Today feels like the beginning of the end.

As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
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Should Arsene Go?

Yes
57
59%
No
39
41%
 
Total votes: 96

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I Hate Hleb
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Location: London

Post by I Hate Hleb »

nino_rojo wrote:Liquidation, or at least huge financial turmoil is a very real reality for teams who spend beyond their means. We dont have big money foreign owners so we cant compete with the likes of Man City and Chelski on that front.
Yes we do. They've just chosen not to invest part of their personal wealth on the playing side.
nino_rojo wrote:I mentioned liquidation becuase most people on here expect us to be spending money we dont have. Pick any team you like that is buying big and you will see huge financial backing, or a very bleak future unless things change.. look at the recent problems Liverpool and Utd have had.
No they don't!!! Most people on here want us to spend the money we do have!! :banghead: :banghead:

AA23Northbank

Post by AA23Northbank »

I Hate Hleb wrote:
nino_rojo wrote:
SteveO 35 wrote:
flash gunner wrote:
nino_rojo wrote: Was good enough for Man Utd last season.

And yes, mob mentality. I said I wont rant, and I wont. But here is a question...

So, we get rid of Wenger. Then what? Who do we get in that will bring us more success, and keep us from liquidation, with the money we have at our disposal?
Where did liquidation come from? Arsenal will not go into liquidation due to spending some money :banghead:

and the CC was good enough for united last season condering they were coming off the back of 2 or 3 consecutive championships and a European cup the season before that
You can see how the brainwashing has kicked in with some people can't you. It's like...without Arsene there would be nothing. The World of Arsenal began in 1996 and will end when he one day steps down. Signing Cahill for £15m will end the world as we know it and send Arsenal plunging to the depths of despair and a knock at the door from the Administrator.

The club generates over £30m+ in operating profit FFS. There is money to spend but it is no-one's else job to spend it but his
Liquidation, or at least huge financial turmoil is a very real reality for teams who spend beyond their means. We dont have big money foreign owners so we cant compete with the likes of Man City and Chelski on that front.
Yes we do. They've just chosen not to invest part of their personal wealth on the playing side.
nino_rojo wrote:I mentioned liquidation becuase most people on here expect us to be spending money we dont have. Pick any team you like that is buying big and you will see huge financial backing, or a very bleak future unless things change.. look at the recent problems Liverpool and Utd have had.
No they don't!!! Most people on here want us to spend the money we do have!! :banghead: :banghead:
Exactly Hlebby, our debt is down, we made a very good profit last year, we have money to spend without doing a Citeh/Chavs but Wenger's stubborness is stopping us spending. I was one of his biggest supporters, but I think he is sadly losing it very quickly :cry:

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rodders999
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Post by rodders999 »

No money to spend???? Liquidation???? :shock: :shock: :shock:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010 ... ax-profits

Keep talking along those lines and you'll become as deluded as Lord Wenger.

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Arsenal 1991
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Location: England

Post by Arsenal 1991 »

Assuming we have absolutely nothing left over from previous years.

Sell Van Persie for 15m (conservative), sell bentdner, eboue and denilson for 10m, sell squillaci for 1m. Thats £26m already plus I reckon about 250,000 in wages too. So I'd reckon we'd need another £20m to buy the defensive midfielder, centre back and striker we need.

Sorted.

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nino_rojo
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Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 7:55 pm
Location: Bath/Bristol

Post by nino_rojo »

I Hate Hleb wrote:
nino_rojo wrote:Liquidation, or at least huge financial turmoil is a very real reality for teams who spend beyond their means. We dont have big money foreign owners so we cant compete with the likes of Man City and Chelski on that front.
Yes we do. They've just chosen not to invest part of their personal wealth on the playing side.
nino_rojo wrote:I mentioned liquidation becuase most people on here expect us to be spending money we dont have. Pick any team you like that is buying big and you will see huge financial backing, or a very bleak future unless things change.. look at the recent problems Liverpool and Utd have had.
No they don't!!! Most people on here want us to spend the money we do have!! :banghead: :banghead:
Our board members dont (as good as) own Russia, or parts of the middle east. Those guys have money to chuck around as if it were toilet rolls, ours dont. The CLUB has chosen to create a sustainable business, and I would assume that will stay regardless of who is managing. So we make 30m a year, thats pocket change. The demands of the fans wont stop at one player, they will always want more and more. That is what I mean by spending money we dont have. We have brought in plenty of players over the past few years, it just so happens they were (mostly) cheap. In fact our record signing is one of our most useless.

Plus, its possible that things will change dramatically next season when new financial regulations come in. We MAY find ourselves much more competetive. Of course, the more likely outcome is that big money clubs will find all sorts of loopholes and come out on top, but who knows.

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Arsenal 1991
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Post by Arsenal 1991 »

nino_rojo wrote:
I Hate Hleb wrote:
nino_rojo wrote:Liquidation, or at least huge financial turmoil is a very real reality for teams who spend beyond their means. We dont have big money foreign owners so we cant compete with the likes of Man City and Chelski on that front.
Yes we do. They've just chosen not to invest part of their personal wealth on the playing side.
nino_rojo wrote:I mentioned liquidation becuase most people on here expect us to be spending money we dont have. Pick any team you like that is buying big and you will see huge financial backing, or a very bleak future unless things change.. look at the recent problems Liverpool and Utd have had.
No they don't!!! Most people on here want us to spend the money we do have!! :banghead: :banghead:
Our board members dont (as good as) own Russia, or parts of the middle east. Those guys have money to chuck around as if it were toilet rolls, ours dont. The CLUB has chosen to create a sustainable business, and I would assume that will stay regardless of who is managing. So we make 30m a year, thats pocket change. The demands of the fans wont stop at one player, they will always want more and more. That is what I mean by spending money we dont have. We have brought in plenty of players over the past few years, it just so happens they were (mostly) cheap. In fact our record signing is one of our most useless.

Plus, its possible that things will change dramatically next season when new financial regulations come in. We MAY find ourselves much more competetive. Of course, the more likely outcome is that big money clubs will find all sorts of loopholes and come out on top, but who knows.
See my post above. I'd start by buying Cahill and Im sure there are some very good strikers out there. Arsene is supposed to know every player on the planet and we have a great scouting network so it shouldn't be too difficult. We made 56m profit, thats our money to spend!

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donaldo
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Location: The gates of hell waiting for Wenger

Post by donaldo »

Arsenal 1991 wrote:Assuming we have absolutely nothing left over from previous years.

Sell Van Persie for 15m (conservative), sell bentdner, eboue and denilson for 10m, sell squillaci for 1m. Thats £26m already plus I reckon about 250,000 in wages too. So I'd reckon we'd need another £20m to buy the defensive midfielder, centre back and striker we need.
Sorted.
£35-40m from Barca this summer

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Arsenal 1991
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Location: England

Post by Arsenal 1991 »

I know it seems counter productive to sell our two best players but we need our best players playing more games than cesc and van persie currently play.

We could get at least £60m combined for them add that to the £33m we would get for Bentdner (£6m), Squillaci (£1m), Denilson (£6m), Arshavin (£10m), Rosicky (£5m) and Eboue (£5m). Then we have the £56m profit, thats a total of nearly £150m.

Thats money to rival Man City, Madrid, anyone. Use £30m to buy a proper striker, £20m to buy a proper defensive midfielder, £15m to buy cahill, £7.5m to buy Parker, £5m for a reserve right back and the rest to buy a couple of proper wingers.

Promote JET, lansbury, Bartley and any others. We suddenly have a very, very good squad. NOT THAT DIFFICULT!!!

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rodders999
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Post by rodders999 »

Yes Arsenal will take 35-40 mill from Barca for Cesc.

No this money will NOT be reinvested in the team bar maybe 5 million for some "replacement" from the French lower leagues.

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augie
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Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:03 pm
Location: Ireland

Post by augie »

nino_rojo wrote:
I Hate Hleb wrote:
nino_rojo wrote:Liquidation, or at least huge financial turmoil is a very real reality for teams who spend beyond their means. We dont have big money foreign owners so we cant compete with the likes of Man City and Chelski on that front.
Yes we do. They've just chosen not to invest part of their personal wealth on the playing side.
nino_rojo wrote:I mentioned liquidation becuase most people on here expect us to be spending money we dont have. Pick any team you like that is buying big and you will see huge financial backing, or a very bleak future unless things change.. look at the recent problems Liverpool and Utd have had.
No they don't!!! Most people on here want us to spend the money we do have!! :banghead: :banghead:
Our board members dont (as good as) own Russia, or parts of the middle east. Those guys have money to chuck around as if it were toilet rolls, ours dont. The CLUB has chosen to create a sustainable business, and I would assume that will stay regardless of who is managing. So we make 30m a year, thats pocket change. The demands of the fans wont stop at one player, they will always want more and more. That is what I mean by spending money we dont have. We have brought in plenty of players over the past few years, it just so happens they were (mostly) cheap. In fact our record signing is one of our most useless.

Plus, its possible that things will change dramatically next season when new financial regulations come in. We MAY find ourselves much more competetive. Of course, the more likely outcome is that big money clubs will find all sorts of loopholes and come out on top, but who knows.


So in case the fans demand more signings after wenger makes a signing the best course of action is not to buy or spend any of the profits ?? :? :shock: You havent a fcuking clue have you ? :roll:

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shu
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Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:47 pm
Location: Norwich

Post by shu »

This is the same very year , we get to January doing well , and bit by bit it crumbles and every year it is because we need a player or two.
3 years ago we were desperate for a forward and defender , anelka and woodgate (don't laugh) were available and we missed out on a trophy again.
Wenger does not learn , he s stubborn , he does not think we need a goalie ??????????????? Like mugs many continue to pay their £50 per ticket and get taken for a ride by the board. Come summer and guess what ,£40 mill to spend 'if i want to' , August starts , RVP injured but i forget , Cesc to barca , buy a couple of young hopefuls from Ziare , remind us that Ramsey is like a new signing and can be the new Cesc, do well until xmas and then , here we go again.

WENGER NEVER LEARNS and i am pissed off with him

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USMartin
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Post by USMartin »

TeeCee wrote:
Wengers role has a financial element
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

No it doesn't!! He feeds you that line and just like a complete mug you swallow every word and think he is god! :roll:

Arsenal have a finance director and many other people employed to look after Arsenal's finances. Wenger's only worry should be going to Gazidis and saying 'Can I sign xxxxxx' or discuss with Gazidis the potential renewal/improvement of a players contract.

Wenger HIMSELF, no-one else, has engineered the award of improved contracts to almost all 1st team squad members including the likes of Denilshit and Billy Bendtner. THIS is where a lot of Arsenal's money has gone and is the reason we supposedly can't afford to pay 'top' wages to the very best players. That's WENGER who has done that, he said it himself.
Wait a minute - which is it - he is making the financial decisons or the financial director is? This is critical, TeeCee as after all you are saying the manager has no finanical role on his his own one moment and then he is making all the financial decisions next.

There is no doubt whatsoever that your point about overpaying several underperforming or underproven players is correct. But where did this policy orginate exactly is quite a bit less clear. After all when our total wage bill was only about 74 million we had to players on 100K or more a week on it, while today we don't have any player on more than 90K a week with a wage buill that is approximately 40 million pounds lbigger.

So knowing this and knowing that a complete underperofmer like Nik Bendtner is on 50K a week and and our best bast most important player in Cesc Fabregas is still on 80 K a week raises the question of how we can hope to sign the players we need - the players we signed routinely before 2005 - on wages that now are 25 to in some cases over 100% below what some otheer teams can and even other teams will pay them?

Before you answer let me remind you of one thing - the Premier League investigators after reviewing the testimony and records of all parties in the Ashley Cole Case in which Arsenal were absolved of breaking any Premier league Rulkes still concluded the Arsenal Board ignored both David Dein's and Arsene Wenger's recommendations to offer Cole 60K a week.

Let me also remind you that Ivan Gazidis negotiates all contracts mnot Arsene Wenger, and that was his job at MLS which has a very strict wage structure very similar to the one in place at Arsenal, and if you are familiar with MLS and its wage structure it too is bottom-weighted as the Arsenel wage structure is(with a single big-money exception like a David Beckham allowed for marketing purposes on each team).

Now as someone pointed out over in another thread he copuld think of three players we could sell straight way to cover the reputed 15 million pounds to buy Gary Cahill. The questions is are we prepred to make their wages available to pay Gery Cahill to sign at Arsenal? Because there are other clubs who would make that available straight away without hesitation. Or are we gonna try to get him to sign for 50K aweek instead of 80K as he could elsewhere?

Like I say though I don't think he should be sacked the Wenger Era is now poisoned almost beyond rescusing. So this is as much about what happens going forward as anything. Menaing it's about whehter any managre can actually fix the problems that years of divestment from the football team have created throughout the first 11 and the squad as a whole.

In other words things may not change at all for the better any time soon no matter who the new manager is and this policy may limit who we can actually hope to take the position as easily as it might have limited who we have hoped will sign to play for us the past several years.

And what are all of you prepared to do if in fact these policies and to remain in place after Mr. Wenger's sacking or resignation? My guess is call his successor a bling deluded senile *word censored* another more, and what does that say of us. Not Arsenal. Not the club or the Board but t of us? Is our passion for Arsenal limited to lynch mobs against people who may not be the real cause of our pain?

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Percy Dalton
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Post by Percy Dalton »

Fuck the board!

Fuck Mr Knows!

Fuck the dwarf Russian!

Fuck Nic!

Fuck the worst Brazilian since Jordan trimmed her snatch with an Flymo!

There..........that feels better!

8)

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Arsenal 1991
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Post by Arsenal 1991 »

USMartin wrote:
TeeCee wrote:
Wengers role has a financial element
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

No it doesn't!! He feeds you that line and just like a complete mug you swallow every word and think he is god! :roll:

Arsenal have a finance director and many other people employed to look after Arsenal's finances. Wenger's only worry should be going to Gazidis and saying 'Can I sign xxxxxx' or discuss with Gazidis the potential renewal/improvement of a players contract.

Wenger HIMSELF, no-one else, has engineered the award of improved contracts to almost all 1st team squad members including the likes of Denilshit and Billy Bendtner. THIS is where a lot of Arsenal's money has gone and is the reason we supposedly can't afford to pay 'top' wages to the very best players. That's WENGER who has done that, he said it himself.
Wait a minute - which is it - he is making the financial decisons or the financial director is? This is critical, TeeCee as after all you are saying the manager has no finanical role on his his own one moment and then he is making all the financial decisions next.

There is no doubt whatsoever that your point about overpaying several underperforming or underproven players is correct. But where did this policy orginate exactly is quite a bit less clear. After all when our total wage bill was only about 74 million we had to players on 100K or more a week on it, while today we don't have any player on more than 90K a week with a wage buill that is approximately 40 million pounds lbigger.

So knowing this and knowing that a complete underperofmer like Nik Bendtner is on 50K a week and and our best bast most important player in Cesc Fabregas is still on 80 K a week raises the question of how we can hope to sign the players we need - the players we signed routinely before 2005 - on wages that now are 25 to in some cases over 100% below what some otheer teams can and even other teams will pay them?

Before you answer let me remind you of one thing - the Premier League investigators after reviewing the testimony and records of all parties in the Ashley Cole Case in which Arsenal were absolved of breaking any Premier league Rulkes still concluded the Arsenal Board ignored both David Dein's and Arsene Wenger's recommendations to offer Cole 60K a week.

Let me also remind you that Ivan Gazidis negotiates all contracts mnot Arsene Wenger, and that was his job at MLS which has a very strict wage structure very similar to the one in place at Arsenal, and if you are familiar with MLS and its wage structure it too is bottom-weighted as the Arsenel wage structure is(with a single big-money exception like a David Beckham allowed for marketing purposes on each team).

Now as someone pointed out over in another thread he copuld think of three players we could sell straight way to cover the reputed 15 million pounds to buy Gary Cahill. The questions is are we prepred to make their wages available to pay Gery Cahill to sign at Arsenal? Because there are other clubs who would make that available straight away without hesitation. Or are we gonna try to get him to sign for 50K aweek instead of 80K as he could elsewhere?

Like I say though I don't think he should be sacked the Wenger Era is now poisoned almost beyond rescusing. So this is as much about what happens going forward as anything. Menaing it's about whehter any managre can actually fix the problems that years of divestment from the football team have created throughout the first 11 and the squad as a whole.

In other words things may not change at all for the better any time soon no matter who the new manager is and this policy may limit who we can actually hope to take the position as easily as it might have limited who we have hoped will sign to play for us the past several years.

And what are all of you prepared to do if in fact these policies and to remain in place after Mr. Wenger's sacking or resignation? My guess is call his successor a bling deluded senile c**t another more, and what does that say of us. Not Arsenal. Not the club or the Board but t of us? Is our passion for Arsenal limited to lynch mobs against people who may not be the real cause of our pain?
Fucks sake, hes back. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

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shu
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Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:47 pm
Location: Norwich

Post by shu »

no wonder the whole world hates americans , i bet you are on the Arsenal payroll. Why don't u fxxk off and watch some USA Spacker sport world series.

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