Mate gave up his S/T. B/O have asked for a letter to confirm

[Connolly55]

The price is the only thing stopping me getting a ST. I cant stomach spending that kind of money on a ST.

[HashKads]

To be honest I feel for this guy because he is in a position that a lot of other people are in. In his letter he states that he isn't happy with the way the club is being run or the way the team is going which is what I'd say over 80% of people on here are saying. Its irrelevant of how long he has had a ST for, he feels the club are going backwards so he's getting less for his money and its a lot of money. My renewal is coming up and I am sure that money could go to a lot of other uses if I didn't renew it but I am in a position where I can renew. Its a crazy amount of money to some people. If you were buying some cornflakes from the supermarket and everytime you went there were less in the box but still getting charged the same, you'd stop buying them. Doesn't mean you don't like them anymore, just means its not viable for you to buy. Just because he gave up his ST doesn't mean he doesn't support Arsenal anymore.

[USMartin]

To be honest I feel for this guy because he is in a position that a lot of other people are in. In his letter he states that he isn't happy with the way the club is being run or the way the team is going which is what I'd say over 80% of people on here are saying. Its irrelevant of how long he has had a ST for, he feels the club are going backwards so he's getting less for his money and its a lot of money. My renewal is coming up and I am sure that money could go to a lot of other uses if I didn't renew it but I am in a position where I can renew. Its a crazy amount of money to some people. If you were buying some cornflakes from the supermarket and everytime you went there were less in the box but still getting charged the same, you'd stop buying them. Doesn't mean you don't like them anymore, just means its not viable for you to buy. Just because he gave up his ST doesn't mean he doesn't support Arsenal anymore.

Well Said. We do have a right not to be happy and not to give our money to a Board who deliberately mis-lead us about how it will be used and why.

The truth is I don't think any of us who truly love Arsenal will ever stop loving Arsenal. Not renewing is a less a divorce from the club than it is just an end to the romance if not the passion between a supporter and the club. The thrill is gone as B. B. King has said a few times...

[QuartzGooner]

Just because he gave up his ST doesn't mean he doesn't support Arsenal anymore.

If it is financial, then it is understandable.

If his sole reason for giving up his season ticket is loss of form of the team, I just cannot respect it.

You can certainly be a fan after giving up a season ticket, and there are times in life when people might want to travel, or work abroad for a bit, and that is all reasonable.


Key thing for me is that this supporter never stood through the down times of the 60's, 70's or 80's.
He joined the bandwagon in 1995, now turns and runs at the first sign of trouble!
If you turn your back because of poor form, and let us be honest, it is relative poor form because we are way better than we were for chunks of the 70's and 80's....then you have to question what the club actually means to you.


This is not like going to the cinema or the theatre.

This is your team, your club, it is part of who you are.

[USMartin]

But then doesn't that mean the Board who nisist the club is part of who they are and of whom many supporters believe that deserve to be held to hi9gher scrutiny then?

While I don't feel you ought to be suggesting that you are more of a supporter than anyone as much as I admire your loyalty at times it suggests to me you ought to be MORE angry about the lack of passion for ther club shown by the Board than anyone. They are taking your loyalty for granted and have little or no real respect for it frabnkly as their actions or lack of them demonstrate. To me the Board has let you down more than anybody because you have supported the club no matter so much.

As I said earlier you confuse loyalty with self-abuse, semmingly content to drive your wife or girlfriend round to her fancy man's then wait all night for her to finish her "business" then drive her home and fix her breakfast and set her bath because you love her too much to risk losing her for standing up for yourself and your self-respect. Do you really think she still loves or respects you the way she ought to when you accept this crap?

Its the same here. Do you think the Board cares at all how you feel if you just accept what they do without question?

[flash gunner]

Just because he gave up his ST doesn't mean he doesn't support Arsenal anymore.

If it is financial, then it is understandable.

If his sole reason for giving up his season ticket is loss of form of the team, I just cannot respect it.

You can certainly be a fan after giving up a season ticket, and there are times in life when people might want to travel, or work abroad for a bit, and that is all reasonable.


Key thing for me is that this supporter never stood through the down times of the 60's, 70's or 80's.
He joined the bandwagon in 1995, now turns and runs at the first sign of trouble!
If you turn your back because of poor form, and let us be honest, it is relative poor form because we are way better than we were for chunks of the 70's and 80's....then you have to question what the club actually means to you.


This is not like going to the cinema or the theatre.

This is your team, your club, it is part of who you are.

I agree with you Quartz and if i had the cash id have a season ticket tomorrow but due to family commitments i cant see that happening for a while but if youre not happy with things happening at the club and not enjoying it then giving up the season ticket doesnt mean youre not a Gooner anymore. As i said id have one tomorrow though if possible

[BournemouthRED]

I hear people talk about the bad times of the 80's etc. Sounds like paradise to me, value for money st, no waiting list, stood there with your mates week in week out smoking drinking and singing ALL game
Long!

Knowing my luck ill get offered a st in the upper tier for 1500 quid and be sat next to some tarquin! I think the overall matchday experience is a massive factor
For me.

[USMartin]

Just because he gave up his ST doesn't mean he doesn't support Arsenal anymore.

If it is financial, then it is understandable.

If his sole reason for giving up his season ticket is loss of form of the team, I just cannot respect it.

You can certainly be a fan after giving up a season ticket, and there are times in life when people might want to travel, or work abroad for a bit, and that is all reasonable.


Key thing for me is that this supporter never stood through the down times of the 60's, 70's or 80's.
He joined the bandwagon in 1995, now turns and runs at the first sign of trouble!
If you turn your back because of poor form, and let us be honest, it is relative poor form because we are way better than we were for chunks of the 70's and 80's....then you have to question what the club actually means to you.


This is not like going to the cinema or the theatre.

This is your team, your club, it is part of who you are.

I agree with you Quartz and if i had the cash id have a season ticket tomorrow but due to family commitments i cant see that happening for a while but if youre not happy with things happening at the club and not enjoying it then giving up the season ticket doesnt mean youre not a Gooner anymore. As i said id have one tomorrow though if possible

I agree Flash - giving up your ticket doesn't make you less of a Gooner anymore than keeping your ticket and happily accepting being cheated and disrespected for your loyalty does. If I lived over there and had an opportunity I'd snap it up without thinking about it. I'd even if won the lottery seriously consider buying a flat in Highbury Square despite my anger at the the decision to re-develop the property ourselves and its negative impact on Arsenal Football Club.

I would just make it clear it was unhappy with what the Board was doing and how and why they did it, and wouldn't pretend either that the Board are just Gooners with money who love Arsenal as any of us do or that itt doesn't matter whether they do or not. But that wouldn't keep me being 100% behind the team every match no matter what was at stake becay=use the team IS Arsenal. The team is a part of me, and since the team is the club the club is a part of me. The Board is not the club and their actions and the motives behind them prove that beyond any doubt [/b]

[QuartzGooner]

The Board is not the club and their actions and the motives behind them prove that beyond any doubt [/b]

Board members can be fans just like anyone else, some have worked hard for the club, and the motives behind their actions only cast doubt on this in your opinion.

(See previous threads for relevant arguments!)

http://www.onlinegooner.com/phpbb2/view ... 2&start=90

http://www.onlinegooner.com/phpbb2/view ... 55&start=0

[USMartin]

Right QG.....

Anyone who could be bothered to read all that can figure out that your arguments are - and I mean this as respectfully as I can say it - full of it.

Of course you aren't even willing to say you're right or wrong for 50 years which betrays your lack of confidence in your own argument.

Are you willing to say the current Board is made up of Directors more interested in using the club to make themselves wealthier rather than the club's competitive success - yes or no? Can you answer that question with any conviction?

[This Is The Daybreak]

I hear people talk about the bad times of the 80's etc. Sounds like paradise to me, value for money st, no waiting list, stood there with your mates week in week out smoking drinking and singing ALL game
Long!

Knowing my luck ill get offered a st in the upper tier for 1500 quid and be sat next to some tarquin! I think the overall matchday experience is a massive factor
For me.

I agree...the people around you are very important. I got offered a season ticket at the start of the season just gone and was more concerned about being stuck next to a pleb week in week out rather than my view. Luckily the guys around me behind the goal are old school Arsenal, stand all the way through and are good crack, the view could be better but wouldn't move in the fear of being stuck next to an idiot.

[olgitgooner]

I'm looking forward to Quartz's reply to this.

My own feeling is that the younger Gooners have definately missed out on the very unsuccessful years that us older people lived through.

Some of those younger people have been spoilt by living through times when success, and beautiful football, have been the norm.

You have to suffer really bad times, in order to fully appreciate the good times.

I'm not being snobby here. Young Gooners are as passionate as the older variety. But maybe there is a big difference between our respective ideas of what we expect from our club.

My definition of a total football fan is somebody who supports a club like, for example, Burnley. No chance at all of success. But still turn up to support your team. Week after week. Year after year.

If one of ours decides to give up a season ticket, it's a personal choice.

But please don't blame it on the club.

[USMartin]

I'm looking forward to Quartz's reply to this.

My own feeling is that the younger Gooners have definately missed out on the very unsuccessful years that us older people lived through.

Some of those younger people have been spoilt by living through times when success, and beautiful football, have been the norm.

You have to suffer really bad times, in order to fully appreciate the good times.

I'm not being snobby here. Young Gooners are as passionate as the older variety. But maybe there is a big difference between our respective ideas of what we expect from our club.

My definition of a total football fan is somebody who supports a club like, for example, Burnley. No chance at all of success. But still turn up to support your team. Week after week. Year after year.

If one of ours decides to give up a season ticket, it's a personal choice.

But please don't blame it on the club.

I understand your point - I've supported Arsenal since the late 70s and have seen my share of crap football.

Having said that you cannot fault supporters for being born later in life in coming to support Arsenal later - even if they are genuine glory hunters. Genuine glory hunters are what we are looking to exploit in our maketing efforts around the world now after all. And clearly Nwankwokanu is not a glory hunter.

Also having said that the issue here is not simply whether we are winning silverware or not but whether our Board is making a genuine effort to give the manager the team and the club the best chance it can within reason to win any silverware. And I'd say looking at what we invested in the team from 1998-2005 and what the team achieved as a result and what we haven't invested in the team since 2005 the answer is pretty clear. Especially given how little we actually spent during those years.

And given the effort required to pay for a season ticket especially given the economy and the fact that most of us aren't multi-millionaires by a long shot thwe implication that we should expect more effort from the supporters to invest in the team than from multi-millionaires who could spend millions more without spending their own personal money even is a bit well, rich.

[Nick Bendtners Ego]

Look up the definition of the word 'Fanatic ' and you can't allay that to the guy who canceled his ST ...IF it was PURELY on Trophy related issues .
He does make a point as regards the financial implications but unfortunately
the point comes across as he's had enough due to the trophy room being a little barer of late There is no guarantee in this life (except death, Taxes ,The Lane been a shit hole ) and what i find these days is that every body wants things 'Now' and craves 'A Result ' at the click of a finger . This does not just extend to Trophies , look at the life expectancy of a Premiership manager foe example .
Now i know 5 barren years does constitute patience of a sort and as a Big Four club we should be in the Reckoning more than we have been of late but we have been knocking at a door that is increasingly going to get harder to get in . I agree with Olgitgooner that more recent Fans have had it easy and so it becomes all the more frustrating when Ticker tape and open top buses are in scarce supply .
As an Arsenal Fan since the 78/79 season i would have had good reason to stay away , rip up tickets , not attend , turn off the telly on a few occasions, so lets call a spade a spade (And Adebayor a c**t !) even when we were winning trophy's under Graham , it wasn't the prettiest of things . Imo the golden era of Arsenal FC began with Wenger and so many new Fans were rightly captivated and began a love affair with the club . Let us not forget , for every Wenger , there was a Rioch .
Sure the Guy still loves the club but spare a thought for perhaps REAL footie fans who week in , week out go to places like Darlington etc
Like all other fans i crave success but know that a clubs History is not built around a few good years . We're not the mob from the Bridge .

[USMartin]

Nick, I understand your point again as my support of the club dates back to the same time period.

But again that's not the relevant point.

The relevant point is whether its fair to expect supporters to keep giving so much to a club whose Board wants to give so little.

Its not simply about winning trophies - some of history's best sides haven't won trophies or haven't won nearly as many as you'd have expected. The issue is does our club care as much about doing the best they can as they count on supporters doing? Do they care about doiung the best they can to give the manager the team and the club they best possible chance they can to win trophies?

No team wins forever. Indeed no team has had the consistent history of winning that Arsenal Football Club has - none. We have won trophies in the 30s 40s 50s 70s 80s 90s and 00s. No other club can claim such a history. So that's not the issue. Its could we be doing more to achieve more now and should a Board that refuses to do more to try and achieve more be avb;e to count on unconditional support and incme from supporters.

I think the Board takes for granted the sacrifice many of us happily make out of love for Arsenal yet has no problem not matching that effort even as long as no one actually pressures tham to do so. And even simply relying on the self-sustaining business model our Board could if they wanted to more than match the very real sacrifice it routinely expects supporters to make and frankly takes for granted even while its much harder for us to do it even in the best of times.