and when I am sure that Magic Hats comments are real and I have not just walked theough a wardrobe into Narnia!
My God this place is getting daft!
SORRY,, WHERE NOT GOOD ENOUGH
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gus ceasar is a legend
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Chunky The Gooner
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no offence mate but no ,, there was a time when i would argue that none of chelsea liverpool or man u players would get in our team,, now its the other way round,, outside of cesc and rvp none of the rest of our team would be starters for the teams that hav won the last 3 leaguesMagic Hat wrote:I would take out Rosiciky and add Helb since he is for me one of the best in the Prem and is highly underrated, Jens (yes he has had a bad start to the season I know), Gilberto (Brazil captain, only Machenoro is better at what he does), depends though if your just adding 1st teamers or the squad of a championship winning side here on other players. Sanga has impressed me enough to think he may be one of best right backs in Prem this season and Silva could be in a title worthy side.
What?! You're seriously saying that Sliva and Sanga are good enough for a title worthy team? I'm not saying they're not, but how on earth can you say that this early? Especially about Eduardo...Magic Hat wrote:I would take out Rosiciky and add Helb since he is for me one of the best in the Prem and is highly underrated, Jens (yes he has had a bad start to the season I know), Gilberto (Brazil captain, only Machenoro is better at what he does), depends though if your just adding 1st teamers or the squad of a championship winning side here on other players. Sanga has impressed me enough to think he may be one of best right backs in Prem this season and Silva could be in a title worthy side.
Fair enough about Rosicky. I know he isn't everyone's favourite, but I like him. Helb is not good enough and today was a perfect example why. He does not offer enough of a goal threat and he does NOT help out his right back. Flamini was caught out time and time again today simply because he was getting no help.
Jens Lehmann? Puh-lease...
Gilberto? Again, I understand there will be some people who like him, but before last season, no one, and I mean NO ONE would have described him as world class, so I think that is totally based on one season.
Tony Saunders - "Gilberto? Again, I understand there will be some people who like him, but before last season, no one, and I mean NO ONE would have described him as world class, so I think that is totally based on one season."[/quote]
no way! gilberto has always been the player that we miss badly especially PP (post-paddy) when hes out apart from last season where he improved other aspects of his game definately moving him up to the status of world class, i know hes not spectacular but AT WHAT HE DOES there are very few better in the world - hes no centre back tho!!!
Jens still has it in him as is perfectly put in the recent article on the onlinegooner home page
however it is definaely true that the rest are simply decent squad players (senderos, hleb, adebayor) or hugely promising but untested (eduardo, sagna, denilson, walcott, diaby) so yes id agree that theres no way that wer championship winning material yet but still think wer worth a cup and a finish thats higher than the widely predicted 4th
no way! gilberto has always been the player that we miss badly especially PP (post-paddy) when hes out apart from last season where he improved other aspects of his game definately moving him up to the status of world class, i know hes not spectacular but AT WHAT HE DOES there are very few better in the world - hes no centre back tho!!!
Jens still has it in him as is perfectly put in the recent article on the onlinegooner home page
however it is definaely true that the rest are simply decent squad players (senderos, hleb, adebayor) or hugely promising but untested (eduardo, sagna, denilson, walcott, diaby) so yes id agree that theres no way that wer championship winning material yet but still think wer worth a cup and a finish thats higher than the widely predicted 4th
Ben,
Fair enough. I have time for decent and balanced views of the team like that. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but those who are of the opinion that everything is hunky dory are either kidding themselves or settling for second (or fourth) best.
I have to disagree with you totally on Gilberto. As I've said on many other threads, I have nothing against the bloke and in fact, I quite like him. But I would never describe him as world class. What's more, I'd say that not only are there plenty of players in the world who do his job better, there are plenty of players in the league who do his job either just as good or better than he.
Also, although Jens may well have a few decent performances in him, but for your first choice goalkeeper, you want someone reliable. Can you seriously tell me that Jens Lehmann is reliable? Again, I love the bloke but he isn't (he was, but isn't any more) a Championship winning goalkeeper.
Now I'm not going to throw my toys out of the pram, because I remember a time when the football we played was a lot shitter than this. I think my overall point is that I don't like how deluded quite a few of our fanbase seem to be. It always used to be something I despised in Spurs fans and I'd hate to see us go down the same road.
No, we're not a terrible team and in fact, we're quite a good team. But we're nothing more than that. So please, can people not tell me about how 'world class' people like Sagna and Eduardo clearly are and for Christ's sake, I really don't want to hear about how good Hleb and Adebayor are!
Sorry, I'm a little grumpy this morning!
Fair enough. I have time for decent and balanced views of the team like that. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but those who are of the opinion that everything is hunky dory are either kidding themselves or settling for second (or fourth) best.
I have to disagree with you totally on Gilberto. As I've said on many other threads, I have nothing against the bloke and in fact, I quite like him. But I would never describe him as world class. What's more, I'd say that not only are there plenty of players in the world who do his job better, there are plenty of players in the league who do his job either just as good or better than he.
Also, although Jens may well have a few decent performances in him, but for your first choice goalkeeper, you want someone reliable. Can you seriously tell me that Jens Lehmann is reliable? Again, I love the bloke but he isn't (he was, but isn't any more) a Championship winning goalkeeper.
Now I'm not going to throw my toys out of the pram, because I remember a time when the football we played was a lot shitter than this. I think my overall point is that I don't like how deluded quite a few of our fanbase seem to be. It always used to be something I despised in Spurs fans and I'd hate to see us go down the same road.
No, we're not a terrible team and in fact, we're quite a good team. But we're nothing more than that. So please, can people not tell me about how 'world class' people like Sagna and Eduardo clearly are and for Christ's sake, I really don't want to hear about how good Hleb and Adebayor are!
Sorry, I'm a little grumpy this morning!
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Hagbard 23
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OK, were three games into the season and were sixth in the table.
If we had played our game in hand and won, we would possibly be
top. So its not all doom and gloom.
Not yet anyway.
Having watched the game in a bar, I have to say though, I'm far
from impressed.
Three games in and the team is semi depleted already. It can only
get worse I fear.
I just read various comments like:
"were nowhere near our best"
"Sagna may be one of the best right backs in the prem"
"Silva could be in a title worthy side"
Its time to stop deluding yourselves fellow Gooners.WAKE UP TO
REALITY.
There is no way that this current squad will in any shape or form
be challenging for the title.Wenger, it seems to me, is going into
this campaign on a dare. His refusal to purchase a quality experienced
player(s) smacks of pride, bordering on obsession.
He may have some kind of 'masterplan' in his head, but I for one
don't like the direction he's steering this club.
We seem to be going backwards not forwards.
After the break-up of the invincibles this is the squad we have now.
He's been building this team for three years.IT's NOT GOOD ENOUGH.
If we had played our game in hand and won, we would possibly be
top. So its not all doom and gloom.
Not yet anyway.
Having watched the game in a bar, I have to say though, I'm far
from impressed.
Three games in and the team is semi depleted already. It can only
get worse I fear.
I just read various comments like:
"were nowhere near our best"
"Sagna may be one of the best right backs in the prem"
"Silva could be in a title worthy side"
Its time to stop deluding yourselves fellow Gooners.WAKE UP TO
REALITY.
There is no way that this current squad will in any shape or form
be challenging for the title.Wenger, it seems to me, is going into
this campaign on a dare. His refusal to purchase a quality experienced
player(s) smacks of pride, bordering on obsession.
He may have some kind of 'masterplan' in his head, but I for one
don't like the direction he's steering this club.
We seem to be going backwards not forwards.
After the break-up of the invincibles this is the squad we have now.
He's been building this team for three years.IT's NOT GOOD ENOUGH.
A championship winning team is just that....a team, not a collection of individuals that we can list and say that there are 11 players who are good enough to win the league. It's about how one blends the class with the workers. All the better if the workers possess class as well. 2-in-1,
All of the players who are considered our starting line-up are good enough to be in a championship winning side. Why, because..O'Shea, Fletcher and Richardson were. Squad players?? They played enough times in the first team to make a significant contribution. And I think that examples of such like could be brought up time and again. However, what we do not possess is enough of the very highest quality players who offset the above mentioned.
So what do we have now?
We are not good enough to be playing our favoured formation, with the blend that we have (of course, I am discounting the injuries). This team does not work. If we keep the current squad, and therefore, the likely starting-line up and formation - then we will not challenge for the league. If we keep playing 4-4-2 with what we have, then we don't have the personnel.
We have a better chance of challenging with this set of players if we change formation to give the "wide-men" real freedom to attack and more protection to the back. I mean, if we are not going to invest in a quality wide-man, then what is the point of us keep going down this road during games. All we do is put over nothing crosses, to nobody in the centre, or win corners and then.....nothing! And if the wide men aren't going to help out the full-backs, then they need to be playing in a system which better utilises what they can do.
It seems that either AW is acutely aware of what we need but can't shop in Harrods or that he genuinely wants to go down this road as some sort of moral crusade against Chelsea. Whatever, we lack some quality. All of the players that are considered first-team could play in a championship-winning side - just not at the same time and not with how they are lining-up.
If we don't sign anyone, then we need to change the system to best utilise the attacking players we have and better cover the defence. This way we will have a better chance of doing something.
All of the players who are considered our starting line-up are good enough to be in a championship winning side. Why, because..O'Shea, Fletcher and Richardson were. Squad players?? They played enough times in the first team to make a significant contribution. And I think that examples of such like could be brought up time and again. However, what we do not possess is enough of the very highest quality players who offset the above mentioned.
So what do we have now?
We are not good enough to be playing our favoured formation, with the blend that we have (of course, I am discounting the injuries). This team does not work. If we keep the current squad, and therefore, the likely starting-line up and formation - then we will not challenge for the league. If we keep playing 4-4-2 with what we have, then we don't have the personnel.
We have a better chance of challenging with this set of players if we change formation to give the "wide-men" real freedom to attack and more protection to the back. I mean, if we are not going to invest in a quality wide-man, then what is the point of us keep going down this road during games. All we do is put over nothing crosses, to nobody in the centre, or win corners and then.....nothing! And if the wide men aren't going to help out the full-backs, then they need to be playing in a system which better utilises what they can do.
It seems that either AW is acutely aware of what we need but can't shop in Harrods or that he genuinely wants to go down this road as some sort of moral crusade against Chelsea. Whatever, we lack some quality. All of the players that are considered first-team could play in a championship-winning side - just not at the same time and not with how they are lining-up.
If we don't sign anyone, then we need to change the system to best utilise the attacking players we have and better cover the defence. This way we will have a better chance of doing something.
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Chunky The Gooner
- Posts: 2732
- Joined: Sun Sep 10, 2006 6:19 pm
- Location: The Kebab Shop
1103 Posts ? The mans gone mad 
Well done (again) Rebel
I went to the game and yes people say at least we won and last season its a game we would have drawn or lost . We beat them at home last season! Fulham were shit and Man City too and Blackburn we could have won but we are obviously not scoring enough goals and Tony Saunders highlighted it out about Hleb. Although in my humble opinion he is playing better this season he still offers no support to the right back. Yes yesterday he wasnt as forward as the Fulham game but Flamini did get exposed a few times when he had no cover and when that happens one of the centre halves comes across to help and leaves the middle one short. I like Tommy at least he likes to put a tackle in. As for 2 midfielders playing in defence yeasterday well I think that says it all !
Well done (again) Rebel
I went to the game and yes people say at least we won and last season its a game we would have drawn or lost . We beat them at home last season! Fulham were shit and Man City too and Blackburn we could have won but we are obviously not scoring enough goals and Tony Saunders highlighted it out about Hleb. Although in my humble opinion he is playing better this season he still offers no support to the right back. Yes yesterday he wasnt as forward as the Fulham game but Flamini did get exposed a few times when he had no cover and when that happens one of the centre halves comes across to help and leaves the middle one short. I like Tommy at least he likes to put a tackle in. As for 2 midfielders playing in defence yeasterday well I think that says it all !
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charliegeorgewhocanhitem
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- Location: Sunny Essex
Not a great performance but we won and the same could be said of the chavs yesterday but I agree, their sqaud has much more depth than ours and the number of early season injuries we're getting is starting to worry me. I hope that Sagna's was'nt serious, I've been very impresed with him so far. Arsene really will have to reconsider his "not in the market for any more players" policy if this carries on and there's only a few days until the transfer window closes so our season could be fucked before it's really begun due to a weakened squad. Anyone know if we can call Djourou back from Birmingham if we need to? Oh well, it could be worse, I could be a spud or a manc 
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All_Arsenal_1886
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Magic HatMagic Hat wrote:I would take out Rosiciky and add Helb since he is for me one of the best in the Prem and is highly underrated, Jens (yes he has had a bad start to the season I know), Gilberto (Brazil captain, only Machenoro is better at what he does), depends though if your just adding 1st teamers or the squad of a championship winning side here on other players. Sanga has impressed me enough to think he may be one of best right backs in Prem this season and Silva could be in a title worthy side.
Where do you sit at AG because the view you are getting is different to 60,000 others.Helb was back to his worse yestereday giving the ball away and failing to shoot when in great positions,Helb one of the best in the premiership!!!!! you must be kidding.Yes we won but Man City will not finish in the top 10 and we struggled yesteday.The squad is not strong enough.Two midfielders playing in the back four!!!!! i have said all summer we needed another centre half and that was with Djourou at the club.The partnership of RVP and Adebayor didn"t work.I would buy the best striker in the premiership on curent form Anelka before the window closes.
Magic Hat maybe you sit next to Wenger.I will be amazed if this team gets within 15pts of Chelski.
I'm saying they could be but as you say, too early. Why I used "may be" not isWhat?! You're seriously saying that Sliva and Sanga are good enough for a title worthy team? I'm not saying they're not, but how on earth can you say that this early? Especially about Eduardo...
Two goals and an assist so far this season, not bad but I agree, he hasn't played that well this season. The times I have seen him live, he does help out the right back and I am disappointed that he didn't against Man City.Fair enough about Rosicky. I know he isn't everyone's favourite, but I like him. Helb is not good enough and today was a perfect example why. He does not offer enough of a goal threat and he does NOT help out his right back. Flamini was caught out time and time again today simply because he was getting no help.
Yep, his performances while injured have been erratic so far, brilliance against Sparta aside and last season was mixed but he can still be top class.Jens Lehmann? Puh-lease...
Plays in 2002 world cup, Brazil win it, despite public calls to play in 2006 he doesn't and Brazil struggle. Plays in invincible season but is injured the next one, he was an important part of our CL run and ok yes, last season was fantastic but I don't expect him to ever score so many goals again. Makele was better but not anymore and Masch is but while Hargreves is more all round, I prefer Gilberto.Gilberto? Again, I understand there will be some people who like him, but before last season, no one, and I mean NO ONE would have described him as world class, so I think that is totally based on one season.
Fulham are organised and tough, Man City could well get into the Uefa cup, what worries me far more is the performance against Blackburn, from what I heard and Sparta. My argument is potential more then performance, as a team, based so far. Are there concerns? Yes, of course.2 wins and a draw and some people think everytings rosey in the garden,, man city are shit,, simple,, fulham are shit,,simple, we laboured 2 win both games.. when it coms 2 it we hav gone fom a team of world class players 2 a team of good players,, and that is not good enough for THE ARSENAL,
Bit of an assumption there my friendWhere do you sit at AG because the view you are getting is different to 60,000 others.
3rd in Fink Tank player of last season, yep, must be rubbish.Helb was back to his worse yestereday giving the ball away and failing to shoot when in great positions,Helb one of the best in the premiership!!!!! you must be kidding
Think that is harsh on Man City who have yet to get their first choice keeper back, have a strong defence and are quite good going forward.Yes we won but Man City will not finish in the top 10 and we struggled yesteday.
so we need 5 cb's? 6 if you count Sanga as an option? How many team's have 5 cb's?he squad is not strong enough.Two midfielders playing in the back four!!!!! i have said all summer we needed another centre half and that was with Djourou at the club
Ade not being match fit might have something to do with it but wouldn't want Anelka given his history.he partnership of RVP and Adebayor didn"t work
How long before we see this potential translated into achievement?
Arsene is gambling by not backing up the potential of those players who have it. We do not have sufficient depth of quality in the team to challenge for a whole season.
And how many long passes did Fabregas play yesterday - simply crying out for an Anelka type to give us a different option. Fabregas is one of the best long passers in the league and we don't utilise this. That is a waste.
Arsene is gambling by not backing up the potential of those players who have it. We do not have sufficient depth of quality in the team to challenge for a whole season.
And how many long passes did Fabregas play yesterday - simply crying out for an Anelka type to give us a different option. Fabregas is one of the best long passers in the league and we don't utilise this. That is a waste.
