I don't understand people making these 'I'll support the club no matter what' statements
surely whatever the morals of a situation we all want the club to be as good as possible on the field
in what way can som1 taking money out of the club help that...?
surely those of us that attend games don't want to be overcharged
somebody taking over the club will only increase that
this is a simple simple issue
baffles me that people so bl8antly take pleasure in their ignorance that they state they don't care
if you don't care who owns the club you clearly don't understand the issue
Chairman Usmanov!!!!
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Hagbard 23
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Doesn't Arsenal charge more than anyone else in the premiership for ticket prices ?highburyJD wrote: ...surely those of us that attend games don't want to be overcharged...
That probably means the most expensive in Europe.
Is there any club in the world that charges more, I wonder ?
Yeah the board really has our interests at heart.
Tell me highbury jd, where is the morality in the club seeking to copyright the phrase "Gooner" ? This is our (the fans) phrase and always has been and I for one do not appreciate the board trying to make any easy buck over it. I find it amazing that with the fear of an impending usmanov takeover on the horizon the fans seem to have elevated the current board to angel like status 
I also think you misread the signals from your fellow fans when you claim that they do not care. As far as I am concerned the club exists for the fans and our love of the club should be a constant regardless of the ownership. Some would have you believe that the board are fighting against a takeover here for the fans benefit but to me that is largely rubbish - they are fighting against this because(a) they do not want an usmanov character owning our club which is how we all feel (b) they do not want to see DD return to power at the club. This has turned into a silly personal vendetta between 2 men who used to be good friends and have now lead to this. As a fan who does care I am now at the point that I am just pissed off with the whole scenario and want it sorted one way or another and soon but I will still love and support the club no matter who is in charge be it phw,fiszman,usmanov or please god DD.
I also think you misread the signals from your fellow fans when you claim that they do not care. As far as I am concerned the club exists for the fans and our love of the club should be a constant regardless of the ownership. Some would have you believe that the board are fighting against a takeover here for the fans benefit but to me that is largely rubbish - they are fighting against this because(a) they do not want an usmanov character owning our club which is how we all feel (b) they do not want to see DD return to power at the club. This has turned into a silly personal vendetta between 2 men who used to be good friends and have now lead to this. As a fan who does care I am now at the point that I am just pissed off with the whole scenario and want it sorted one way or another and soon but I will still love and support the club no matter who is in charge be it phw,fiszman,usmanov or please god DD.
Hagbard 23 wrote:Doesn't Arsenal charge more than anyone else in the premiership for ticket prices ?highburyJD wrote: ...surely those of us that attend games don't want to be overcharged...
That probably means the most expensive in Europe.
Is there any club in the world that charges more, I wonder ?
Yeah the board really has our interests at heart.
I am pretty sure we have the highest prices in world football.
The board have shafted us enough for them not to have our blind trust. but when you have 2 plates in front of you and one has shit on it and the other has an Arsenal burger on it - they might both be disgusting and unpalatable, but the choice is clear.
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highburyJD
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who loses out fromthe clu copywriting gooner?
not the fanzine just the people who try and make money out of the name
our tickets are expensive - similar levels to spuds and chelski
investors are not looking to come in andput them down
cheap(er) tickets for league cup games have shown that filling the stadium is an aim (alongside maximising profit)
but so far the board has not taken one penny of that profit out
there's no wa any investor aiming to take over would replicate that
as far as I'm concerned if youdn't care about ownership you don't care about the club
not the fanzine just the people who try and make money out of the name
our tickets are expensive - similar levels to spuds and chelski
investors are not looking to come in andput them down
cheap(er) tickets for league cup games have shown that filling the stadium is an aim (alongside maximising profit)
but so far the board has not taken one penny of that profit out
there's no wa any investor aiming to take over would replicate that
as far as I'm concerned if youdn't care about ownership you don't care about the club
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essex womble
- Posts: 53
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Ownership
This is the first time I've posted on the forum. I guess I'm a part-time Arsenal fan, I attend Arsenal games as a Red Member when they don't coincide with AFC Wimbledon games.
I, like every other Wimbledon fan, learned that who owns your Club does matter. The continuity that the current board has given Arsenal has created a definate culture at the Club, as spelt out by Mr Wenger in his recent interview in France Football. That culture and those values seem to me to be at risk if control of the Club changes.
What happened to us , being bought by a bunch of dubious Norwegians and then being franchised to ****** Keynes, will never happen to Arsenal;
but at Premiership level today the board are the custodians of the Club for future generations of fans,and I'm sure that Dein's friend would not pass any moral background check. Ideally wondering aloud I wonder what impact it would have if the bulk of Club Members could be persuaded to join the Supporters Trust.
I genuinely think that a strong supporters voice is needed, let's face it players,managers, stadium,even owners eventually move on in one way or another. Fans are the one continuous link that a Club has. I'm not suggesting that fan ownership is a realistic target, but the Trust's influence could far outweigh the number of shares that it owns.
I'm not sure that anyone can afford to adopt the "I'm not interested in the politics of the Club" approach. Ownership matters.
I, like every other Wimbledon fan, learned that who owns your Club does matter. The continuity that the current board has given Arsenal has created a definate culture at the Club, as spelt out by Mr Wenger in his recent interview in France Football. That culture and those values seem to me to be at risk if control of the Club changes.
What happened to us , being bought by a bunch of dubious Norwegians and then being franchised to ****** Keynes, will never happen to Arsenal;
but at Premiership level today the board are the custodians of the Club for future generations of fans,and I'm sure that Dein's friend would not pass any moral background check. Ideally wondering aloud I wonder what impact it would have if the bulk of Club Members could be persuaded to join the Supporters Trust.
I genuinely think that a strong supporters voice is needed, let's face it players,managers, stadium,even owners eventually move on in one way or another. Fans are the one continuous link that a Club has. I'm not suggesting that fan ownership is a realistic target, but the Trust's influence could far outweigh the number of shares that it owns.
I'm not sure that anyone can afford to adopt the "I'm not interested in the politics of the Club" approach. Ownership matters.
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gus ceasar is a legend
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To say if you don't care about ownership you don't care about the club is frankly insulting!
Of course we all want the club to prosper but to think the only way forward is to stick with what we have now is ridiculous! I have said all along there may well be a happy compromise here that suits all! What we need is for the present board not to be so pig headed and to accept change! It doesn't mind doing that when it suits now that Kroenke is the lesser of two evils in its eyes does it? Until Usmanov and Dein appeared Kroenke was public enemy number 1....now he is the boards white knight!
All I have said is that we should not allow the political wranglings to divert us from our true love which should be the team! That's quite simple! If you don't agree then I suggest you give up whatever priviledges you have towards purchasing tickets should a takeover happen! Arsenal is about football not bloody politics!
Sorry but like I said your comment was outrageously wide of the mark and fucking rude! Just because I care more about the team whatever money grabbing *word censored* is in charge then playing Gordon Gecko and speculating on something we all know very little about, please don't question my love for Arsenal!
Of course we all want the club to prosper but to think the only way forward is to stick with what we have now is ridiculous! I have said all along there may well be a happy compromise here that suits all! What we need is for the present board not to be so pig headed and to accept change! It doesn't mind doing that when it suits now that Kroenke is the lesser of two evils in its eyes does it? Until Usmanov and Dein appeared Kroenke was public enemy number 1....now he is the boards white knight!
All I have said is that we should not allow the political wranglings to divert us from our true love which should be the team! That's quite simple! If you don't agree then I suggest you give up whatever priviledges you have towards purchasing tickets should a takeover happen! Arsenal is about football not bloody politics!
Sorry but like I said your comment was outrageously wide of the mark and fucking rude! Just because I care more about the team whatever money grabbing *word censored* is in charge then playing Gordon Gecko and speculating on something we all know very little about, please don't question my love for Arsenal!
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I Hate Hleb
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NICE POST ESSEX WOMBLE AND THANKS FOR YOUR CONTRIBUTION. YOU'RE RIGHT TO SAY THAT IF MORE FANS JOINED A SUPPORTERS GROUP, OUR VOICES WOULD HAVE MORE OF AN IMPACT.
AS YOU CAN PROBABLY TELL BY READING SOME OF THE PREVIOUS POSTS, THIS SUBJECT - ALTHOUGH ON THE SURFACE BEING SOMETHNG WE ALL SHOULD BE ABLE TO AGREE ON - HAS THE CAPACITY TO DIVIDE AS WELL.
ALTHOUGH SOME PEOPLE SAY IT'S NOT WORTH WORRYING BECAUSE WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT WHO OWNS THE CLUB, I DO CARE ABOUT WHO OWNS ARSENAL. THE ONE THING I KNOW FOR CERTAIN IS THAT ARSENAL IS MY TEAM, MY CLUB, REGARDLESS OF WHO OWNS THE ACTUAL SHARES, AND WOE BETIDE ANYONE THAT TRYS TO HARM IT'S FUTURE - BE THEY THE CURRENT BOARD OR ANY OTHERS WITH DUBIOUS MOTIVES.
BELIEVE IT OR NOT, SOME POWER DOES LIE IN OUR HANDS AND IF, AS ARSENAL FANS, WE THINK THE CLUB IS BEING STEERED IN THE WRONG DIRECTION, THEN THERE IS NO NEED TO STOP BEING A FAN OF THE TEAM. DIFFICULT AS IT MIGHT BE, WE CAN SIMPLY STOP GIVING THE CLUB OUR MONEY BY NOT BUYING TICKETS AND MERCHANDISING.
I KNOW THAT WITH A LONG WAITING LIST, OUR TICKETS WOULD PROBABLY (ALTHOUGH I BELIEVE ONLY INITIALLY) GET NEW OWNERS, BUT IF ENOUGH PEOPLE FELT AND ACTED THAT WAY, THERE WOULD SOON BE AN IMPACT THAT THE CLUB COULDN'T JUST IGNORE - IF ONLY FOR FINANCIAL REASONS.
WHATEVER YOU FEEL ABOUT THE CURRENT BOARDROOM BATTLE - AND PERSONALLY I'M AGAINST A TAKE-OVER BY USMANOV - LET'S NOT FORGET THAT WE HAVE THE POWER, ULTIMATELY, TO DECIDE WHETHER OR NOT TO GIVE THEM OUR CASH, AND NO-ONE CAN TAKE THAT POWER AWAY FROM US (EXCEPT MAYBE THE MRS OR THE CHANCELLOR! ). 
AS YOU CAN PROBABLY TELL BY READING SOME OF THE PREVIOUS POSTS, THIS SUBJECT - ALTHOUGH ON THE SURFACE BEING SOMETHNG WE ALL SHOULD BE ABLE TO AGREE ON - HAS THE CAPACITY TO DIVIDE AS WELL.
ALTHOUGH SOME PEOPLE SAY IT'S NOT WORTH WORRYING BECAUSE WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT WHO OWNS THE CLUB, I DO CARE ABOUT WHO OWNS ARSENAL. THE ONE THING I KNOW FOR CERTAIN IS THAT ARSENAL IS MY TEAM, MY CLUB, REGARDLESS OF WHO OWNS THE ACTUAL SHARES, AND WOE BETIDE ANYONE THAT TRYS TO HARM IT'S FUTURE - BE THEY THE CURRENT BOARD OR ANY OTHERS WITH DUBIOUS MOTIVES.
BELIEVE IT OR NOT, SOME POWER DOES LIE IN OUR HANDS AND IF, AS ARSENAL FANS, WE THINK THE CLUB IS BEING STEERED IN THE WRONG DIRECTION, THEN THERE IS NO NEED TO STOP BEING A FAN OF THE TEAM. DIFFICULT AS IT MIGHT BE, WE CAN SIMPLY STOP GIVING THE CLUB OUR MONEY BY NOT BUYING TICKETS AND MERCHANDISING.
I KNOW THAT WITH A LONG WAITING LIST, OUR TICKETS WOULD PROBABLY (ALTHOUGH I BELIEVE ONLY INITIALLY) GET NEW OWNERS, BUT IF ENOUGH PEOPLE FELT AND ACTED THAT WAY, THERE WOULD SOON BE AN IMPACT THAT THE CLUB COULDN'T JUST IGNORE - IF ONLY FOR FINANCIAL REASONS.
WHATEVER YOU FEEL ABOUT THE CURRENT BOARDROOM BATTLE - AND PERSONALLY I'M AGAINST A TAKE-OVER BY USMANOV - LET'S NOT FORGET THAT WE HAVE THE POWER, ULTIMATELY, TO DECIDE WHETHER OR NOT TO GIVE THEM OUR CASH, AND NO-ONE CAN TAKE THAT POWER AWAY FROM US (EXCEPT MAYBE THE MRS OR THE CHANCELLOR!
). Yes the board was so against change, they appointed an unknown manager, changed the badge and got us a new stadium. What they are against is the club being in debt to buy players when we have a 70 million transfer budget, people taking extra money out of the club and one person seizing control (I know that your optimistic that a saint will come along and beg us to accept cash for nothing in return but this isn't going to happen with Jabba).
So who thinks the Time will get in trouble for daring to suggest Jabba doesn't have a great record for honest buisness dealings?
So who thinks the Time will get in trouble for daring to suggest Jabba doesn't have a great record for honest buisness dealings?
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gunners-need-steel
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I can understand some fans saying all they want is the football .. and not the politics or details of ownership. But ownership dictates how a club operates, and whether it continues functioning successfully or fails.
So, I am not sure I understand how any serious fan can care less about who ends up owning their club.
I was one of those who criticised the craig murray allegations, as mere allegations devoid of concrete evidence.
Now, reading through and seeing a log of the considerable intimating attempts being made by Whoismanov against bloggers (even arsenal bloggers), and all without suing any single person to court, craig murray's 'allegations' start to ring true ...
There is no way we should allow someone as dodgy as this to end up owning this club we care so much about. If he wants a plaything or some symbolic status in the West, he should go elsewhere .. I heartell the spuds owners are eager to sell too ..
So, I am not sure I understand how any serious fan can care less about who ends up owning their club.
I was one of those who criticised the craig murray allegations, as mere allegations devoid of concrete evidence.
Now, reading through and seeing a log of the considerable intimating attempts being made by Whoismanov against bloggers (even arsenal bloggers), and all without suing any single person to court, craig murray's 'allegations' start to ring true ...
There is no way we should allow someone as dodgy as this to end up owning this club we care so much about. If he wants a plaything or some symbolic status in the West, he should go elsewhere .. I heartell the spuds owners are eager to sell too ..
We the fans have the power ?? Where did you get that line from IHH ? The strong anti takeover stance that the manure fans took didnt make much difference there did it and support wise they are bigger than us worldwide(although not for much longer). After the initial threats of boycotts their club has gone on as before with sell outs left right and centre and the same would happen with the emirates.
I think the point Gus was making is that, should the worst happen and usmanov did gain control, that he would still be the same commited supporter of the club that he always has been and I totally concur with that. When I started supporting the club I did not do so cos I thought phw was the dogs bollox or that ken friar was the best secretary in the world so my loyalty has always been to the club not the board and that aint changing anytime soon. Of course there is the understandable fear of the unknown when it comes to any possible new owner but specualation as to changes in policies that may occur then are just that specualation and until I hear an official statement from any new suitor proclaiming his intentions then I will reserve judgement(although I will say again that I do not want usmanov). We may all even be surprised in that the club may improve and I for one have claimed for some time now that there is certainly big room for improvements.
The main people with the future destiny of the club in their hands here are not the fans but the shareholders. These are the people who can decide whether they are willing to sell their shares for a hefty sum or would rather sit on a point of principle. The majority of these people bought shares in the clubs as an investment and so is it reasonable to expect these people to turn their noses up when offered over £10k for a share that was worth just over £6k a year ago ? I spoke with one very commited fan who stated that he would very seriously considering selling if he had any shares and we have to be realistic when we view what that money would mean to an ordinary man on the street. If I was a shareholder I honestly do not believe that the current board will not sell out at some stage so it would be hard for me not to sell.
I think the point Gus was making is that, should the worst happen and usmanov did gain control, that he would still be the same commited supporter of the club that he always has been and I totally concur with that. When I started supporting the club I did not do so cos I thought phw was the dogs bollox or that ken friar was the best secretary in the world so my loyalty has always been to the club not the board and that aint changing anytime soon. Of course there is the understandable fear of the unknown when it comes to any possible new owner but specualation as to changes in policies that may occur then are just that specualation and until I hear an official statement from any new suitor proclaiming his intentions then I will reserve judgement(although I will say again that I do not want usmanov). We may all even be surprised in that the club may improve and I for one have claimed for some time now that there is certainly big room for improvements.
The main people with the future destiny of the club in their hands here are not the fans but the shareholders. These are the people who can decide whether they are willing to sell their shares for a hefty sum or would rather sit on a point of principle. The majority of these people bought shares in the clubs as an investment and so is it reasonable to expect these people to turn their noses up when offered over £10k for a share that was worth just over £6k a year ago ? I spoke with one very commited fan who stated that he would very seriously considering selling if he had any shares and we have to be realistic when we view what that money would mean to an ordinary man on the street. If I was a shareholder I honestly do not believe that the current board will not sell out at some stage so it would be hard for me not to sell.
i can see IHH point but at the end of the day we the fans dont really register on any board members rader,, yes every now and again they try to be nice to red action or aisc etc but IT DOESNT MATTER,, i do not want usmanov at my club but no matter who protests or gives up there seat if change is going to happen then we can not stop it,, the shares are now at nearly 11k and how long can or will the currant board hold out,, last summer it was silent stan that people wanted in with dd and now because people view usmanov differently they have decided to stand by or current board,, the club have met with him after saying they wouldnt,, and who,s to know what way they think,, if usmanov wants control then mark my words he WILL get it ,, just look at man u,, they formed there own club in protest but old trafford is still full and so will the grove be,, i am an arsenal fan,supporter and proud to be a gooner, and no matter who owns the club that wont change,, but i do long for the days when no one knew who was the owner of other clubs,,,
The question was:
What I do want to know is the difference you feel it will make to you if Usmanov does take control of the club with Dein as his lieutenant?
To me, it would start at the top end of the scale - Can I stomach this man controlling my club? It would be a question of how far I am prepared to stretch my morals and values. As i have stretched them in the past and considering its the Arsenal, it would be hard for me so stop.
As for me going to football, I would go to the same pub. meet the same people, sit in the same seat.
As for what I watch, well that is dictated by Arsene Wenger - therefore it would be based upon his relationship with this man. of course, if Dein was there, AW would be more comfortable.
What would impact on what we are watching if a sole owner who took power away from Arsene Wenger. He might say all the right things about AW but if Usmanov wants something done this way, someone employed here or there, then it will happen - There will be no questioning or oversight of his decsions.
And therein lies the rub - Other than the moral question, the question of the effects of a sole biilionaire owner is being tested right now. And if you like what you see then fine. I don't, I like what's going on now more than the unknown - I mean, it's not as if the board are really doing a terrible job, is it?
What I do want to know is the difference you feel it will make to you if Usmanov does take control of the club with Dein as his lieutenant?
To me, it would start at the top end of the scale - Can I stomach this man controlling my club? It would be a question of how far I am prepared to stretch my morals and values. As i have stretched them in the past and considering its the Arsenal, it would be hard for me so stop.
As for me going to football, I would go to the same pub. meet the same people, sit in the same seat.
As for what I watch, well that is dictated by Arsene Wenger - therefore it would be based upon his relationship with this man. of course, if Dein was there, AW would be more comfortable.
What would impact on what we are watching if a sole owner who took power away from Arsene Wenger. He might say all the right things about AW but if Usmanov wants something done this way, someone employed here or there, then it will happen - There will be no questioning or oversight of his decsions.
And therein lies the rub - Other than the moral question, the question of the effects of a sole biilionaire owner is being tested right now. And if you like what you see then fine. I don't, I like what's going on now more than the unknown - I mean, it's not as if the board are really doing a terrible job, is it?
