As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
rodders999 wrote:Breaking the "rules" has earned City £130m+ this season from league placement and Champions League qualification so well worth the £50m fine if you ask me (which will be drastically reduced on appeal anyway).
Rodders, that reads almost like you are saying "qualifying for the CL is a good thing in and of itself..."
Almost, dare I say it, like a virtual trophy...
It's the way I've been conditioned
It's like when Michael Jordan used to get fined by the NBA every game becuase he was advertising his own product wearing Air Jordans. He'd quite happily pay the fine because he was earning far more from the trainer sales. Same with City, the punishment is dwarfed (easy lads ) by the reward of breaking the rules in the first place.
Not sure if that's the sound of you flipping or flopping...
rodders999 wrote:Breaking the "rules" has earned City £130m+ this season from league placement and Champions League qualification so well worth the £50m fine if you ask me (which will be drastically reduced on appeal anyway).
Rodders, that reads almost like you are saying "qualifying for the CL is a good thing in and of itself..."
Almost, dare I say it, like a virtual trophy...
It's the way I've been conditioned
It's like when Michael Jordan used to get fined by the NBA every game becuase he was advertising his own product wearing Air Jordans. He'd quite happily pay the fine because he was earning far more from the trainer sales. Same with City, the punishment is dwarfed (easy lads ) by the reward of breaking the rules in the first place.
Not sure if that's the sound of you flipping or flopping...
northbank123 wrote:To punish a club whose owners have basically endless funds and are willing to chuck their money around as long as it brings them success do you:
a) Prevent them from playing in your premier club competition
b) Issue a fine
Answers on a postcard
Who actually benefits from this fine that City and PSG have been given ? What happens to the money, £100m is a hell of a lot to be just left sitting in a bank account.
City to be fined £50M which isn't a big deal for the sheikh, but the restrictions to their squad for next years CL campaign in terms of squad size, and use of home grown players will have a massive impact on their ability to win the fucker.
City to be fined £50M which isn't a big deal for the sheikh, but the restrictions to their squad for next years CL campaign in terms of squad size, and use of home grown players will have a massive impact on their ability to win the fucker.
It'll be interesting to see how it pans out at least. If it goes ahead and the teams appeal then you'd expect a sharpish conclusion If the on the field penalties are to start for the coming season.
They need to deal with the blatant over the odds sponsorship IMO.
City to be fined £50M which isn't a big deal for the sheikh, but the restrictions to their squad for next years CL campaign in terms of squad size, and use of home grown players will have a massive impact on their ability to win the fucker.
Not so sure, they havent used more than 21 players in any of their CL campaigns thus far - I suppose it depends on who the 8 homegrown players are.
City to be fined £50M which isn't a big deal for the sheikh, but the restrictions to their squad for next years CL campaign in terms of squad size, and use of home grown players will have a massive impact on their ability to win the fucker.
Not so sure, they havent used more than 21 players in any of their CL campaigns thus far - I suppose it depends on who the 8 homegrown players are.
AND of course they havent got anywhere near to winning the fucker so far
City to be fined £50M which isn't a big deal for the sheikh, but the restrictions to their squad for next years CL campaign in terms of squad size, and use of home grown players will have a massive impact on their ability to win the fucker.
It'll be interesting to see how it pans out at least. If it goes ahead and the teams appeal then you'd expect a sharpish conclusion If the on the field penalties are to start for the coming season.
They need to deal with the blatant over the odds sponsorship IMO.
How or who decides what sponsorships are over the odds and how do they decide an appropriate amount ? You could certainly argue that citeeh's trophies allied to star players like yaya and kun make them a big club for sponsors to be associated with. Conversely you could also argue that a club that hasn't won anything in 9 years and who continue to be a feeder club to the big clubs, are not worthy of significant sponsorship deals. Some will argue that we are a worldwide club unlike citeeh, but cast your mind back a decade and ask yourselves if the chavs had even a small % of the support worldwide that they now have - winning trophies brings new fans and citeeh's worldwide popularity will continue to grow as long as they win trophies.
Of course citeeh's deal with the airline company was excessive, but if it is money into citeeh's coffers who gives a shit ? It is legal tender gained by legal sources and isn't a loan that citeeh have to pay back so cos it brings down any citeeh debt, it should be welcomed not dismissed
City to be fined £50M which isn't a big deal for the sheikh, but the restrictions to their squad for next years CL campaign in terms of squad size, and use of home grown players will have a massive impact on their ability to win the fucker.
It'll be interesting to see how it pans out at least. If it goes ahead and the teams appeal then you'd expect a sharpish conclusion If the on the field penalties are to start for the coming season.
They need to deal with the blatant over the odds sponsorship IMO.
How or who decides what sponsorships are over the odds and how do they decide an appropriate amount ? You could certainly argue that citeeh's trophies allied to star players like yaya and kun make them a big club for sponsors to be associated with. Conversely you could also argue that a club that hasn't won anything in 9 years and who continue to be a feeder club to the big clubs, are not worthy of significant sponsorship deals. Some will argue that we are a worldwide club unlike citeeh, but cast your mind back a decade and ask yourselves if the chavs had even a small % of the support worldwide that they now have - winning trophies brings new fans and citeeh's worldwide popularity will continue to grow as long as they win trophies.
Of course citeeh's deal with the airline company was excessive, but if it is money into citeeh's coffers who gives a shit ? It is legal tender gained by legal sources and isn't a loan that citeeh have to pay back so cos it brings down any citeeh debt, it should be welcomed not dismissed
Not sure if I agree with you. The sponsorship deals are a consequence of a rich benefactor pumping loads of money into a club that was going nowhere, allowing them to buy the best players in the world. This is despite the fact that in pure finance terms they aren't meeting their liabilities with their income even with sponsorship income.
You could argue that one of the reasons that ticket prices at arsenal are soo high is that our players salaries have to compete with the likes of chelski and city. We will never be on a par with their top earners but even so a large proportion of our turnover is spent on players wages.
A set of guidelines have been drawn up so that football clubs cannot be turned into pawns for sheikhs or oligarchs to use as their playthings. In principle football clubs don't operate like traditional businesses, but it shouldn't mean that they can just blow hundreds of millions of pounds in the pursuit of silverware and fuck the consequences for the game at a wider level.
Chelsea have now got to the stage in their financial development where they wont be in the shit like city, they even posted a profit recently but if they want to rebuild the side and post future losses, no doubt UEFA will be on their case.
It is pleasing that finally someone has the balls to stand up to these rich benefactors and it looks like something may actually happen.
I know that everything is relative but look throughout the football and you will see multiple examples of rich benefactors splashing the cash on their team and distorting the sense of fairness in the game - for me people tend to focus only on the top tier of football but wasn't there a non league team who received a big injection of cash from a wealthy backer a few years ago ? Personally, if it isn't a loan to the club, I don't see the problem - how can uefa or fifa tell a club that they cannot accept a donation from a wealthy backer ? Football may not be like your mainstream businesses but nor is it like the nfl where salary caps are enforced - football is a worldwide sport and it is impossible to enforce salary cap rules that stretch to almost every corner of the world so if the clubs are not running up debts I don't see the issue.
I really don't see where citeeh or psg have a greater responsibility to the game itself - they buy players in an accepted transfer market and they sign players as per fifa regulations so they have broken no rules there. Yes their wealth has allowed them buy the best players but for years richer clubs have been hoovering up the elite talent while they were forced to watch on so now it is their turn to be the kingpins and more luck to them. I remember back in the 80's manure were spending considerably more than the rest of the clubs in a bid to be successful again and this will be the way forever and a day. If we are honest, the only reason there has been opposition to citeeh and psg's spending is because it is producing the type of results that manure were unable to obtain back then - jealousy is driving this campaign and I would stake my life that the chavs compliance with FFP is nothing to do with respecting fair play, but is more down to the fact that citeeh could now blow them out of the water any time they want and they are no longer the big boys of the premier league
Btw, you could also argue that the reason why our ticket prices are so high is that we have to generate funds from somewhere so that we can meet the 8m per season contract of the "specialist in failure"
augie wrote:I know that everything is relative but look throughout the football and you will see multiple examples of rich benefactors splashing the cash on their team and distorting the sense of fairness in the game - for me people tend to focus only on the top tier of football but wasn't there a non league team who received a big injection of cash from a wealthy backer a few years ago ? Personally, if it isn't a loan to the club, I don't see the problem - how can uefa or fifa tell a club that they cannot accept a donation from a wealthy backer ? Football may not be like your mainstream businesses but nor is it like the nfl where salary caps are enforced - football is a worldwide sport and it is impossible to enforce salary cap rules that stretch to almost every corner of the world so if the clubs are not running up debts I don't see the issue.
I really don't see where citeeh or psg have a greater responsibility to the game itself - they buy players in an accepted transfer market and they sign players as per fifa regulations so they have broken no rules there. Yes their wealth has allowed them buy the best players but for years richer clubs have been hoovering up the elite talent while they were forced to watch on so now it is their turn to be the kingpins and more luck to them. I remember back in the 80's manure were spending considerably more than the rest of the clubs in a bid to be successful again and this will be the way forever and a day. If we are honest, the only reason there has been opposition to citeeh and psg's spending is because it is producing the type of results that manure were unable to obtain back then - jealousy is driving this campaign and I would stake my life that the chavs compliance with FFP is nothing to do with respecting fair play, but is more down to the fact that citeeh could now blow them out of the water any time they want and they are no longer the big boys of the premier league
Btw, you could also argue that the reason why our ticket prices are so high is that we have to generate funds from somewhere so that we can meet the 8m per season contract of the "specialist in failure"
I remember the 80s well (old git yes I know), during that time manure had the money but pool had the trophies. The general consensus was that money didn't buy trophies back then. Money wise footballers used to earn what is a modest wage these days for many (I saw spurs payroll stats in the late 80s).
Basically what you are saying is, its ok to be owned by a stinking rich arab or oligarch and get first dibs for many world class players (that wouldn't touch city or chelski with a barge pole a few years back). If Dennis Bergkamp or Thierry Henry where in their mid 20s right now, do you honestly think they would end up at our club?
Having rich owners that are prepared to splash the cash, means these clubs can spend beyond their means which is wrong. It's nothing to do with jealousy its about having football clubs on a level playing field in all aspects of their operations. City quite often don't sell out their home fixtures the same applies to Chelsea. There needs to be a sense of reality that football clubs musn't spew hundreds of millions of pounds in their pursuit of glory. Otherwise it will just be a case of the clubs with the richest owners winning most/all the trophies. Manure have been the only exception over the last ten years and that was with a manager of the like that we will never see in our lifetime again (even ahead of shankly/ busby). UEFA are spot on at trying to regulate these clubs
Its the overall salary roll at the club that has an influence over season ticket prices. I think you will find wengers salary is probably a lot less than 10% of the total figure.
You could certainly argue that citeeh's trophies allied to star players like yaya and kun make them a big club for sponsors to be associated with. Conversely you could also argue that a club that hasn't won anything in 9 years and who continue to be a feeder club to the big clubs, are not worthy of significant sponsorship deals. Some will argue that we are a worldwide club unlike citeeh, but cast your mind back a decade and ask yourselves if the chavs had even a small % of the support worldwide that they now have - winning trophies brings new fans and citeeh's worldwide popularity will continue to grow as long as they win trophies.
