Gaza's aid ships - Make them answer questions

Cockerill's chin · Post by **Cockerill's chin** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 11:20 am

Let's cut to the chase about this incident and rather than debate its semantics address the welfare of innocents. Leave the justifications to those who are not concerned with the humane view.

The following is a provisional list of the 28 Britons who are missing following the illegal Israeli attack on a humanitarian mission vessel. These people are being detained with no trial and no legal representation. If you have the time and are concerned for their welfare then I suggest you email the following to the British Foreign Office and state your concern.

[email protected]

Dear Mr Hague,

I am concerned as to the welfare of the following charity workers whose vessel was illegally boarded while in international waters. Media has declared there are casualties amongst the charity workers and we would like to know what efforts are being made regarding the welfare of the missing 28 Britons. Could you please confirm if they are being detained and, if so, what access to legal representation and consular assitance they are receiving. Your urgent attention to this matter would be much appreciated:

Nicola Enchmarch
Laura Macdonald Stuart
Ebrahim Musaji
Jamal Sayed
Parveen Yaqub
Baboo Adem Zanghar
Ahsan Shamruk
Mustafa Cengiz Ahmet
Tauqir Sharif
Boudejma Bounoua
Mohammad Bounoua
Sakir Yildirim
Kenneth O'Keefe
Ali El-Awaisi
Mohammed Bhaiyat
Lort Phillips Alexandra Mary
Sarah Nancy Colborne
Ismail Adam Patel
Nader Daher
Mahi Mohammed Abid
Nur-E-Azom Choudhury
Kevin Ovenden
Peter Venner
Clifford Gardner Hanley
Muzzammil Layth Chogley
Jamaluddin Mohammad Farid Elshayyal
Hassan Al Banna Ghani
Lazrag Salah
Ali Altan

Kind regards

RaM · Post by **RaM** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:05 pm

I saw on the news today that there were 5 Australians aboard. One was shot and received surgery that has been a success.

All 5 have been in contact with Australian embassy officials and are believed to be doing ok.

Also...am I right in thinking that this is the group of people being given 24 hours to leave?

DanielD · Post by **DanielD** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:14 pm

Cockerill's chin wrote:Let's cut to the chase about this incident and rather than debate its semantics address the welfare of innocents. Leave the justifications to those who are not concerned with the humane view.

The following is a provisional list of the 28 Britons who are missing following the illegal Israeli attack on a humanitarian mission vessel. These people are being detained with no trial and no legal representation. If you have the time and are concerned for their welfare then I suggest you email the following to the British Foreign Office and state your concern.

[email protected]

Dear Mr Hague,

I am concerned as to the welfare of the following charity workers whose vessel was illegally boarded while in international waters. Media has declared there are casualties amongst the charity workers and we would like to know what efforts are being made regarding the welfare of the missing 28 Britons. Could you please confirm if they are being detained and, if so, what access to legal representation and consular assitance they are receiving. Your urgent attention to this matter would be much appreciated:

Nicola Enchmarch
...
Ali Altan

Kind regards

You having a laugh, right?

Most of the activists won't reveal their Identity, making it difficult for the Israeli authorities deporting them.

We don't have a single reason to keep them here, and the decision to deport all the people on these ships was made yesterday.

All of the activists who were injured were taken care of in Israeli hospitals, and will be deported as soon as possible. I'm sure they were treated better than in their home countries.

Cockerill's chin, I expected more from you. You seem like a pretty smart bloke. leave the Propaganda garbage to the "aid" ships people and Hamas..

RaM · Post by **RaM** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:26 pm

DanielD wrote:You having a laugh, right?

Most of the activists won't reveal their Identity, making it difficult for the Israeli authorities deporting them.

We don't have a single reason to keep them here, and the decision to deport all the people on these ships was made yesterday.

All of the activists who were injured were taken care of in Israeli hospitals, and will be deported as soon as possible. I'm sure they were treated better than in their home countries.

Not having a laugh.

Do think though that it is very unreasonable to say that Israeli medical treatment is any better than British or Australian.

Post by **QuartzGooner** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:27 pm

Some 120 the activists have already arrived home, one was interviewed on the BBC and Sky last night from Heathrow.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle ... 210949.stm

Why will Hamas not let the Red Cross see Gilad Shalit, an Israeli soldier kidnapped from Israel?

Why will the Iranians and Syrians not provide information on Ron Arad, an airman kidnapped 24 years ago?

DanielD · Post by **DanielD** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:29 pm

RaM wrote:
DanielD wrote:You having a laugh, right?

Most of the activists won't reveal their Identity, making it difficult for the Israeli authorities deporting them.

We don't have a single reason to keep them here, and the decision to deport all the people on these ships was made yesterday.

All of the activists who were injured were taken care of in Israeli hospitals, and will be deported as soon as possible. I'm sure they were treated better than in their home countries.
quote]

Not having a laugh.

Do think though that it is very unreasonable to say that Israeli medical treatment is any better than British or Australian.

Poor pronouncation by me. I meant the Israeli doctors and nurses probably treat these people better than anyone, because we can't allow any more diplomatic damage.

My first post wasn't directed to you Ram, it was directed to Cockerill's chin.. Sorry.

RaM · Post by **RaM** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:42 pm

DanielD wrote:
RaM wrote:
DanielD wrote:You having a laugh, right?

Most of the activists won't reveal their Identity, making it difficult for the Israeli authorities deporting them.

We don't have a single reason to keep them here, and the decision to deport all the people on these ships was made yesterday.

All of the activists who were injured were taken care of in Israeli hospitals, and will be deported as soon as possible. I'm sure they were treated better than in their home countries.
quote]

Not having a laugh.

Do think though that it is very unreasonable to say that Israeli medical treatment is any better than British or Australian.
Poor pronouncation by me. I meant the Israeli doctors and nurses probably treat these people better than anyone, because we can't allow any more diplomatic damage.

My first post wasn't directed to you Ram, it was directed to Cockerill's chin.. Sorry.

No worries.

Well I'm sure that's the case with the medical treatment. So it has been reported here too.

I believe medical personnel anywhere should give the best treatment they possibly can to anyone in need of aid regardless of the patient's circumstances. Not much more Israel could do from that perspective.

Cockerill's chin · Post by **Cockerill's chin** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:54 pm

Quartz, once again you are making an analogy with military operations and humanitarians on an aid mission.

As I remember Arad was on a bombing mission in Lebanon and had to eject when his bomb exploded too early. Your analogy of this event to humanitarians can only be relevant if you believe you are at war with the charity workers.

I am sorry but I had to read up on Shalit. His capture and detention breaches international humanitarian law. Of course the young man should be released to return to his family.

Daniel D, I am fully aware that the land convoy led by Galloway and the flotilla are publicity driven. The aid they delivered were a patch on what is needed so their only real purpose was to highlight the blockade. To any reasonable man, the blockade is unjustifiable. Be as ready to see propaganda in all its disguises.

olgitgooner · Post by **olgitgooner** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 5:07 pm

I have to say that I'm really impressed with content of this thread, and the original one on the subject.

Lots of intelligent, well-reasoned argument. Regardless of individual viewpoint.

And it hasn't degenerated into an emotionally-charged slanging match.

It's very good to see.

I'm non-Jewish, but pro-Israel. Not a rose-tinter, though

I have my own, very strong, opinions on this latest issue. But I'm standing on the sidelines for this one.

Emma_bryne · Post by **Emma_bryne** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 5:36 pm

William Hague is our foreign office guy? The man who was so unpopular even the Tories voted him out?!!??!? And now this guy has a form of power??!?! Wtf?!!??!?!

frankbutcher · Post by **frankbutcher** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:11 pm

Emma_bryne wrote:William Hague is our foreign office guy? The man who was so unpopular even the Tories voted him out?!!??!? And now this guy has a form of power??!?! Wtf?!!??!?!

He's about 1000 times more intelligent than you - 'ya big troll!

Emma_bryne · Post by **Emma_bryne** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:26 pm

frankbutcher wrote:
Emma_bryne wrote:William Hague is our foreign office guy? The man who was so unpopular even the Tories voted him out?!!??!? And now this guy has a form of power??!?! Wtf?!!??!?!
He\'s about 1000 times more intelligent than you - \'ya big troll!

\\

Shut it troll stop taking the thread off topic you stupid troll.

Post by **QuartzGooner** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:41 pm

Cockerill's chin wrote:Quartz, once again you are making an analogy with military operations and humanitarians on an aid mission.

First to look at the concept of "Aid":

The flotilla was not simply "humanitarians on an aid mission".

Whilst no regards life in Gaza as a piece of cake, the shops there do have food and consumer goods.

The need for "Aid" in Gaza is not as pressing as such a flotilla would have many believe.

No doubt here is poverty and high unemployment there, and there is clearly a need for some supplementation to the food supply. Yet many eat normally there, it is not akin to the East African famines we have seen over the years.

Second to look at the flotilla's participants:

Majority of them were civilians from various countries. Five of the six boats were escorted to Ashdod port without incident. The food/medical supplies were then transferred to Gaza.

This last boat had women and children on board.
Who remained in the cabins.

Yet the people on the deck, who fought the soldiers. Why did they chose to fight? They were pre-warned that the ship was being boarded.

They were not "humanitarian" aid workers.
They were military calibre personnel.

They were armed, with not just iron bars but firebombs and a pistol.
They wore ceramic plated body armour.
They instigated the violence, because all ships were in radio contact so they knew the other five were peacefully boarded.
Their use of force was not of a civilian nature.
If some one attacks you, and you have an iron bar...you might swing for them and hope they keep their distance.
This mob though attacked the commandos en masse, bludgeoning them whilst the troops were on the floor.
Attempted to bring the Israeli helicopter out of the sky.

The Israelis were prepared for, and trained in, physical force.
Yet intentioned on a peaceful resolution.

But the actions of the people on the deck show that these so called "Aid Workers" were prepared for, trained in, and willing for, physical force.

Cockerill's chin · Post by **Cockerill's chin** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:26 pm

If they were military calibre personnel they would not have come to a semi-automatic gun fight armed with a table leg.

I'm sorry Quartz, but that was an speculative/outrageous post.

Post by **QuartzGooner** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:34 pm

Cockerill's chin wrote:If they were military calibre personnel they would not have come to a semi-automatic gun fight armed with a table leg.

I'm sorry Quartz, but that was an speculative/outrageous post.

What speculation? What outrage?

They were armed with a pistol. (Lethal Weapon).
They were armed with iron bars. (Lethal Weapon).
They were armed with hunting catapults and stones ready made for firing. (Lethal Weapon).
They were armed with daggers and knives. (Lethal Weapon).
They threw pre-prepared molotov cocktails. (Lethal Weapon).
They took a pistols from Israeli troops (Lethal Weapon).

They threw an Israeli soldier overboard (but he landed in the life boat).
They attempted to kill the soldiers from the moment they landed, slowly, one by one, on the deck, with knowledge that the previous five ships had been peacefully boarded.
They attempted to bring down the Israeli helicopter.

Al Jazeera had broadcast footage on Sunday where members of the flotilla had said they were "Ready for Martydom".
They were chanting about the battle of Khaybar, a battle mentioned in the Koran in which the Muslims attacked the Jews.

They intentionally sailed into an exclusion zone in a war zone, one that had existed for two years and was known about the world over.

Simple fact is that those guys on the deck came looking for a fight and they got one.

(By the way, this lady, Alexandra Mary Lort - Phillips has been visited by the British consul, and is in good health and ready to return within 48 hours, according to a quote from her father in the Evening Standard.)