game he's played.
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Red Gunner
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- Location: London
Arsenal's Mathieu Flamini happy to do the 'dark' work for Mesut Ozil
Of all the possible reasons to delay Mathieu Flamini from a meeting to talk about his new lease of life at Arsenal, the explanation was highly unexpected. Surely his extra-curricular session of choice at the training ground was something like taekwondo or triathalon? Actually, no. It was yoga. Arsenal's scampering, edgy, defensive midfielder does not give the impression that life should be taken with slow, stretched, moments of contemplation. The image that fits better is of a man who might leap out of bed barking instructions and pointing before he has even rubbed the sleep from his eyes.
If it is easy to pigeonhole Flamini, that is not a problem with the man himself. A player who has added steel to the silk in Arsenal's game prides himself on the virtues he embodies. His manager, Arsène Wenger, refers to it as the "dark" work. Flamini does not take that as a slight. If anything, he is proud that his ability to handle the darkness gives his team-mates the platform to paint with light and colour.
When Eric Cantona famously described Didier Deschamps as a water-carrier, it was said with disdain. Flamini carries water with indefatigable relish.
"We have a lot of qualities, a lot of technical players, and they need to be protected," he insists. "Defensive work is maybe a bit more difficult to see than when you score or make an assist. But it's very important as part of the balance of the team. I am a defensive midfielder, trying to find the best balance in the team between the defence and attack. Winning games is a quality of effort. It's teamwork." The value he brings in that regard has been highly noticeable as Arsenal have set the pace in both the Premier League and their Champions League group.
His other great contribution since returning to his former club as an almost accidental free transfer is in leadership. Always cajoling, instructing, alerting, Flamini is a big believer in communication on the pitch as a way of simultaneously steering strategy and spirit. He is so busy on the pitch, although his choice of word is "bossy". Again, what some perceive as negative he is happy to embrace. "It is inside of me. I am not trying to be bossy, just to be myself, and of course to help my partners on the pitch. When you start helping each other, fighting for each other, this helps you to win games."
On the subject of what it takes to win football matches, Flamini talks as he plays – with serious and relentless intent. The only time he pauses during the scurrying conversation is to consider the wisdom of confessing his boyhood footballing hero. " Maybe I shouldn't say that but …" he smiles wryly, "it was Roy Keane. For me he is a legend. Someone you want to respect." It figures.
In the end, Flamini's resolve is what persuaded Wenger to take his old charge back when, frankly, the manager was reticent. Perhaps there was a little residual discomfort about how Flamini left in the first place, back in 2008. The player had an excellent final season of his contract, took little interest in an extension, and left on a Bosman free for Milan.
"I had hesitations about it because he left us before and you always want to send a signal that the players who leave do not necessarily come back," Wenger explained. Watching Flamini training like a dervish made him think again. "I had a chat with him and told him I hadn't made up my mind. His resolute attitude to join us convinced me. He had other proposals and I said: 'If you want to go somewhere else you can because I am not ready yet.'
"But he waited. Once he decided to do that, you think there is something special there."
Flamini is thrilled. "I really have the sensation I never left," he says. "It was a great opportunity to come back. I had some unfinished business. I had four great years, amazing memories, but I have some regrets. I am talking obviously about the [2006 Champions League] final in Paris which we lost, and the 2007-08 run, where we were top of the league and collapsed in the end. All these things stay in the back of your head. When you are a competitor you wake up in the morning and you want to win. You want to win every game. You want to win titles. That's what you fight for. So I come back with a lot of motivation."
There is an interesting comparison between the current team, on their high-flying roll, and the class of 2007-08, who were leading the Premier League towards the run-in, having built their challenge on a sequence of 12 consecutive wins. What happened next has stuck in Flamini's mind since.
"I understand why everyone remembers that well," he muses. "We were top of the league until spring and if I remember we collapsed at Birmingham. We were winning 2-1, there was the big injury of Eduardo and then it ended in a draw." They could not cope with that traumatic game and all their good work unravelled. He hopes that he can lend his experience at points of adversity that he expects to come up during this campaign.
"The quality is present in our team today and we want to prove it until the end. What will make the difference is the solidarity. We have to keep the spirit until the end. Up to now everything is going well but we will face a difficult period. Solidarity and team spirit is more important then than now. It is very difficult to find, and very difficult to keep, so we have to work very hard on that because for me that is what makes the difference."
His impact on that solidarity and spirit was evident from the moment he jigged on the sidelines, ready to enter the fray of the north London derby in his second Arsenal debut. "I was a bit nervous," he says. "My first game after I left and I was hoping the fans would be on my side." The Emirates crowd were able to play Flamini bingo and soon had a full house. Giving instructions? Tick. Gesticulating? Tick. Foul? Tick. Booking? Bingo.
Although his re-signing on a free was seen by some as symbolic of Arsenal's troubles in the transfer market, becoming re-acquainted with traits like this, of course they were happy to see him. He addressed problems that had lingered for some time.
Although his time in Milan was mixed, he retains affection for a spell which brought him a scudetto and many lessons. "Tactically, it is an amazing school. The championship is not that easy. So coming back here maybe it is a bit easier for me to understand the game," he says.
Flamini gives Wenger a more energetic and aggressive alternative to Mikel Arteta in the midfield anchor role. More interestingly, he can also be a companion for Arteta – as was the case so effectively against Napoli in the Champions League in a more strategic set-up which should be more effective in Europe and on tough away assignments.
Either way, Flamini just feels elated to be involved. "Sometimes it is difficult to realise how lucky we are," he says, describing his vocation as "a beauty". When Mesut Özil was signed shortly after Flamini's return, the contrasts were striking. One cost £42m, the other nothing. One is a artist, the other a workman. But the unsung hero has in his own way been as transforming as the superstar.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/201 ... -dark-work
Of all the possible reasons to delay Mathieu Flamini from a meeting to talk about his new lease of life at Arsenal, the explanation was highly unexpected. Surely his extra-curricular session of choice at the training ground was something like taekwondo or triathalon? Actually, no. It was yoga. Arsenal's scampering, edgy, defensive midfielder does not give the impression that life should be taken with slow, stretched, moments of contemplation. The image that fits better is of a man who might leap out of bed barking instructions and pointing before he has even rubbed the sleep from his eyes.
If it is easy to pigeonhole Flamini, that is not a problem with the man himself. A player who has added steel to the silk in Arsenal's game prides himself on the virtues he embodies. His manager, Arsène Wenger, refers to it as the "dark" work. Flamini does not take that as a slight. If anything, he is proud that his ability to handle the darkness gives his team-mates the platform to paint with light and colour.
When Eric Cantona famously described Didier Deschamps as a water-carrier, it was said with disdain. Flamini carries water with indefatigable relish.
"We have a lot of qualities, a lot of technical players, and they need to be protected," he insists. "Defensive work is maybe a bit more difficult to see than when you score or make an assist. But it's very important as part of the balance of the team. I am a defensive midfielder, trying to find the best balance in the team between the defence and attack. Winning games is a quality of effort. It's teamwork." The value he brings in that regard has been highly noticeable as Arsenal have set the pace in both the Premier League and their Champions League group.
His other great contribution since returning to his former club as an almost accidental free transfer is in leadership. Always cajoling, instructing, alerting, Flamini is a big believer in communication on the pitch as a way of simultaneously steering strategy and spirit. He is so busy on the pitch, although his choice of word is "bossy". Again, what some perceive as negative he is happy to embrace. "It is inside of me. I am not trying to be bossy, just to be myself, and of course to help my partners on the pitch. When you start helping each other, fighting for each other, this helps you to win games."
On the subject of what it takes to win football matches, Flamini talks as he plays – with serious and relentless intent. The only time he pauses during the scurrying conversation is to consider the wisdom of confessing his boyhood footballing hero. " Maybe I shouldn't say that but …" he smiles wryly, "it was Roy Keane. For me he is a legend. Someone you want to respect." It figures.
In the end, Flamini's resolve is what persuaded Wenger to take his old charge back when, frankly, the manager was reticent. Perhaps there was a little residual discomfort about how Flamini left in the first place, back in 2008. The player had an excellent final season of his contract, took little interest in an extension, and left on a Bosman free for Milan.
"I had hesitations about it because he left us before and you always want to send a signal that the players who leave do not necessarily come back," Wenger explained. Watching Flamini training like a dervish made him think again. "I had a chat with him and told him I hadn't made up my mind. His resolute attitude to join us convinced me. He had other proposals and I said: 'If you want to go somewhere else you can because I am not ready yet.'
"But he waited. Once he decided to do that, you think there is something special there."
Flamini is thrilled. "I really have the sensation I never left," he says. "It was a great opportunity to come back. I had some unfinished business. I had four great years, amazing memories, but I have some regrets. I am talking obviously about the [2006 Champions League] final in Paris which we lost, and the 2007-08 run, where we were top of the league and collapsed in the end. All these things stay in the back of your head. When you are a competitor you wake up in the morning and you want to win. You want to win every game. You want to win titles. That's what you fight for. So I come back with a lot of motivation."
There is an interesting comparison between the current team, on their high-flying roll, and the class of 2007-08, who were leading the Premier League towards the run-in, having built their challenge on a sequence of 12 consecutive wins. What happened next has stuck in Flamini's mind since.
"I understand why everyone remembers that well," he muses. "We were top of the league until spring and if I remember we collapsed at Birmingham. We were winning 2-1, there was the big injury of Eduardo and then it ended in a draw." They could not cope with that traumatic game and all their good work unravelled. He hopes that he can lend his experience at points of adversity that he expects to come up during this campaign.
"The quality is present in our team today and we want to prove it until the end. What will make the difference is the solidarity. We have to keep the spirit until the end. Up to now everything is going well but we will face a difficult period. Solidarity and team spirit is more important then than now. It is very difficult to find, and very difficult to keep, so we have to work very hard on that because for me that is what makes the difference."
His impact on that solidarity and spirit was evident from the moment he jigged on the sidelines, ready to enter the fray of the north London derby in his second Arsenal debut. "I was a bit nervous," he says. "My first game after I left and I was hoping the fans would be on my side." The Emirates crowd were able to play Flamini bingo and soon had a full house. Giving instructions? Tick. Gesticulating? Tick. Foul? Tick. Booking? Bingo.
Although his re-signing on a free was seen by some as symbolic of Arsenal's troubles in the transfer market, becoming re-acquainted with traits like this, of course they were happy to see him. He addressed problems that had lingered for some time.
Although his time in Milan was mixed, he retains affection for a spell which brought him a scudetto and many lessons. "Tactically, it is an amazing school. The championship is not that easy. So coming back here maybe it is a bit easier for me to understand the game," he says.
Flamini gives Wenger a more energetic and aggressive alternative to Mikel Arteta in the midfield anchor role. More interestingly, he can also be a companion for Arteta – as was the case so effectively against Napoli in the Champions League in a more strategic set-up which should be more effective in Europe and on tough away assignments.
Either way, Flamini just feels elated to be involved. "Sometimes it is difficult to realise how lucky we are," he says, describing his vocation as "a beauty". When Mesut Özil was signed shortly after Flamini's return, the contrasts were striking. One cost £42m, the other nothing. One is a artist, the other a workman. But the unsung hero has in his own way been as transforming as the superstar.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/201 ... -dark-work
Re: Flamini
I love Arteta and think he's been a great buy for us. You will only ever find posts of mine praising Arteta.northbank123 wrote:And I wouldn't really disagree with that - as I said before the fact that I have some personal dislike for him doesn't mean I don't think he's looking like a good addition and I hope as much as anyone he can become a huge player for us. His worth to the team and his character/likeability are two distinct issues, I don't understand why everyone seems so insistent on clubbing them together.armchair supporter wrote:That's it in a nutshell g88ner.
And I haven't noticed any "wildly exaggerated" praise of Flamini or claims that he's "Jesus Christ"
What I have noticed is that the more enlightened amongst us
The suggestion that Flaminis praise has been "wildly exaggerated" is frankly, a wild exaggeration.
As for his form, he has played well since coming back and slotted in nicely but literally every single game without fail there's been at least one person coming on here saying he was absolutely superb, or immense, or some other superlative. And I just don't think he's been head and shoulders above more or less everyone else in every game he's played.
Having said that, for me I like a DM to be a Flamini type DM. Tough in the tackle, maybe a little dirty, vocal and hard.
Now how in the name of sweet Jesus this opinion I have is either a wild exaggeration or somehow makes me a "turncoat wanker", an "AKB", a "banner wanker" or any of the other names I've been called on this thread I don't know?
And I must disagree. I have not seen any "wildly exaggerated" praise of Flamini. What I have seen is praise of Flamini, just like any other arsenal player gets praised on an arsenal forum.
Re: Flamini
Praise for other arsenal players? On this forum? Are you sure?
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northbank123
- Posts: 12436
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Re: Flamini
Armchair can I suggest you read my posts before replying to them? It would save us both a lot of time because you seem to enjoy responding to points I'm not making. For a start I've never suggested there's anything wrong with you holding the opinion that you think he's a good player who has played well.
Ultimately it's a question of personal opinion as to whether it's deserved, but I assure you that after every single game he's played there have been at least one poster(and often far more) claiming that he was magnificent, superb, immense, etc. I've not got the time to waste dragging up various quotes but in the time I've been on this forum I've never known anybody to get such high consistent praise. He's done very well by and large but hasn't merited that level of praise imo.
Ultimately it's a question of personal opinion as to whether it's deserved, but I assure you that after every single game he's played there have been at least one poster(and often far more) claiming that he was magnificent, superb, immense, etc. I've not got the time to waste dragging up various quotes but in the time I've been on this forum I've never known anybody to get such high consistent praise. He's done very well by and large but hasn't merited that level of praise imo.
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northbank123
- Posts: 12436
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- Location: Newcastle
Re: Flamini
All said and done thought he did very well today - although his discipline still worries me. Picked up a needless early yellow card and playing that role that's a huge danger. Flew in once in the second half just before the goal, pity he's going to be suspended after the next yellow.
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arseofacrow
- Posts: 6173
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:06 pm
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Re: Flamini
Flamini, discipline - I think we've got it mate!northbank123 wrote:All said and done thought he did very well today - although his discipline still worries me. Picked up a needless early yellow card and playing that role that's a huge danger. Flew in once in the second half just before the goal, pity he's going to be suspended after the next yellow.
I think he was immensely awesome today.
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DB10GOONER
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- Contact:
Re: Flamini
So, just to set the cat amongst the pigeons....
I was thinking about the Flamoney situation and it struck me that on here the people that seem most offended by how he left last time are (mostly) the same people that praised RVJC for going to Manure. I find this a bit odd to be honest.
Whilst I mostly agree with g88ner's points about players now being employees and no more no less, for me RVJC actually "betrayed" The Arsenal because he "owed" us. He sat on the treatment table for 7 years and had no problem with our ambition in all that time. None whatsoever. I wonder why? Then he has that one fantastic season of full fitness and promptly cashes it in for a move to Manure. Now, for me, I feel he owed the club. You know, the club that stuck by him and paid him millions whilst he delivered fuck all in return? The club that didn't ditch him 4 or 5 years into his injury prone time with us? Because if we'd ditched him at that stage I reckon it would not have been Manure he'd have gone to tbh...
Now compare Flamoney. He had a blinder for us in 2006 in the CL and then gets "thanked" by Arsene by being dropped for the final. We tried to offload him to Brum ffs. He never whined in the press about not always playing and always gave 100% when selected. Then he had a blinder all season partnering Cesc in his last season, and there is no denying he was an integral part of our (ultimately futile) push for the PL title that year. He looked at wasteful shite like Hleb getting paid twice what he was on and asked for a raise. The club "thanked" him again by fucking him about with the contract talks and he got the hump and left. Yes I totally agree he thought of his own best interest, but what human being wouldn't in a situation like that? He owed us nothing. We used him and we treated him a bit shit tbh.
Yet some on here hailed RVJC as some sort of fucking decent honest hero because he left lying about club ambition and such shite when he owed us for our loyalty to him, and despise Flamoney because he left without bad mouthing us or owing us anything?
I was thinking about the Flamoney situation and it struck me that on here the people that seem most offended by how he left last time are (mostly) the same people that praised RVJC for going to Manure. I find this a bit odd to be honest.
Whilst I mostly agree with g88ner's points about players now being employees and no more no less, for me RVJC actually "betrayed" The Arsenal because he "owed" us. He sat on the treatment table for 7 years and had no problem with our ambition in all that time. None whatsoever. I wonder why? Then he has that one fantastic season of full fitness and promptly cashes it in for a move to Manure. Now, for me, I feel he owed the club. You know, the club that stuck by him and paid him millions whilst he delivered fuck all in return? The club that didn't ditch him 4 or 5 years into his injury prone time with us? Because if we'd ditched him at that stage I reckon it would not have been Manure he'd have gone to tbh...
Now compare Flamoney. He had a blinder for us in 2006 in the CL and then gets "thanked" by Arsene by being dropped for the final. We tried to offload him to Brum ffs. He never whined in the press about not always playing and always gave 100% when selected. Then he had a blinder all season partnering Cesc in his last season, and there is no denying he was an integral part of our (ultimately futile) push for the PL title that year. He looked at wasteful shite like Hleb getting paid twice what he was on and asked for a raise. The club "thanked" him again by fucking him about with the contract talks and he got the hump and left. Yes I totally agree he thought of his own best interest, but what human being wouldn't in a situation like that? He owed us nothing. We used him and we treated him a bit shit tbh.
Yet some on here hailed RVJC as some sort of fucking decent honest hero because he left lying about club ambition and such shite when he owed us for our loyalty to him, and despise Flamoney because he left without bad mouthing us or owing us anything?
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Theoperator
- Posts: 2419
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- Location: In the tube, rather late again......
Re: Flamini
I often think what would I have done in this sort of situation,
I think most of us would go for the money, as well as enjoy the life in Milan, then come back as has happened.
Club loyalty sadly has gone out of the window- f**king shame but the world has changed. Hopefully it will change back, but thats unlikely till the huge TV money goes
He does need to watch his tackles- as well as club loyalty changing, yellow card wavings increased in fashion too, Id be surprised if he avoids a red at some time this season.
Hes hard
hes free (ish)
Hes Flamoni
I think most of us would go for the money, as well as enjoy the life in Milan, then come back as has happened.
Club loyalty sadly has gone out of the window- f**king shame but the world has changed. Hopefully it will change back, but thats unlikely till the huge TV money goes
He does need to watch his tackles- as well as club loyalty changing, yellow card wavings increased in fashion too, Id be surprised if he avoids a red at some time this season.
Hes hard
hes free (ish)
Hes Flamoni
Re: Flamini
DB10GOONER wrote:So, just to set the cat amongst the pigeons....
I was thinking about the Flamoney situation and it struck me that on here the people that seem most offended by how he left last time are (mostly) the same people that praised RVJC for going to Manure. I find this a bit odd to be honest.
Whilst I mostly agree with g88ner's points about players now being employees and no more no less, for me RVJC actually "betrayed" The Arsenal because he "owed" us. He sat on the treatment table for 7 years and had no problem with our ambition in all that time. None whatsoever. I wonder why? Then he has that one fantastic season of full fitness and promptly cashes it in for a move to Manure. Now, for me, I feel he owed the club. You know, the club that stuck by him and paid him millions whilst he delivered fuck all in return? The club that didn't ditch him 4 or 5 years into his injury prone time with us? Because if we'd ditched him at that stage I reckon it would not have been Manure he'd have gone to tbh...
Now compare Flamoney. He had a blinder for us in 2006 in the CL and then gets "thanked" by Arsene by being dropped for the final. We tried to offload him to Brum ffs. He never whined in the press about not always playing and always gave 100% when selected. Then he had a blinder all season partnering Cesc in his last season, and there is no denying he was an integral part of our (ultimately futile) push for the PL title that year. He looked at wasteful shite like Hleb getting paid twice what he was on and asked for a raise. The club "thanked" him again by fucking him about with the contract talks and he got the hump and left. Yes I totally agree he thought of his own best interest, but what human being wouldn't in a situation like that? He owed us nothing. We used him and we treated him a bit shit tbh.
Yet some on here hailed RVJC as some sort of fucking decent honest hero because he left lying about club ambition and such shite when he owed us for our loyalty to him, and despise Flamoney because he left without bad mouthing us or owing us anything?
I said to myself that I wouldn't get drawn back into this but I guess I cant help myself
There is nobody denying that rvp owed us cos of all those years he lay on the treatment table and continued to draw his wages but does that mean that you have to screw us over that badly to be considered to be wrong ? The only people on this thread that are using comparisons are the one's that are trying to defend flamoney but for me, if a guy is wrong then he is wrong regardless of the actions of other players.
A few quick points I want to make -
1. Most people aren't offended by how he left - most people are offended by WHY he left.
2. For most of the years rvp sat on the treatment table, we were a club with ambition - playing in a great team and challenging for trophies will keep the best players happy but playing alongside (and being expected to carry) shite players like average al, denilson, bendtner etc will piss off most ambitious players so his return to proper fitness coincides with a period of total stagnation for our club and I have no doubt that both played a part in his departure.
3. Flamoney did have a great 2006 and yes I agree that he should not have been dropped for the champs league final but ask yourself, why was he being sold to brum ? He was, for 80-90% of his time with us, just another average joe utility player that could cover in a few positions but was never good enough to hold down any one of them. He had a great last season cos we changed our formation to one that suited him more than most - he was never physically big or strong enough to play in the middle of a 4-4-2 so changing to a 4-5-1 allowed him to flourish without being expected to do the defensive work on his own.
So what if hleb was a useless piece of crap (and he absolutely was) - it doesn't mean that the club should pay another average joe more than he is worth
Havent we all complained strongly about giving players bumper rises without doing enough to justify them ? Over the course of his contract he had done nowhere near enough to justify his demands and we all know that deep down. How did the club treat him like shit ?Lastly it is easier for somebody like flamoney to sit on our bench and not whinge about playing time don't you think ? I mean the guy has made a career out of sitting on his arse and perfected it in milan
If, as I do, you believe that the guy is motivated by money then why would he complain about sitting on the bench - same rewards, minimal risk 