Come back David Dein, all is forgiven? (28/6)

Post by **gooner.ed** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 7:45 am

usual thread starter... so can arsenal go on and thrive without david dein? are people convinced arsene will not stay if dein does not return? frankly, the personality differences between dein and the rest of the board indicate it's either the existing set up or a takeover by kroenke (with dein returning). i could live with the existing board if arsenal had not been over 20 points off the title for the last two seasons. that is too much and so some serious investment is required this summer to improve things. i can't face another season like 2006/07 when there was not even really the serious glimmer of hope in either the prem or the CL.

Galasso · Post by **Galasso** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 8:42 am

It turns out that David Dein found in Arsene Wenger a man that matched his ambition - to dine at the very top table in football.

In Arsenal, Wenger was presented with more a less a blank canvass. Given complete freedom and control, he was able to put into action all of the ideas and plans that he had built up and worked on in the previous 20 years. David Dein in turn worked his way up through the football hierachy and on the back of the clubs success into positions of considerable influence.

Of course if you find people that you work with as effectively as it appears Dein and Wenger have, then one is loathe to lose them - especially as Wenger let it be know that he relied on Dein to do all the 'dirty work' for him. (In much the same way as the very best PA's are the eyes and ears of Executives).

It is no suprise that Wenger has not spoken about his future publicly. He doesn't like being forced into making statements by the media, And unlike Alex Ferguson, we have a Manager who is deemed to be flexible enough to work in European football. Why did Ferguson never try his hand at a top continental side? I am afraid that our Manager will aways attarct interest for this reason.

There is no doubt that Arsene Wenger would surely welcome Dein back. But I don't think Arsene's future is contingent on it. What is of more importance is can Arsene receive the backing of the current board at a time when we most need it - NOW. The club must compliment the talented youngsters already at the club with some world class players, as Wenger has done throughout his time with us.

GunnerMike · Post by **GunnerMike** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:10 am

Great article. The Board shot themselves in the foot when they got rid of DD. He was the life and soul of Arsenal when it came to football and once owned 62% of the club. He is passionate about the club and wants it to succeed. He also gets on well with AW. If AW leaves it will be because of the unrest created by the Board. And surely an investment by Koenke is not all that bad?

delgooner · Post by **delgooner** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:22 am

Though I'd love to see DD back, I cant see it happening while this board are in control. For a start DD and Edelman didnt speak to one another and I dont think Edelman and PHW are really crazy about the football side as long as they get the prestige of being in charge of the Arsenal. Edelman just bought in for the money, PHW is where he is because of his father and her Ladyship is just there for the beer as her old man cant stand football! - what the hell did he buy his shares for? - money! not for the love of the club. All I know is DD and La Boss have made Arsenal what they are today. I dont know what the present board want but they are certainly making every supporter pissed off. What about a bit of PR from someone. Dont they realise that it is us, the die-hard supporters who have to read all the crap in the Beano and Dandy tabloids and take the crap from the Chelshite and Manscum fans. Even Old Blue Nose doesnt need to stir the shit before the season starts. The present board should take a back-seat and let the two people who have a passion for the club run the football side! 4th Place and 20 points behind just isnt good enough for Arsenal, we'll be on the same level as Bolton next.

I could go on forever Im so pissed off with this every year thing with Arsenal and the players and La Boss.

donaldo · Post by **donaldo** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:24 am

Whenever i hear some Arsenal fans have a go at David Dein and his attempts to move the club on to compete with Man Utd and Chelski i ask them to look how the club was run by Hill-wood and co before he arrived.We were a club that had no chance of ever winning the league,in fact the players used to do a lap of honour if we finished in the top 6 and qualified for the Uefa cup.Now finishing 4th is a faliure.In the time Dein was at the club we won 5 titles.And of course he brought the great Arsene Wenger to the club.Just say Arsene did walk out on his contract now would you have faith in Hill-Wood and his cronies when it comes to finding a new manager?The current board dont care as long as 60,000 punters roll through the doors every week.We need a board with ambition to back Wenger with investment and i dont think the current board will. What would happen if Arsene turned round and said i will sign a new contract only if Dein returns.Now that would be interesting.

rolypoly · Post by **rolypoly** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:12 am

I cannot believe how panicky you are all getting after one iffy season.

this was the 1st season in 10 in which we did not go into last week of season with something to play for which itself may be some kind of record.

do you know how many trophies we have won in years ending in 5,6, or 7 since WW2? answer is 2.

every decade we have a wobbly mid decade. don`t panic.

as for dein who you are portraying as some kind of messiah, irepeat his silence suggests he is more interested in his personal postion than as a supporter because any true fan in his position would say that whatever the future held for him he hopes wenger stays and probably ought to have said same thing about the captain before he abandoned ship leaving the young crew to get on with keeping ship afloat.

as for foreign investment, has anyone considered there may be a hidden agenda. none of these investors are doing it for love. the bloke who wrote the lead article, who could be dein in disguise, mocks our board for knowing nothing about football but wants a foreign investor who barely knows the shape of a football-absolutely brilliant.

anyone considered how american sport is run- no relegation. get 15 investors together and they can change football as we know it. commercially it works in usa so why not here. and dont laugh 10 years ago the idea of half top clubs being foreign owned would have been laughed at.

i`d rather have things as they are be patient and wait for the highbury flats money to come in in 2 years.

wenger knew moving stadium would be traumatic. he knew his team would come to peak before the move. he knew it would be easier to settle into new stadium for younger players not so used to highbury. he knew that he could not keep standards as high as likes of bergie bobby etc got older.

trust his judgement on the kids and all will be well. trouble is we have too many glory hunters on board who cant remember years of dross. and a few poor years does make the good times even better. that is part of what being a gooner is all about.

Goonerdoc · Post by **Goonerdoc** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:52 am

I tend to agree with the ideas in the main article. Whether we like it or not, and I don't, the premiership is becoming the play ground of the filthy rich. If we want to maintain the position Arsene has got us into we need to be able to compete financially. I have no doubt that the new stadium etc would have put us up there in the top two or three clubs in the old days but now it alone will not be enough, we need someone with bucket loads of money to help us out and our current board seem not to grasp this. I would reluctantly call on them to invite Mr Kroenke onto the board and eat humble pie to get DD back. Let's sign some super players and put Arsenal back where we belong.

Sammy Mooner · Post by **Sammy Mooner** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:28 pm

Forget about the Premiership being a playground for the rich. There is just one rich guy bankrolling the Chavs but far more bloodsuckers with their noses in the trough. They are looking for wage caps and yet more

TV revenue in order to clean up, either that or they are looking to enhance their image and are using a football club to do so.
There is a big difference between Arsenal pre-Dein and Arsenal during Dein but I can't help feeling he lost the plot when the board when for the new local stadium - he certainly fell out with them and I don't see a way back other than via Kroenke.

Nothing will happen till Fiszman has been a tax exile long enough to sell up and then the shit may hit the fans - that'll be us then

Is there anyone who has any evidence of Fiszman being a fan before he was a shareholder? And I'm not expecting an answer to that one.

augie · Post by **augie** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:58 pm

So rolypoly you would rather wait 2 years for the sale of highbury flats come to pass ? Are you still prepared to take that position if you know that in the meantime Arsene Wenger will have left the club ? Would it also be worth losing your outstanding young talents like cesc,van persie etc ? I believe your answer to all of the above is no or at least should be no. If you were in Wengers shoes would you be prepared to wait around for another 12 months to see what the existing board do with their shares when fitzman gets his tax exile status ? Forget kroenke and concentrate on the huge loss to this club that is David Dein. He has been the driving force for this club for over 20 years, long before Wenger, and his knowledge is vital for the future of this club. I say again...f*ck this board out and bring back DD

rolypoly · Post by **rolypoly** » Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:22 am

augie.

i believe you are wrong because wenger will sign a new contract. he was not going to make a public announcement until he was sure henry was gone for certain.

wenger ain`t a stupid man. he will have known as much as anybody about aresnal`s projected cash flow. why on earth do you think he has been concentrating on youth development.

i waited until i was 14 until arsenal won the league for 1st time in my lifetime another 18 for next win so i can hack a couple of years of relative mediocrity. however your pessimism is misguided. i think you read too much into the wild rumours . there is not going to be a mass exodus. fab will stay and if and when he goes he will be replaced. trouble is we have been so spoilt over last 10 years too many like you have got greedy and cant accept that all clubs go through cycles of achievement. god knows what you would be like if you supported the unmentionables down the road.

you are giving too much credit to dein and not enough to board who backed dein most of the way and who rightfully overruled his opposition to new ground.

you want a rich sugar daddy to take over cos same is happening to other clubs.

you make no comment over possibility of relegation and sport as we know it being ended.

and have you considered possibilty of the whole lot being moved to america. laugh if like but there is a hidden agenda only you like many others are too narrow minded too short sighted to see the dangers of all our top clubs being owned by foreigners who dont give a damn about the game or the fans and only interested in the clubs as investments.

and if dein is such a great man why has not come out with public statement that he wants wenger to stay come what may.

Eboue Can't Defend · Post by **Eboue Can't Defend** » Fri Jun 29, 2007 12:14 pm

Guys,

We can agree to disagree without questioning each others loyalty, intellegence or even morality!!

None of us knows the whole picture of what happened/is happening with the Board, D.D. and S.S, but we are all intitled to an opinion based on what we do know.

For what it's worth, I believe that David Dein has been a force for good at our club and has been instrumental in helping Arsenal achieve the success it has. If it came down to a straight choice between Dein and the current Board members, I would unquestionably choose Double D.

By the way RolyPoly, why did you 'kiss the girls and make them cry' for?

You'll never get one of them to marry you if you persist in that behaviour!!

Cus Geezer · Post by **Cus Geezer** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:05 pm

And if he joined one of our Arsenal trivia teams would he remember Joe Haverty and Tommy Coakley and the attendance when we played Leeds at Highbury in 1966?

So would Stan Kronke? After all that's who's going to bankrolling the club if Dein returns.

if Hill-Woodâ€™s pompous ramblings about Stan Kroenke â€œand his sortâ€

Cus Geezer · Post by **Cus Geezer** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:11 pm

I ask them to look how the club was run by Hill-wood and co before he arrived.We were a club that had no chance of ever winning the league,in fact the players used to do a lap of honour if we finished in the top 6 and qualified for the Uefa cup.Now finishing 4th is a faliure.

Let's not forget that it took six years for us to win the league after his arrival on the board. I don't personally think DD's investment made much difference because Arsenal's 1988/9 title came more from utilising the fruits of its youth set up than transfer market activity. Also GG's insistance on retaining the wage structure.

And the club still reached five FA Cup Final's in ten years, just a few years before DD arrived.

donaldo · Post by **donaldo** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 2:09 pm

Cus Geezer

What you cannot deny is without DD we would not have Arsene as our manager its as simple as that.Yes Arsenal reached Cup finals before DD arrived but its all about winning league titles,and we have won 5 titles since DD joined the board.Befoe he did we won one title in 36 years.

Cus Geezer · Post by **Cus Geezer** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 3:23 pm

Yes Arsenal reached Cup finals before DD arrived but its all about winning league titles,and we have won 5 titles since DD joined the board.Befoe he did we won one title in 36 years.

Let's not forget that DD's record is boosted by the oligarchy that's been created at the top of the premiership since its formation and champions league money.

Such a static condition was not present prior to 1992.

And claiming the Cup's inferiority to the league is another post-1992 phenomenon, in the 1970s the FA Cup had equal importance.

Come back David Dein, all is forgiven? (28/6)

Come back David Dein, all is forgiven? (28/6)

Come back David Dein all is forgiven