As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
Arteta's confidence can be seen as overconfidence and conceit just as easily as ambition and confidence.
You have to be supremely sure of yourself to walk into the job at the Arsenal currently, especially with no managerial experience to back it up. The club and team is a complete mess which needs a few seasons to sort out, i have no confidence in him because i have nothing to base it on and actually shouldn't need to he should not even be considered as an option.
I find it in keeping with the current malaise surrounding the club and fans that so many people are slowly but surely coming round to Arteta being the best/only option available and so many people finding excuses to be accepting of this appointment if it happens........ for me its reminiscent of people not being able to look beyond there being any option other than Wenger for so long
If you look at the last three Arsenal managerial appointments - Graham, Rioch, Wenger - none of them were the big names that everyone craved and there were all massive 'against' arguments for all of them. Two of them hadn't managed in the top flight, whilst the other had buggered off to the sticks of Japan. All three then massively improved upon what they inherited. Arsenal have never gone for the biggest of big name managers....so I wouldn't call it the malaise at welcoming Arteta aboard.....I see it as something nobody here will know until he's taken the job. In the same way there is absolutely no castiron guarantee that Allegri would be an instant success.
What I do know is whether its Allegri, Arteta, TH14, PV4, the 30 year old German bloke or just about anyone else who has been linked with the job (apart from you Brendan Rogers), I'll just be delighted it will be someone trying something new rather than the fraudulent old dinosaur.
But every single one of them had extensive managerial experience, while arteta has NONE. Much as it kills me to say it, the old french cock had actually won the french league before dragging them down near relegation before getting fired . In a lot of ways managing in the lower leagues or a mid-table or bottom half premier league club, would be an advantage here given the quality of the squad he is walking in to - arteta will be coming from a squad overflowing with top quality players everywhere, and that will be a huge change when he walks into a squad overloaded with average players, and arteta has no experience or evidence to suggest that he can improve them or make the team better than the individual parts.
We all agree that there are no certainties in life expect death and taxes, so we know appointing allegri (for example) does not guarantee success - what we do know is that managers like allegri, conte, PV4 half all managed in clubs before, and all have managed in clubs where the players were not top quality. Their experience in going in and assessing a squad, bringing in necessary additions and (more importantly) knowing how to set-up a team to cover for their weaknesses, would be massive in taking over our squad. It makes zero sense to give this job to a guy that has none of those experiences, and who was no better than average to good as a player with us. I know that we all wanted the french c.unt gone, but it shouldnt mean that we must be happy to accept anyone else in the job
But every single one of them had extensive managerial experience, while arteta has NONE. Much as it kills me to say it, the old french cock had actually won the french league before dragging them down near relegation before getting fired . In a lot of ways managing in the lower leagues or a mid-table or bottom half premier league club, would be an advantage here given the quality of the squad he is walking in to - arteta will be coming from a squad overflowing with top quality players everywhere, and that will be a huge change when he walks into a squad overloaded with average players, and arteta has no experience or evidence to suggest that he can improve them or make the team better than the individual parts.
We all agree that there are no certainties in life expect death and taxes, so we know appointing allegri (for example) does not guarantee success - what we do know is that managers like allegri, conte, PV4 half all managed in clubs before, and all have managed in clubs where the players were not top quality. Their experience in going in and assessing a squad, bringing in necessary additions and (more importantly) knowing how to set-up a team to cover for their weaknesses, would be massive in taking over our squad. It makes zero sense to give this job to a guy that has none of those experiences, and who was no better than average to good as a player with us. I know that we all wanted the french c.unt gone, but it shouldnt mean that we must be happy to accept anyone else in the job
Agree with this 100%. The problem with Arteta is that you don't know how he manages, set teams up, how his set pieces work, how he trains players, etc. The Board would only have his word and no empirical evidence. That is the idiotic thing in my opinion. If you have a business that is near 1 billion pounds, do you put the central portion of the business in the hands of someone who is learning the ropes especially when you are trying to attract customers and sponsors to your brand?
At least with the others, you know that they have experience and can go back and analyse what he has/hasn't done prior or in some examples, like Nagelsmann, he was coaching/managing the youths in the club that he was appointed in - Hoffenheim.
I get the idea behind it - they want to be progressive in their thinking, but sometimes trying to be progressive is also just plain stupid. Someone posted here that if we are languishing 4th-6th, then the empty seats will return. We may see this again next season with this sort of appointment.
It obvious come 2021 if Arteta is any kind of coach he'll replace Guardiola then. Why keep hold of him when he came go out and get some experience?
That's how other clubs currently see Arsenal.
Depressing but that may well be the case - get Arsenal back in 4th place then bugger off to City again, oh and that is "the best case scenario".
It obvious come 2021 if Arteta is any kind of coach he'll replace Guardiola then. Why keep hold of him when he came go out and get some experience?
That's how other clubs currently see Arsenal.
Depressing but that may well be the case - get Arsenal back in 4th place then bugger off to City again, oh and that is "the best case scenario".
Yeah. It's exactly like a loan deal with an inexperienced but well-regarded young player. Send him off somewhere to gain a bit of action and experience and have him back when he's learnt the ropes and you need him.
Arteta's confidence can be seen as overconfidence and conceit just as easily as ambition and confidence.
You have to be supremely sure of yourself to walk into the job at the Arsenal currently, especially with no managerial experience to back it up. The club and team is a complete mess which needs a few seasons to sort out, i have no confidence in him because i have nothing to base it on and actually shouldn't need to he should not even be considered as an option.
I find it in keeping with the current malaise surrounding the club and fans that so many people are slowly but surely coming round to Arteta being the best/only option available and so many people finding excuses to be accepting of this appointment if it happens........ for me its reminiscent of people not being able to look beyond there being any option other than Wenger for so long
If you look at the last three Arsenal managerial appointments - Graham, Rioch, Wenger - none of them were the big names that everyone craved and there were all massive 'against' arguments for all of them. Two of them hadn't managed in the top flight, whilst the other had buggered off to the sticks of Japan. All three then massively improved upon what they inherited. Arsenal have never gone for the biggest of big name managers....so I wouldn't call it the malaise at welcoming Arteta aboard.....I see it as something nobody here will know until he's taken the job. In the same way there is absolutely no castiron guarantee that Allegri would be an instant success.
What I do know is whether its Allegri, Arteta, TH14, PV4, the 30 year old German bloke or just about anyone else who has been linked with the job (apart from you Brendan Rogers), I'll just be delighted it will be someone trying something new rather than the fraudulent old dinosaur.
All very true. The thing with those appointments was that at the time you weren't paying through the nose to get in. It is all relative but back in the mid 80s it was only a few quid to get in and stand and if the team were shit it didn't feel like the fucking daylight robbery it frequently does these days. Even an all seater Highbury wasn't too much of a rip off pricewise and it was still Highbury. But if these cu.nts want to sit in their flash directors box in their (shit) shiny new stadium and charge us the fucking earth to watch a game then I think it only fair that they are expected to deliver something close to value for money. That is where their fantastic business model breaks down because they don't give a shit what they serve up and we can like it or lump it. That is why, if they choose a pliable cheap new coach, I hope it blows up in their face.
I cant believe that some fans are making that statement as a reason to support arteta's appointment
It's sticking plaster psychology, a bit like the 'careful what you wish for' analogy, it's people too terrified of real change looking for something they can cling too as a crutch, just remember who brought him to the Arsenal in the first place and it all becomes clear
I couldn't have told you that Guardiola had that side to him while he was a player though.
No one knows what Arteta is like as a manager. Why are you assuming because he's a "Wengerite" (whatever that means), that he would be powder puff as a manager? And who's to say he's a "Wengerite" anyway? Why couldn't he be a Guardiola man? Didn't he leave Wenger to go and work with Guardiola after all?
Whether he has a side to him or not remains to be seen. We don't know that. You weren't in the dressing room to see how he handled matters as a captain, so you can't assume anything based off of that either.
If Arteta had anything about him, City for sure wouldn't let him join Arsenal they would be lining him up for when Guardiola moves on, probably in 2021. How can you not see that?
Why would he wait till 2021 when he can begin his managerial career in 2018?
What if he wants the job and insists on taking it? By all accounts Pep wants him around but Arteta is keen on the job so he's having to part ways with him.
Arteta isn't a slave for City. He doesn't have to wait around for Pep to leave so he can potentially succeed him. There's a job out there waiting for him NOW and he wants to take it as well. Why on earth would he want to wait till Pep leaves (no one knows when Pep would leave anyway - just extended his contract)?
Are you looking at the whole thing from Arteta's perspective?
Arteta's confidence can be seen as overconfidence and conceit just as easily as ambition and confidence.
You have to be supremely sure of yourself to walk into the job at the Arsenal currently, especially with no managerial experience to back it up. The club and team is a complete mess which needs a few seasons to sort out, i have no confidence in him because i have nothing to base it on and actually shouldn't need to he should not even be considered as an option.
I find it in keeping with the current malaise surrounding the club and fans that so many people are slowly but surely coming round to Arteta being the best/only option available and so many people finding excuses to be accepting of this appointment if it happens........ for me its reminiscent of people not being able to look beyond there being any option other than Wenger for so long
If you look at the last three Arsenal managerial appointments - Graham, Rioch, Wenger - none of them were the big names that everyone craved and there were all massive 'against' arguments for all of them. Two of them hadn't managed in the top flight, whilst the other had buggered off to the sticks of Japan. All three then massively improved upon what they inherited. Arsenal have never gone for the biggest of big name managers....so I wouldn't call it the malaise at welcoming Arteta aboard.....I see it as something nobody here will know until he's taken the job. In the same way there is absolutely no castiron guarantee that Allegri would be an instant success.
What I do know is whether its Allegri, Arteta, TH14, PV4, the 30 year old German bloke or just about anyone else who has been linked with the job (apart from you Brendan Rogers), I'll just be delighted it will be someone trying something new rather than the fraudulent old dinosaur.
All very true. The thing with those appointments was that at the time you weren't paying through the nose to get in. It is all relative but back in the mid 80s it was only a few quid to get in and stand and if the team were shit it didn't feel like the fucking daylight robbery it frequently does these days. Even an all seater Highbury wasn't too much of a rip off pricewise and it was still Highbury. But if these cu.nts want to sit in their flash directors box in their (shit) shiny new stadium and charge us the fucking earth to watch a game then I think it only fair that they are expected to deliver something close to value for money. That is where their fantastic business model breaks down because they don't give a shit what they serve up and we can like it or lump it. That is why, if they choose a pliable cheap new coach, I hope it blows up in their face.
I couldn't have told you that Guardiola had that side to him while he was a player though.
No one knows what Arteta is like as a manager. Why are you assuming because he's a "Wengerite" (whatever that means), that he would be powder puff as a manager? And who's to say he's a "Wengerite" anyway? Why couldn't he be a Guardiola man? Didn't he leave Wenger to go and work with Guardiola after all?
Whether he has a side to him or not remains to be seen. We don't know that. You weren't in the dressing room to see how he handled matters as a captain, so you can't assume anything based off of that either.
Guardiola was a ball winner for barca for years and was then a ball winner when he went to italy - you dont play in that position in those leagues, in that era, unless you have a physical side to your game.
Anyway if you want to base your opinion on what style of manager he will be, do it by reading the interview that he gave the official club magazine a few years ago - everything he said re mentality and tactical approach screamed mini wenger to me, and he has shown absolutely zero to suggest that he is a guy to bawl the players back into line. If the citeeh players needed a bollocking, do you honestly think that pep would have delegated that task to arteta ?? You are talking about the second best team in english football history (no way are they as good as our invincibles), and a top quality player in almost every single position, and you think that arteta has had a big part to play in their dominance ? I have heard of "guilt by association" , but I dont think I have ever heard about "brilliance by association" and that is exactly the suggestion you are making here - maybe if there is something to that thought process we should go and sign their tea lady to replace ours, cos she sure as shit is as qualified to manage us as arteta currently is
I watched Guardiola play mate. He was no more a ball winner than Arteta was for us. 100%.
Since when does a player's style dictate what they would be like as managers anyway?? One of the best managers ever, Jupp Heynckes, was a bloody striker.
I've also read interviews by Arteta where he said all the right things. How he would not tolerate anything less than maximum effort, how Arsenal should never be satisfied with winning just an FA Cup etc etc. I won't read a lot into that, just as I wouldn't read a lot into any comments he made that suggest he may be a mini Wenger, as you put it.
I cant believe that some fans are making that statement as a reason to support arteta's appointment
It's sticking plaster psychology, a bit like the 'careful what you wish for' analogy, it's people too terrified of real change looking for something they can cling too as a crutch, just remember who brought him to the Arsenal in the first place and it all becomes clear
Well I would rather the unknown (Arteta) than sticking with Wenger. That's the way I rationalize it to give myself some piece of mind.
Never did I say Arteta was my choice. But if it's him or Wenger, then him all day long.
Arteta's confidence can be seen as overconfidence and conceit just as easily as ambition and confidence.
You have to be supremely sure of yourself to walk into the job at the Arsenal currently, especially with no managerial experience to back it up. The club and team is a complete mess which needs a few seasons to sort out, i have no confidence in him because i have nothing to base it on and actually shouldn't need to he should not even be considered as an option.
I find it in keeping with the current malaise surrounding the club and fans that so many people are slowly but surely coming round to Arteta being the best/only option available and so many people finding excuses to be accepting of this appointment if it happens........ for me its reminiscent of people not being able to look beyond there being any option other than Wenger for so long
If you look at the last three Arsenal managerial appointments - Graham, Rioch, Wenger - none of them were the big names that everyone craved and there were all massive 'against' arguments for all of them. Two of them hadn't managed in the top flight, whilst the other had buggered off to the sticks of Japan. All three then massively improved upon what they inherited. Arsenal have never gone for the biggest of big name managers....so I wouldn't call it the malaise at welcoming Arteta aboard.....I see it as something nobody here will know until he's taken the job. In the same way there is absolutely no castiron guarantee that Allegri would be an instant success.
What I do know is whether its Allegri, Arteta, TH14, PV4, the 30 year old German bloke or just about anyone else who has been linked with the job (apart from you Brendan Rogers), I'll just be delighted it will be someone trying something new rather than the fraudulent old dinosaur.
All very true. The thing with those appointments was that at the time you weren't paying through the nose to get in. It is all relative but back in the mid 80s it was only a few quid to get in and stand and if the team were shit it didn't feel like the fucking daylight robbery it frequently does these days. Even an all seater Highbury wasn't too much of a rip off pricewise and it was still Highbury. But if these cu.nts want to sit in their flash directors box in their (shit) shiny new stadium and charge us the fucking earth to watch a game then I think it only fair that they are expected to deliver something close to value for money. That is where their fantastic business model breaks down because they don't give a shit what they serve up and we can like it or lump it. That is why, if they choose a pliable cheap new coach, I hope it blows up in their face.
I get the financial argument and I am not being disrespectful to those who pay through the nose to go week after week, but I do feel that this is a seperate argument and bringing money into it only clouds the issue and helps distract people from the real issue. The focus should 100% be on the fact that it is looking like we are on the verge of appointing a rookie manager at a team where we need a really experienced one. Whether tickets are priced at £1 each or £100 each does not change the fact that we are about to make THE most bizzare and ridiculous managerial appointment in english football history, and that should in my opinion be the only argument we should be making right now - the motives for the decision are irrelevent because there can be no justifiable reason why a club of our stature, in the mess that we are in, would give the job to a guy that hasnt been a manager for even one day in his whole life
We are now going from mr 30 years to mr not even 30 seconds
. In a lot of ways managing in the lower leagues or a mid-table or bottom half premier league club, would be an advantage here given the quality of the squad he is walking in to - arteta will be coming from a squad overflowing with top quality players everywhere, and that will be a huge change when he walks into a squad overloaded with average players, and arteta has no experience or evidence to suggest that he can improve them or make the team better than the individual parts. 
