THE WENGER THREAD

[Ikechukwu1]

Sigh. Read the last part again where 2 options are clearly given: option 1, is possibly achieving with AW. Option 2, is finishing outside the Top 4 with Klopp. It's written right there. But sure. "Wum" "invented" etc etc...
Jesus...

Double sigh. Are you this simple? Where does he say they are the ONLY two options. He is generalising, saying that for example here's two things that might happen, qualified by "I don't know". Do you need him to list every single possible option for you to understand the post?

Sigh.

Jesus.

Mohammad.

Etc.

Oh right. So it was a case of omission right? Ok. It's weird because what needs to be listed seems quite selective to you.
Example, I think Ramsey has improved a lot as a player despite ppl slating him, I think Monreal has improved loads and Coq is a decent DCM. But you see, do I neeeeeed to note everything down? Oh no that's right, you'll draw ur own conclusions based on the stuff that's there. Works both ways - just cos I don't list every positive thing doesn't mean I think it's all negative.
Sigh.

[SPUDMASHER]

it was a case of showing possible extremes

I am seriously worried about you

[Theoperator]

Are we agreed that we will be happy if we win the FA cup
Will we be happier if we dont have the tedious knock out prelim for the shyster league?

Otherwise we pretty much disagree, supporting The Arsenal Way

Thanks to you all for your interest in our affairs, (And dont trip us up on the way to the bank)

[Ikechukwu1]

Are we agreed that we will be happy if we win the FA cup
Will we be happier if we dont have the tedious knock out prelim for the shyster league?

Otherwise we pretty much disagree, supporting The Arsenal Way

Thanks to you all for your interest in our affairs, (And dont trip us up on the way to the bank)

Winning the FA Cup again would be good. It would not be progress IMO due to the lack of respect Wenger himself has shown this competition many times - however yes, it's a trophy and it counts.
What I want to know, is if with ticket prices at the level they're at, and what we were promised when we left Highbury - is that enough?
Also, excuse the question but...can I ask why when we won the FA cup in 2005 there was no parade? It's almost as if we didn't treat it as anything but a consolation back then. Just curious as to what's changed? (I do like the FA cup for the record)

[Ikechukwu1]

it was a case of showing possible extremes

I am seriously worried about you

Oh apologies. I forget, your thing is "playing devil's advocate" (usually when it comes to talking Arsene up)
But that's cool!

[StuartL]

Are we agreed that we will be happy if we win the FA cup
Will we be happier if we dont have the tedious knock out prelim for the shyster league?

Otherwise we pretty much disagree, supporting The Arsenal Way

Thanks to you all for your interest in our affairs, (And dont trip us up on the way to the bank)

I won't be.....just think of the revenue we lose from a sell out home match, it's about £3m That almost covers 5 months of Wenker's salary.

[augie]

Are we agreed that we will be happy if we win the FA cup
Will we be happier if we dont have the tedious knock out prelim for the shyster league?

Otherwise we pretty much disagree, supporting The Arsenal Way

Thanks to you all for your interest in our affairs, (And dont trip us up on the way to the bank)

I won't be.....just think of the revenue we lose from a sell out home match, it's about £3m That almost covers 5 months of Wenker's salary.

Wouldn't worry about that......when we sell sanchez in the summer it will make up for the shortfall and will cover any profit bonus due to le cock too

[flash gunner]

Baba

[GoonerMuzz]

I think some of you are being a little to quick to dismiss the league points total in this.

Lets say we beat Villa and end up with the same points total as last year wont that mean we have an almost identical season to what we had last year, and therefore any progress is questionable?

We'll have won one trophy, gone out the CL at the same stage, and ended up on the same points in the league but have gone one less round in the league cup.

Going back to the league points total the reason i am saying progress is questionable is that although we have had better results against some teams we will have had to have worse results elsewhere and therefore the reason we would have ended up higher in the league is less to do with us being better and more to do with others being worse, again i understand that this is a subjective viewpoint but i personally can't see it any other way.

For me even though our team feels better at times, especially in the second half of this season, even though we have spent more money and made some good buys and in my opinion improved the squad we still seem to have stagnated for yet another season.

Once again this for me points to Wenger not knowing what to do with an improved squad to get consistently better results, for some reason where we have improved seems to be negated by being worse under him other places.

I also think those quotes from Ivan in my opinion are disgraceful if they are true, following a football team as a supporter should always first and foremost be about the team achieving results on the pitch and the pure enjoyment that comes from that, when i watch the Arsenal i'm only interested in watching them play well even if they lose, i may hate it when they do but i can live with that as long as they put in a good performance the last thing on my mind is how well they are doing financially.

Yet again we are shown exactly where the top echelons of the clubs priorities are, sad but a fact of life for Arsenal fans these days, i cannot believe that many other clubs would be so dismissive of their fans by allowing a statement like that to be made.

[BFG4]

I don't get the obsession with whether we have made progress or not. The fact is we aren't winning the league title again this year, and again we didn't even challenge for it. Look at the league this year, and most of the teams are shit. Man City have stopped playing since Christmas, United are relying on donkey Fellaini, while Liverpool are just terrible. We have an average Chelsea team running away with the title, and yet some think Wenger deserves credit for an 8 game winning run that might lead us to being runners up in a one sided title race. Some posters on here like to remind everyone that we have no divine right to win the title, but to not even challenge at a time when the league is terrible shows how poor Wenger is. As we keep interchanging between 2nd, 3rd and 4th over the next few seasons I am sure the progress debate will continue, but the only real chance of proper progress is when Wenger leaves and we get a new era at the club.

[GoonerMuzz]

I think the obsession with progression, for me at least, comes from finally coming to terms with the fact that no matter how much i hate Wenger as a manager and want rid of him its not going to happen until he decides to go.

I therefore am trying to clutch at straws and find some forward momentum in terms of where the club is headed and unfortunately not really being able to find any. For me finishing second this season would really not show progression as as far as i can see there is none. One or two decent games against better teams doesn't really balance out the woeful performances against others such as Anderlecht, Monaco, Southampton, Stoke etc.

There's an old maxim that second place is actually the first loser and for me i dont think it has ever been truer than if we end up second this season, the way things are headed even if we do end up in second which i actually feel is a real possibility it still wont feel much different than finishing 4th as we still have been unable to challenge realistically in anything other than the FA cup.

I would feel progression had been achieved if we'd made a concerted effort to challenge realistically in at least one other competition, not win it, but at least feel that we had given our all in it and i don't think there is one other poster on here who can justifiably claim we have done so.

[augie]

I don't get the obsession with whether we have made progress or not. The fact is we aren't winning the league title again this year, and again we didn't even challenge for it. Look at the league this year, and most of the teams are shit. Man City have stopped playing since Christmas, United are relying on donkey Fellaini, while Liverpool are just terrible. We have an average Chelsea team running away with the title, and yet some think Wenger deserves credit for an 8 game winning run that might lead us to being runners up in a one sided title race. Some posters on here like to remind everyone that we have no divine right to win the title, but to not even challenge at a time when the league is terrible shows how poor Wenger is. As we keep interchanging between 2nd, 3rd and 4th over the next few seasons I am sure the progress debate will continue, but the only real chance of proper progress is when Wenger leaves and we get a new era at the club.

Can only speak for myself of course, but for me the obsession with progress or lack thereof stems from the fact that the pro wenker camp are claiming that we have progressed and are using this notion to defend wenker I'm not for one second claiming that all fans believing that we have progressed are wenker fans, but the progression statement originated from the akb camp imo. I'm not against the use of the word progression and it would be great (for me) if I felt that we are indeed progressing, but the facts that are being used to back up this are selective at best -this too would be ok with me but the same fans are dismissing conflicting stats that suggest that we are not progressing so to me you either are prepared to use ALL stats or use no stats at all

[augie]

Who said that brainwashing doesnt work ?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footba ... eason.html

Here is a few of my favourites from the piece -

'I think, especially this season, not many people thought we would be challenging for the Premier League.
Err what challenge would that be then ? Did I miss that happening cos I certainly dont remember it

'In this calendar year, we have been the best team in Europe"
Embarrassing to even say that - le cock will be well proud


'There aren't many injuries in the squad, which is important. If we had an injury-free season, I think we could lift the title."
Based on what ? We play a good half season every season and he thinks that proves that we can win the title ? Injuries didnt make us lose at southampton or stoke or swansea, and it didnt make us drop points against hull (at home ) or against leicester

[SPUDMASHER]

it was a case of showing possible extremes

I am seriously worried about you

Oh apologies. I forget, your thing is "playing devil's advocate" (usually when it comes to talking Arsene up)
But that's cool!

And your thing is talking bollocks to wind people up.

Ever thought of joining a cricket forum?

[Gunner Rob]

Who said that brainwashing doesnt work ?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footba ... eason.html

Here is a few of my favourites from the piece -

'I think, especially this season, not many people thought we would be challenging for the Premier League.
Err what challenge would that be then ? Did I miss that happening cos I certainly dont remember it

'In this calendar year, we have been the best team in Europe"
Embarrassing to even say that - le cock will be well proud


'There aren't many injuries in the squad, which is important. If we had an injury-free season, I think we could lift the title."
Based on what ? We play a good half season every season and he thinks that proves that we can win the title ? Injuries didnt make us lose at southampton or stoke or swansea, and it didnt make us drop points against hull (at home ) or against leicester

there have been a few embarrassing quotes from our players down the years but this one......this one is just about the most ridiculous statement I have ever read. I mean how on earth can he think we are the best team in Europe???